Colorado Constituents Recalling (2) State Senators for Gun Control Vote

[ElectionsGuy]

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Sounds like the people are mad that the Colorado state government is taking away their liberty little by little. I would be mad too if this was my state government.

John Morse's Colorado Springs based district is a toss-up. Colorado Springs as a city itself leans republican, but his district is centrally based in the more democratic parts of the city. Angela Giron on the other hand has a Pueblo based district which leans democratic. If I had to guess I would say Morse would narrowly win and Giron would win as well, but both races should be close however.

Last of all, I just want to say this is somewhat like the North Carolina case and their state government, just not as extreme in this case. More or less, I would just send a message to Colorado democrats to not push through bills and regulations that many if not most people don't want, your state isn't California or Rhode Island. And just a message to everybody that one-party rule in swing states does result in bad policies for both sides. Republicans have just been more prone to it lately in North Carolina, Ohio, Wisconsin, Virginia, Pennsylvania, and whatever other states republicans have control of that aren't at least likely republican states in federal elections. Colorado happens to be a battleground state under almost complete democratic control.

Discuss your opinions below.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

I'm not certain if I'd vote for or against these two Senators in a regular election, but I certainly would vote to oppose their recall. This is not what recall elections were made for.  If you want politicians to fave the voters more often, then shorten their terms.

[Indy Texas]

I agree that it seems to be overreach on the part of the Democrats. However, if the Republican Party in that state was not as equally out of step (trying to be a "Praise the Lord, save the fetuses and kick out the Mexicans" party in a state where that doesn't fly anymore), they would likely be more afraid of electoral consequences in regularly scheduled elections, as opposed to merely low-turnout special elections.

[publicunofficial]

I'm not certain if I'd vote for or against these two Senators in a regular election, but I certainly would vote to oppose their recall. This is not what recall elections were made for.  If you want politicians to fave the voters more often, then shorten their terms.

Colorado already has term limits. Morse himself is term-limited, which makes the recall even dumber.

Recalls should only happen when a politician is corrupt or completely inept. They shouldn't be used just because they support a position that you don't.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

I'm not certain if I'd vote for or against these two Senators in a regular election, but I certainly would vote to oppose their recall. This is not what recall elections were made for.  If you want politicians to fave the voters more often, then shorten their terms.

Colorado already has term limits. Morse himself is term-limited, which makes the recall even dumber.

Recalls should only happen when a politician is corrupt or completely inept. They shouldn't be used just because they support a position that you don't.

You mistake my meaning.  When I said shorten terms, I meant the length of each term, not the maximum length of all the terms an legislator could serve.  There's no reason the Colorado House couldn't be elected every year and the Senate every other year instead of two and four years as is the case now.

[AkSaber]

I'm not certain if I'd vote for or against these two Senators in a regular election, but I certainly would vote to oppose their recall. This is not what recall elections were made for.  If you want politicians to fave the voters more often, then shorten their terms.

Colorado already has term limits. Morse himself is term-limited, which makes the recall even dumber.

Recalls should only happen when a politician is corrupt or completely inept. They shouldn't be used just because they support a position that you don't.

What about Wisconsin a year ago?

[publicunofficial]

I'm not certain if I'd vote for or against these two Senators in a regular election, but I certainly would vote to oppose their recall. This is not what recall elections were made for.  If you want politicians to fave the voters more often, then shorten their terms.

Colorado already has term limits. Morse himself is term-limited, which makes the recall even dumber.

Recalls should only happen when a politician is corrupt or completely inept. They shouldn't be used just because they support a position that you don't.

What about Wisconsin a year ago?

I hate Scott Walker and everything he's done, but the recall attempt was stupid. Walker did what he was elected to do, and all the anger that came from that should've been saved until November 2014.

[Gass3268]

Currently Democrats are outvoting Republicans 3-1 in early voting in the recall election of state Sen. Angela Giron, D-Pueblo.

http://www.chieftain.com/news/breaking/1809914-120/election-voters-voting-pueblo

[Devils30]

On the daily kos site the districts both look like theyre D+8 or around that. Would be quite shocked if either lost.

[publicunofficial]

On the daily kos site the districts both look like theyre D+8 or around that. Would be quite shocked if either lost.

I could see them losing simply due frenzied NRA members being the only people who care enough to come out and vote.

I'd bet money that they both survive however.

[PJ]

Absolutely ridiculous reason to recall someone.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

More or less, I would just send a message to Colorado democrats to not push through bills and regulations that many if not most people don't want, your state isn't California or Rhode Island. And just a message to everybody that one-party rule in swing states does result in bad policies for both sides.

The Quinnipiac poll you mentioned doesn't ask about the gun law specifically. Here's the text:

"Do you approve or disapprove of the way John Hickenlooper is handling - gun policy?"

That says nothing about the individual law. To know what Colorado thinks about the laws, you actually need to ask them about the laws. And hey, here's a Denver Post poll about exactly that.

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_22411498/poll-gun-legislation-coloradans-views-change-since-september

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My lesson to you is: Don't oppose gun control measures that most Coloradans want.

[ElectionsGuy]

More or less, I would just send a message to Colorado democrats to not push through bills and regulations that many if not most people don't want, your state isn't California or Rhode Island. And just a message to everybody that one-party rule in swing states does result in bad policies for both sides.

The Quinnipiac poll you mentioned doesn't ask about the gun law specifically. Here's the text:

"Do you approve or disapprove of the way John Hickenlooper is handling - gun policy?"

That says nothing about the individual law. To know what Colorado thinks about the laws, you actually need to ask them about the laws. And hey, here's a Denver Post poll about exactly that.

