The most honest discussion about race relations ever

[Reaganfan]

I was applauding. ABSOLUTELY BEAUTIFUL!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wj4JaCSbhFY

This is EXACTLY what must be done. We have to work together.

[All Along The Watchtower]

spoiler alert: Bill ORLY

[Reaganfan]

But here is the headline: young black men commit homicides at a rate 10 times greater than whites and Hispanics combined. When presented with damning evidence like that, and like the mini-holocaust in Chicago where hundreds of African-Americans are murdered each year the civil rights industry looks the other way or makes excuses. They blame guns, poor education, lack of jobs, rarely do they define the problem accurately. So here it is. The reason there is so much violence and chaos in the black precincts is the disintegration of the African-American family.

Right now about 73 percent of all black babies are born out of wedlock. That drives poverty. And the lack of involved fathers leads to young boys growing up resentful and unsupervised. When was the last time you saw a public service ad telling young black girls to avoid becoming pregnant? Has President Obama done such an ad? How about Jackson or Sharpton? Has the Congressional Black Caucus demanded an ad like that? How about the PC pundits who work for NBC News?

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/oreilly/2013/07/23/bill-oreilly-president-obama-and-race-problem#ixzz2Zw54rk9e

Those are FACTS.

[ElectionsGuy]

Thank god SOMEONE isn't afraid to address this, we need solutions not blame.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Right now about 73 percent of all black babies are born out of wedlock. That drives poverty. And the lack of involved fathers leads to young boys growing up resentful and unsupervised. When was the last time you saw a public service ad telling young black girls to avoid becoming pregnant? Has President Obama done such an ad? How about Jackson or Sharpton? Has the Congressional Black Caucus demanded an ad like that? How about the PC pundits who work for NBC News?

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/oreilly/2013/07/23/bill-oreilly-president-obama-and-race-problem#ixzz2Zw54rk9e

Those are FACTS.

So you are pro-choice now?

[Reaganfan]

See what's happening here? You immediately change the subject to abortion?

Can you liberals please answer a question for me? I ask this seriously and sincerely. When the factual statistics show out of wedlock birth rates and black murder rates abnormally high, why do blacks and liberals get so defensive when someone comes along to try and ask why it's not addressed more? Hell, the only prominent African American to address it is Bill Cosby and African Americans and liberals roll their eyes and get mad. I highly doubt Bill Cosby is racist. I KNOW Bill Cosby isn't a Republican. So why get defensive? Do liberals and African Americans want high murder rates and 73% out of wedlock births? I don't believe so. Then why the anger?

[badgate]

He didn't change the subject. The two are fluid and connected, and you're not stupid enough for that to go over your head.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Because a) your phrase "someone comes along to try" implies that these people, usually Republicans like you, think they've just discovered the problem which is straight up annoying, and b) Republicans always oppose the solutions that liberals have already proposed.

[Reaganfan]

He didn't change the subject. The two are fluid and connected, and you're not stupid enough for that to go over your head.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Because a) your phrase "someone comes along to try" implies that these people, usually Republicans like you, think they've just discovered the problem which is straight up annoying, and b) Republicans always oppose the solutions that liberals have already proposed.

The reason they oppose it is because it doesn't work. Trust me. I've seen it first hand. I used to enjoy going to certain restaurants and businesses in Cleveland as a kid in the 1990s, I used to go to a certain mall just outside of Cleveland. They're all gone. Not because of white men and corporations, not because of "unfairness" or "inequality" but because consumers don't want to take their business into a neighborhood where bullets are gonna whiz by their head! When you say that, you're called a racist. Why? I didn't say what color the person shooting the gun was. Inner city-Chicago, a slum cesspool...controlled by Democrats. Cleveland...controlled by Democrats. Detroit, now a nationwide eyesore, DEMOCRATS. Washington, D.C. re-elected a mayor who had been arrested by the FBI for buying crack. Need I remind you what party he was in?

Give me a damn break.

[badgate]

I rescind my "stupid enough" comment.

[Gass3268]

So Billo the Clown is a racist, what's new?

[Landslide Lyndon]

I ask this seriously and sincerely.

You know what, yegg? I believe you.

[Ban my account ffs!]

The problem Naso is that you're identifying a problem that has a cause itself... and you suggest a fix to the problem without looking at the cause.

What tears apart black families?  Poverty and lack of educational and financial betterment opportunities.

