Why the Democrats Still Need Working-Class White Voters

[Torie]

Because that is the math, even as the nation becomes less white. Why? Because there are still a lot of whites, and more of them are working class than you think. The nation overall is just not like Orange County, CA, or San Francisco, or Manhattan, or San Jose, etc.  It is more like Winchester, Virginia in fact, when it comes to working class whites. Working class whites ("WCW's") don't like big cities much anymore.

How can the Dems seal the deal?  The author says the old fashioned way, by the Dems returning to their roots and becoming the friends and neighbors of WCW's once again (and although the author does not say this, getting outside of their urban satrapies). It seems a bit of a buggy whip solution to me. Plus, the Dems don't want to live in Winchester. They don't live the lives of working class whites - and don't want to. They don't hunt. They don't really like to go to church that much although they may say they are religious. And just how often do you see them at High School football games? No, the Dems, and those who aspire to lead them,  want as it were to live in places like Whittier and Como in Minneapolis, to pick two hoods at random, not, and watch independent films.

So, for the moment, given the shape of the two competing coalitions, and unless the Dems get down and dirty in Winchester, the Pubs will tend to have the advantage in off year elections, and the Dems in POTUS elections, when persons of color, and youngs find the time to put down their bongs, and go out and vote in a way they don't in off year elections, which tend to be boring provincial affairs that seem sort of meaningless to them.

[7,052,770]

You lost me when you said Democrats don't like high school football...

[badgate]

I don't mind HS football; what I mind is the coach being the highest paid teacher in the school.

[publicunofficial]

I remember seeing a poll showing that Friday Night Lights was one of the most popular shows among self-identified liberals back when it was on the air.

[memphis]

This has all the insight of a David Brooks column. Obviously, it's not binary. Outside of the Deep South, neither party is winning overwhelming majorities of these folks. Torie is starting out with the GOP fantasy that most Democrats live in Pacific Heights and the Upper West Side, which is beyond asinine to anybody who has ever left California or New York. FWIW, I've been to Winchester, VA. It's really not in any way average. It has a decent sized and pretty old town that is far older than anything in my part of the country. Most of us don't live in cute little historic towns. But more importantly, Obama won it. Twice. Unlike Orange County, CA, which Obama lost. Twice. I may as well write an article saying that the Republican have to win more votes than just oil execs who hate mothers and apple pie. The strawman is so absurd and self evident that it's hardly worth refuting.

[Torie]

Actually I mentioned Whittier and Como memphis. My text is a big more subtle than the strawman you created, and then beat up, and then incinerated the ensuing mayhem of straw.

[memphis]

Actually I mentioned Whittier and Como memphis. My text is a big more subtle than the strawman you created, and then beat up, and incinerated the ensuing mayhem of straw.

Your whole point seems to be that Dems can't win without at least some working class white people. Ignoring the implication that Dems do better among the well off, which is factually incorrect, that doesn't strike you as blindingly obvious? I think you need to meet more working class people. Don't you have a farm in Iowa? How did that state vote, again?

[perdedor]

What should Democrats be doing to further earn the middle-income white vote? Austerity is unpopular (and lost the 2012) because it most adversely effects the voters you're referring to. That bomb is the GOP's lap -- even if the benefactor is as much a Wall St. swindle as is fathomable.

Absent of any consideration of principle and consequences, all of the cultural momentum is with the Democrats.

[Torie]

Actually I mentioned Whittier and Como memphis. My text is a big more subtle than the strawman you created, and then beat up, and incinerated the ensuing mayhem of straw.

Your whole point seems to be that Dems can't win without at least some working class white people. Ignoring the implication that Dems do better among the well off, which is factually incorrect, that doesn't strike you as blindingly obvious? I think you need to meet more working class people. Don't you have a farm in Iowa? How did that state vote, again?

You didn't understand my point (nor perhaps the point of the article itself), and I said nothing about non working class white people to boot.

[memphis]

Actually I mentioned Whittier and Como memphis. My text is a big more subtle than the strawman you created, and then beat up, and incinerated the ensuing mayhem of straw.