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_22411498/poll-gun-legislation-coloradans-views-change-since-september

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My lesson to you is: Don't oppose gun control measures that most Coloradans want.

First of all, the majority of Coloradans do not support gun bans and limitations flat out. In the polls conducted in the Denver paper that you provided, 50% want to protect the right to own, while 45% want to control ownership. Also, 56% want stricter enforcement of existing laws, while just 35% want to pass stricter gun-control laws. Pretty conservative considering 57% of people in the poll don't have guns.

Second, I said many if not most, not most. I wouldn't think that a majority of people approve of gun regulations and laws to limit gun use in a state as purple as Colorado, but I could be wrong. If I missed any details here or am inaccurate here let me know.

[Meeker]

I think both recall efforts will probably be unsuccessful (these are fairly Democratic districts), but the voting system by which these elections are being conducted is horrendous. You can request an absentee ballot, but if you've already registered as a permanent absentee voter you have to re-request to get an absentee ballot for this specific election. There are also no neighborhood precinct polling places; you can only vote in person at a "voting center".

[Zioneer]

The silliest thing about these recalls is that isn't John Morse term-limited and out by next year anyway?

[Gass3268]

Oh look, anti-Semitism:

http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/09/09/colorado-newspaper-runs-pro-gun-groups-anti-sem/195779

[Kevinstat]

Are the elections being held under the 2010 lines (which these two Senators were last elected from) or the new lines (which Senators will be elected from in 2014 and which I assume half of the members of the Colorado Senate were elected from in 2012)?  I'm not sure how much the lines are different.

[Kevinstat]

Are the elections being held under the 2010 lines (which these two Senators were last elected from) or the new lines (which Senators will be elected from in 2014 and which I assume half of the members of the Colorado Senate were elected from in 2012)?  I'm not sure how much the lines are different.

I answered my own question with like 95% certainty.  I'm pretty sure the new lines will be used, which I'd say makes sense since already about half the Senators represent the new districts.  See http://www.krdo.com/news/frequently-asked-questions-morse-giron-recall-elections/-/417220/21805222/-/s15jrs/-/index.html and then click on the "Senate District 11" link (the resulting PDF has a caption that reads "Prepared by the Reapportionment Commission Staff [new line] December 2011").  I would assume the same vintage lines would be used in Senate District 3.  The pro-recall of John Morse site gotremorse.com (cute) also states, "Due to recent gerrymandering changes to the Senate districts, some people are no longer certain what district they may currently reside in."  There's no specific mention of the lines being different from either the last State Senate election in that district or the next one, but the implication is that the lines used in the recall will be different from those used in 2010 (so likely the same as those used in 2014).

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Oh look, anti-Semitism:

http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/09/09/colorado-newspaper-runs-pro-gun-groups-anti-sem/195779

One doesn't have to be anti-Semitic to despise billionaire Bloomberg.To attribute Bloomberg bashing to anti-Semitism without even a shred of evidence that was the reason is lazy self-victimization.  If there is any evidence of that, it wasn't given in the link.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

Also, 56% want stricter enforcement of existing laws, while just 35% want to pass stricter gun-control laws. Pretty conservative considering 57% of people in the poll don't have guns.

Just to reiterate what I said in the last post: General and generic gun control polls are absolutely useless when there are more specific polls available on individual issues. Do you know the specific gun control laws of your state that are already on the books? Can you expect the average resident of Colorado to do the same? If not, how the hell are you supposed to answer a question about whether they're adequate?

Stricter enforcement of existing laws is not mutually exclusive with passing a universal background check bill. It's a false choice. I want both.

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I'm in favor of both of those generic concepts. I support the Second Amendment right of Americans to own and bear arms, but I also want to control ownership to make sure that people convicted of violent offenses are not able to purchase them. And while I support ownership of many (most?) guns currently available for sale (hunting rifles, handguns, antiques, etc.), I do not believe the average U.S. citizen should be able to buy a semi-automatic, a rocket launcher, a tank, or a nuclear missile.

How should I answer that poll question?

[Miles]

Republicans in Morse's district are up in early voting. Only 26% of the district's voters are registered Republicans, but they account for 41% of early ballots.

[Badger]

Apparently Hickenlooper didn't realize that his elections bill enables cheating.

Yet another uber-selective misreading of the article. Some far-right libertard activist from Boulder says he can vote in Colorado Springs by registering a hotel room, but the GOP SoS office's published interpretation of the law indicates no he can't.

Wise choice for the dude to leave his ballot blank. For a guy who supposedly believed the law was so full of holes, he sure wasn't willing to test that theory for real.

[Badger]

Republicans in Morse's district are up in early voting. Only 26% of the district's voters are registered Republicans, but they account for 41% of early ballots.

Based on this and the district's voing history, Morse is likely toast. Conversely, Giron should be safe.

[free my dawg]

Apparently Hickenlooper didn't realize that his elections bill enables cheating.

Yet another uber-selective misreading of the article. Some far-right libertard activist from Boulder says he can vote in Colorado Springs by registering a hotel room, but the GOP SoS office's published interpretation of the law indicates no he can't.

Wise choice for the dude to leave his ballot blank. For a guy who supposedly believed the law was so full of holes, he sure wasn't willing to test that theory for real.

That merely states that he is an honest good man and not an unscrupulous cheater.

The thoroughly amusing thing is that even if he or anyone else is convicted of cheating, the vote still counts. Imagine that!

With 45% in Morse is losing his recall.

Good to hear. Morse trying to undermine the pot referendum was disgraceful. Won't miss him at all.

[Miles]

Excellent news!

These liberals will get a good thrashing because they didn't follow the will of the people! Huzzah!