And what do torn apart families beget?  Even more poverty.

The answer isn't simply public services announcements about not getting pregnant or 'dealing with it' and forcing families back together.

The answer is to support both intact families AND torn apart families so that all have the opportunity to get out of the poverty trap.

One potential solution is by making some very tough decisions on reform in inner city or rural black belt schools (and this reform does not include gutting teachers' salaries, busting unions, or taking away drinking fountains)... this includes spending large amounts of money to hire people to keep kids occupied until such a time in the evening they can return home to a house with a parent in it.

What do poor black kids with single parents need?  STRUCTURE.  A loving, nuclear family isn't an option for most of these kids anymore.  So we have to help provide structure in a different way.  School is a great way to do this.  Longer school days, longer school years.. before and after school programs that are well funded and staffed by well trained people.

We also need to allow single parents to provide for their families and still afford them time to be at home WITH their children.  This is going to take welfare.  Oh, I know.. evil evil welfare... but if you set up the system right, you can make it effective without pulling people into the dependency trap.  For example, you could tie the welfare payments to the number of hours worked at any job up to, say, 30 hours a week.  Most single parents can work 30 hours a week and still have plenty of time at home with the kids.

So if a single black mother gets a job at McDonalds... making $8.50/hour.. but the government says "here.. we'll give you another $6/hour for each hour you work up to 30 hours/week"... then that becomes more livable while encouraging people to have stable employment.

For the unemployed, benefits should wind down slowly over time to provide incentive to get work... with a loophole for emergencies and times of national economic duress that results in jobs being very hard to find.

The other angle is that we need to reform our prison system.  Get the non-violent offenders out.  Set up programs for ex-prisoners to find work and enact legislation like "ban the box" so felons can have a chance at a face to face interview before you turn them down for being a felon.

This isn't going to be anything other than extremely messy, expensive, and difficult to do.  But it won't be much more expensive than housing, feeding, and locking up a massive population of people who shouldn't be locked up.

It will take a generation to see really great results from this kind of reform.. but you would begin to see positive results immediately.

And yes, public service announcements informing young women about the drawbacks of young pregnancies and having children at a young age SHOULD be a part of this solution.

Black men murdering others at such a high rate is not a root cause.. it is a symptom of the poverty trap with many layers of complex missteps behind it.  We've tried the tough love, lock 'em up approach.  It failed spectacularly.

It's time to throw money and resources and our hearts and goodwill at the issue.  And it's time for all Americans to say to the African American community "we're here to support you.  It's time you guys were invited to the party."

[Indy Texas]

See what's happening here? You immediately change the subject to abortion?

Can you liberals please answer a question for me? I ask this seriously and sincerely. When the factual statistics show out of wedlock birth rates and black murder rates abnormally high, why do blacks and liberals get so defensive when someone comes along to try and ask why it's not addressed more? Hell, the only prominent African American to address it is Bill Cosby and African Americans and liberals roll their eyes and get mad. I highly doubt Bill Cosby is racist. I KNOW Bill Cosby isn't a Republican. So why get defensive? Do liberals and African Americans want high murder rates and 73% out of wedlock births? I don't believe so. Then why the anger?

More than 90% of Americans - of all races - have sex before marriage. The reason teen pregnancy rates are lower at rich white high schools is because those girls have the money and the means to purchase birth control pills (and have a "procedure" done should it come to that) and the girls in the ghetto high schools don't.

Please stop acting as though "they" make bad choices and that's why they're not as well-off as we good, virtuous white folk. When we slip up, we have a lot more breaking our fall than they do. And by dismantling the family planning components of our public health system piece by piece, people like you want to make sure they fall as hard as possible.

[Cory]

To be fair though black people as a whole do need to get their sh**t together. Black "urban" culture has as much to do with their decline as economic policy. It literally glorifies being stupid and a criminal and demonizes being smart as "acting white".