Your whole point seems to be that Dems can't win without at least some working class white people. Ignoring the implication that Dems do better among the well off, which is factually incorrect, that doesn't strike you as blindingly obvious? I think you need to meet more working class people. Don't you have a farm in Iowa? How did that state vote, again?

You didn't understand my point (nor perhaps the point of the article itself), and I said nothing about non working class white people to boot.

What is your point if not that the Dems need some level of support among working class white people? You're presenting a stereotype of the Obama voter that is not accurate. Republicans do this constantly, in order to drive a wedge between "regular folks" and "them." It's so 20th century. We were supposedly the party of long hairs, welfare queens, and amnesty for Vietnam draft dodgers. With a minor tweak, the Democrats became people who like Starbucks. It's a supremely asinine and petty way to run a political party, and it's not even all that effective anymore. Because the GOP was so successful in running those types of campaigns, people today are more concerned about foreclosure than what the neighbor is smoking or who he's screwing. Bring back defined benefit pensions and people might give a crap about "them" again. In any case, you've already driven off every white person who ever cared about those things. And it's a huge reason why Republicans don't appeal to young people either. The people who grew up when respectable people cared about those things are assuming room temperature very quickly.

[Torie]

Sigh.

[Link]

Torie you need to read your article.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

He uses a mid term election during a tough economic time as his worst case scenario.  Parties in power lose midterms all the time.  It is the norm.  I would not use it to extrapolate presidential elections.

And I don't think anyone on this forum or beyond thinks the Democratic party can jettison white working class voters.  That's absurd.  Why do you think Dems are so chummy with unions?  Only getting 40% of that vote is an electoral drubbing, but even your article states 40% almost ensures a perpetual lock on the White House.

The rich or upper class are by definition a small minority.  I don't think anyone in the Democratic coalition would swap all the white working class voters for a handful of latte sippers.  Democrats can do math.  Obama isn't running the United States like Vermont.  Anyone that has paid attention to Obama's track record and been to Vermont wouldn't confuse the two.

[Lief 🗽]

The Democrats already win plenty of white working-class voters (in the non-racist parts of the country). And they of course win 70-80% of non-white working class voters.

[DC Al Fine]

Torie you need to read your article.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

He uses a mid term election during a tough economic time as his worst case scenario.  Parties in power lose midterms all the time.  It is the norm.  I would not use it to extrapolate presidential elections.

And I don't think anyone on this forum or beyond thinks the Democratic party can jettison white working class voters.  That's absurd.  Why do you think Dems are so chummy with unions?  Only getting 40% of that vote is an electoral drubbing, but even your article states 40% almost ensures a perpetual lock on the White House.

That still shows an issue with working class whites. What % of working class whites are in unions compared to earlier eras? The non-union working class white voter has a different set of concerns from the unionised one; a set of concerns that the Democrats may have trouble addressing.

[Torie]

Torie you need to read your article.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

He uses a mid term election during a tough economic time as his worst case scenario.  Parties in power lose midterms all the time.  It is the norm.  I would not use it to extrapolate presidential elections.

And I don't think anyone on this forum or beyond thinks the Democratic party can jettison white working class voters.  That's absurd.  Why do you think Dems are so chummy with unions?  Only getting 40% of that vote is an electoral drubbing, but even your article states 40% almost ensures a perpetual lock on the White House.

The rich or upper class are by definition a small minority.  I don't think anyone in the Democratic coalition would swap all the white working class voters for a handful of latte sippers.  Democrats can do math.  Obama isn't running the United States like Vermont.  Anyone that has paid attention to Obama's track record and been to Vermont wouldn't confuse the two.

Yes, and the point, is that if the Dems can get a tad more of the white working class vote, then they will be able to trump the Pubs in off year elections, even if their person of color and youngs base turnout falls off in off year elections. But absent that, off year elections remain a problem for the Dems all things being equal at this point.

And yes, for POTUS elections, the Pubs are indeed in deep trouble, if they cannot evolve to become competitive again. And their performance in big metro areas among non working class whites outside the South is in general just terrible these days, relative to what was once the case. Few, and certainly not I, would suggest that the Pubs are in good psephological health. And yes, again, the Pubs just repackaging the message is not where it is at.

[Brittain33]

The Democratic Party is a coalition. Obama followed John Kerry, who did relatively poorly among minority voters who the Dems need as much as that marginal WWC voter. So in a coalition, you take turns. And who's the front runner for Dems in 2016? The candidate identified by WWC Dems as their nominee.

[muon2]

I was surprised that he article did not use the counter-example to the lack of local community organizing among WCW - Cook County. Though the suburbs see large swings (~10%) between on and off-year elections, the effect is much smaller in Cook. The difference is that the machine described in the article still functions there. Politicians like Rep Lipinski rely on WCW for their base votes. Gov Quinn could not have won in 2010 without the loyal Dem vote in Cook, including the WCW.

[Link]

Torie you need to read your article.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

He uses a mid term election during a tough economic time as his worst case scenario.  Parties in power lose midterms all the time.  It is the norm.  I would not use it to extrapolate presidential elections.

And I don't think anyone on this forum or beyond thinks the Democratic party can jettison white working class voters.  That's absurd.  Why do you think Dems are so chummy with unions?  Only getting 40% of that vote is an electoral drubbing, but even your article states 40% almost ensures a perpetual lock on the White House.

The rich or upper class are by definition a small minority.  I don't think anyone in the Democratic coalition would swap all the white working class voters for a handful of latte sippers.  Democrats can do math.  Obama isn't running the United States like Vermont.  Anyone that has paid attention to Obama's track record and been to Vermont wouldn't confuse the two.

Yes, and the point, is that if the Dems can get a tad more of the white working class vote, then they will be able to trump the Pubs in off year elections, even if their person of color and youngs base turnout falls off in off year elections. But absent that, off year elections remain a problem for the Dems all things being equal at this point.

Well that is true but that statement is a lot more nuanced that the title of this thread.  If you are winning the White House and both houses of Congress every four years you are in a pretty good position.  Honestly both houses should be Democratic right now if it weren't for Gerrymandering.  If someone wants to talk about obstacles to the Democratic party that's what they really need to discuss.  Dems won more votes for the House and still don't control it.  That doesn't signal to me a problem with white working class voters.

[Indy Texas]

How can the Dems seal the deal?  The author says the old fashioned way, by the Dems returning to their roots and becoming the friends and neighbors of WCW's once again (and although the author does not say this, getting outside of their urban satrapies). It seems a bit of a buggy whip solution to me. Plus, the Dems don't want to live in Winchester. They don't live the lives of working class whites - and don't want to. They don't hunt. They don't really like to go to church that much although they may say they are religious. And just how often do you see them at High School football games? No, the Dems, and those who aspire to lead them,  want as it were to live in places like Whittier and Como in Minneapolis, to pick two hoods at random, not, and watch independent films.

I hate this kind of logic because it implies that Democrats should have to do something that Republicans don't do either. Mitt Romney has gone hunting all of, what, two times in his life? (Small varmints, if you will.) Religious? Romney isn't even a Christian by some standards; Grover Norquist is married to a Mohammedan and Rand Paul's subversive heresies as a student at Baylor University became well known during his Senate campaign. How many high school football games do you think Bobby Jindal ever went to before becoming governor? When did George W. Bush ever live the life of a working class white person? Spending a summer as a roughneck in the oilpatch working for your daddy's company doesn't count.

So please spare me any more of this idea that the Republican members of the political class are any more connected to WCWs than their Democratic counterparts.

[Torie]

How can the Dems seal the deal?  The author says the old fashioned way, by the Dems returning to their roots and becoming the friends and neighbors of WCW's once again (and although the author does not say this, getting outside of their urban satrapies). It seems a bit of a buggy whip solution to me. Plus, the Dems don't want to live in Winchester. They don't live the lives of working class whites - and don't want to. They don't hunt. They don't really like to go to church that much although they may say they are religious. And just how often do you see them at High School football games? No, the Dems, and those who aspire to lead them,  want as it were to live in places like Whittier and Como in Minneapolis, to pick two hoods at random, not, and watch independent films.