[dead0man]

<puts on the moderate hero hat>

I agree with everybody.  I agree with ReaganFan, Electionguy and Cory that black dudes need to stop killing each other and they should either stop getting everybody pregnant or at least support the ones they do.  I agree with ProgRealist in that sheesh, are we really going to listen to O'Riley!?  I agree with jfern, Badgate and Snowguy that we could probably use some more abortion.  I agree with px, Reaganfan is honestly concerned with the problem.  I agree with Snowguy (to a point) that poverty is a key factor in black men killing each other and being sh**tty fathers (that one is more of a stretch, but whatever).  We should help single mothers out more, ESPECIALLY those that can maintain a job.  Better/more after and before school programs in the inner city could help a great deal and if done right, won't cost THAT much.  We certainly need to put less (no) drug users in jail regardless of race.  I don't think it has to be all that expensive though, but I do agree that even if it is expensive, it's still likely better than the sh**tty situation many black children find themselves in today.  And I agree with TexasIndy that birth control should be free/highly subsidized for anybody that wants it.  And finally, I agree with Cory that "urban culture" is a large part of the problem.

</hat>

There is no easy fix, there is no cheap fix, but first, the problem has to be acknowledged by the people most affected by it, until then, it doesn't matter how much money we throw at or how many pot/crack heads we throw out of prison nothing is going to change.  And it would also help if white people can discuss the problem without being instantly looked at as a racist.  Saying "there is a problem in the urban black community" isn't a racist phrase, it's a fact.  Calling somebody a racist for saying a fact is stupid.  They may in fact be a racist, but you're not going to be able to tell by that phrase.  There is a problem in the urban black community and thinking "whitey" or "the man"* is what's causing it is ignorant and gives the people with a problem an excuse.  They get to feel like the victim and can, with a clean conscious, blame other people for their missfortune.  That's not going to help anybody.



*and that's not to say nobody gets screwed over by "the man", of course people do.  Some people really are the victim.  But the majority of fuck ups of any race are fuck ups because of their own actions and choices.

[DC Al Fine]

As others have said, blacks are economically benighted and their culture is sick. Solutions need to be found for both these problems. Two incomes from an intact family will do more than the EITC. Likewise families will still struggle if they don't have an opportunity to lift themselves out of poverty. Here is a modest program:

Snowguy had some good ideas on the fiscal side, but the difficult part will be fixing the culture. Here are some things that would help.

1) Lower out of wedlock birthrate
2) Lower divorce rate
3) A pro-education culture
4) Less blaming racism (this is less about racism and more about believing you have control over your destiny)
5) Stronger institutions (church, rotary clubs etc.)

The problem is how do we go about making the cultural change? It's fairly easy to do with your own children, but much more difficult to do on a macro level with government policy.

[Brittain33]

spoiler alert: Bill ORLY

Thank you.

[The Free North]

So Billo the Clown is a racist, what's new?

Did you even watch what he said? Of course not because youre a moron who likes throwing around the word racist because it requires no intellectual thought or critical thinking. I dont agree with all of what O'reilly said, I think he's dead wrong on the entertainment aspect of it, and wrong on marijuana policy, but otherwise, he's 100% correct.

Whats so racist of admitting, like he said, that young black males commit homicide 10x more than whites and hispanics COMBINED? Whats so racist about the fact that single households are destroying the black community? There is no racism, only facts that you dont like.

[memphis]

Somehow, white people manage to grow up in dysfunctional/non-existant families without the sky high murder rate. Also, black people are all about church. On average, much more so than white people. Murder rates have plummeted in recent decades without a change in either of those factors. Try again.

[Bleach Blonde Bad Built Butch Bodies for Biden]

I agree that acknowledging that the black community is faced with a lot of problems isn't racist, but the Bell Curve/Charles Murray rhetoric that is often pushed by the right, often subtly, definitely is.  Also, it would do us a lot of good to remember who's responsible for the current state of the black community, in the first place.

[The Free North]

The problem Naso is that you're identifying a problem that has a cause itself... and you suggest a fix to the problem without looking at the cause.

What tears apart black families?  Poverty and lack of educational and financial betterment opportunities.

And what do torn apart families beget?  Even more poverty.

The answer isn't simply public services announcements about not getting pregnant or 'dealing with it' and forcing families back together.

The answer is to support both intact families AND torn apart families so that all have the opportunity to get out of the poverty trap.

One potential solution is by making some very tough decisions on reform in inner city or rural black belt schools (and this reform does not include gutting teachers' salaries, busting unions, or taking away drinking fountains)... this includes spending large amounts of money to hire people to keep kids occupied until such a time in the evening they can return home to a house with a parent in it.

What do poor black kids with single parents need?  STRUCTURE.  A loving, nuclear family isn't an option for most of these kids anymore.  So we have to help provide structure in a different way.  School is a great way to do this.  Longer school days, longer school years.. before and after school programs that are well funded and staffed by well trained people.

We also need to allow single parents to provide for their families and still afford them time to be at home WITH their children.  This is going to take welfare.  Oh, I know.. evil evil welfare... but if you set up the system right, you can make it effective without pulling people into the dependency trap.  For example, you could tie the welfare payments to the number of hours worked at any job up to, say, 30 hours a week.  Most single parents can work 30 hours a week and still have plenty of time at home with the kids.

So if a single black mother gets a job at McDonalds... making $8.50/hour.. but the government says "here.. we'll give you another $6/hour for each hour you work up to 30 hours/week"... then that becomes more livable while encouraging people to have stable employment.

For the unemployed, benefits should wind down slowly over time to provide incentive to get work... with a loophole for emergencies and times of national economic duress that results in jobs being very hard to find.

The other angle is that we need to reform our prison system.  Get the non-violent offenders out.  Set up programs for ex-prisoners to find work and enact legislation like "ban the box" so felons can have a chance at a face to face interview before you turn them down for being a felon.

This isn't going to be anything other than extremely messy, expensive, and difficult to do.  But it won't be much more expensive than housing, feeding, and locking up a massive population of people who shouldn't be locked up.

It will take a generation to see really great results from this kind of reform.. but you would begin to see positive results immediately.

And yes, public service announcements informing young women about the drawbacks of young pregnancies and having children at a young age SHOULD be a part of this solution.

Black men murdering others at such a high rate is not a root cause.. it is a symptom of the poverty trap with many layers of complex missteps behind it.  We've tried the tough love, lock 'em up approach.  It failed spectacularly.

It's time to throw money and resources and our hearts and goodwill at the issue.  And it's time for all Americans to say to the African American community "we're here to support you.  It's time you guys were invited to the party."

Very good post, I agree with a lot of what you said here. Let me add a few thoughts on education here because I was too mad at the last clown to put it in my previous post.

I truly believe, all factors aside, that a better emphasis on education will solve a ton of problems. Education not only will lead to better jobs, but it keeps kids off the streets, keeps them committed to something positive, and can help revitalize communities. I read the other day that 60% of Detroit is functionally illiterate, THAT is what is destroying so many households across the country. That is what leads to single parent homes and crime.

So how do we fix it? Funding education is an obvious answer, but that only goes so far. I think, at some level, we need to return power of the public schools back to the communities that they serve, funding would still come from outside sources, but giving people power over their own schools and teachers is a much better way to handle things at a local level. In terms of sources for funding, we could easily take all the money we use to run the friggin world and put that back into some inner city systems.

Secondly, and perhaps most importantly, the drive has to be there form the kids. If we spend 50,000 per kid, its not going to matter if the kid doesnt care and skips most of his classes. Look at the asian american community. Why are there graduation rates so much higher, their jobs so much better, and their income, generally, higher than the African American communities? Its not because of some inherent difference between the two, but that asian american families stress the values of education much much more than other communities. Education, must be taught as something that is both valuable and indispensable to all children, or else were doomed to see the cycle of poverty repeating itself.

Welfare and such are great for temporary fixes, but to truly break out of poverty, these kids need to understand the value of education, and be able to take advantage of improved resources that they (hopefully) get soon in the future.

[Brittain33]

There's a hell of a lot of truthiness in this thread.

[Paul Kemp]

Where's the "discussion" in that video? It's one guy from one race, which happens to be the opposite one, reading his talking points.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

It's hilarious how Bill O'Reilly talks about "resentment for past injury" and "the sins of the past" as if black people are suddenly being treated as equals by the public today and are simply upset at the way things used to be.

I mean, come on black people! Move on already! We don't even have slavery anymore. Can't you see how uncomfortable talking about you all us white people are?

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

Poverty can have an impact on out-of-wedlock births, and for reasons other than just access to birth control  (for those who think the answer is more abortions, how high an abortion rate do you want?  70% of pregnancies?  80%?  it's already extremely high for African-Americans, esp. among the urban poor.).  At the same time, out-of-wedlock births have increased greatly over the past 50 years even though the percentage of blacks in poverty is lower than it once was.  In the 1960s, Moynihan was sounding the alarm for out-of-wedlock births that were climbing among blacks as the disintegration of the black family, at a rate that is close to the current rate for whites.  The mere fact of poverty, at least as defined in financial terms, can only take so much of the blame for kids growing up without intact families.