I hate this kind of logic because it implies that Democrats should have to do something that Republicans don't do either. Mitt Romney has gone hunting all of, what, two times in his life? (Small varmints, if you will.) Religious? Romney isn't even a Christian by some standards; Grover Norquist is married to a Mohammedan and Rand Paul's subversive heresies as a student at Baylor University became well known during his Senate campaign. How many high school football games do you think Bobby Jindal ever went to before becoming governor? When did George W. Bush ever live the life of a working class white person? Spending a summer as a roughneck in the oilpatch working for your daddy's company doesn't count.

So please spare me any more of this idea that the Republican members of the political class are any more connected to WCWs than their Democratic counterparts.

That however is precisely the claim of the article. It kind of surprised me too, but then it sort of helped connect the dots for me a bit, so it caused me to pause. Anyway, take up your beef with the author, not me. I was merely positing questions, and musings, with ultimate truths a mere speculation in any event, but the wolves smelled prey, and nature took over. It kind of reminded me of that sleigh ride in War and Peace.

[Kitteh]

FWIW, as a Northern Virginian, Winchester is actually pretty middle if not upper-middle class nowadays, as is all of NoVA. Any "white working class" people there are quickly getting priced out by waves of people who are respectively getting priced out of the inner-exurbs of NoVA. And it also happens to have an increasing number of liberals moving in.

Anyway, great trolling Torie. More mods need to do this.

[LastVoter]

How can the Dems seal the deal?  The author says the old fashioned way, by the Dems returning to their roots and becoming the friends and neighbors of WCW's once again (and although the author does not say this, getting outside of their urban satrapies). It seems a bit of a buggy whip solution to me. Plus, the Dems don't want to live in Winchester. They don't live the lives of working class whites - and don't want to. They don't hunt. They don't really like to go to church that much although they may say they are religious. And just how often do you see them at High School football games? No, the Dems, and those who aspire to lead them,  want as it were to live in places like Whittier and Como in Minneapolis, to pick two hoods at random, not, and watch independent films.

I hate this kind of logic because it implies that Democrats should have to do something that Republicans don't do either. Mitt Romney has gone hunting all of, what, two times in his life? (Small varmints, if you will.) Religious? Romney isn't even a Christian by some standards; Grover Norquist is married to a Mohammedan and Rand Paul's subversive heresies as a student at Baylor University became well known during his Senate campaign. How many high school football games do you think Bobby Jindal ever went to before becoming governor? When did George W. Bush ever live the life of a working class white person? Spending a summer as a roughneck in the oilpatch working for your daddy's company doesn't count.

So please spare me any more of this idea that the Republican members of the political class are any more connected to WCWs than their Democratic counterparts.

That however is precisely the claim of the article. It kind of surprised me too, but then it sort of helped connect the dots for me a bit, so it caused me to pause. Anyway, take up your beef with the author, not me. I was merely positing questions, and musings, with ultimate truths a mere speculation in any event, but the wolves smelled prey, and nature took over. It kind of reminded me of that sleigh ride in War and Peace.

I suggest you start a correspondence with Tweed to work on your post-modernist credentials.

[opebo]

Enough WCW's in several key states have caught on to the fact that they're being eaten alive.  They're not going to be taken in in sufficient numbers by guns/bibles nonsense to save the cannibal party.

At least not any time soon, and if they don't turn pretty soon it will start to require an even stronger turn (almost Alabama-style) to overcome the happy darkening trends.

[freepcrusher]

any of you guys in favor of displacing the WWC? I mean it's helped the democratic party immensely in CA when they kicked them out.

[Cory]

How can the Dems seal the deal?  The author says the old fashioned way, by the Dems returning to their roots and becoming the friends and neighbors of WCW's once again (and although the author does not say this, getting outside of their urban satrapies). It seems a bit of a buggy whip solution to me. Plus, the Dems don't want to live in Winchester. They don't live the lives of working class whites - and don't want to. They don't hunt. They don't really like to go to church that much although they may say they are religious. And just how often do you see them at High School football games? No, the Dems, and those who aspire to lead them,  want as it were to live in places like Whittier and Como in Minneapolis, to pick two hoods at random, not, and watch independent films.

Jesus Christ could you be any more smug, wrong, and stupid?