Hopefully this abomination dissappears soon.

[LastVoter]

http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2013/05/wal_mart_sales_decline_america_s_largest_retailer_is_slipping_as_customers.html

[bgwah]

As the article mentions towards the end, stores like Wal-Mart see an increase in business during recessions because people are seeking cheaper products during times of financial difficulty. This decline is not surprising given the improving economy --- though I'm sure increased competition from the internet and other things mentioned are factors as well.

There aren't a lot of places left in the country for Wal-Mart to expand, either.

[Ban my account ffs!]

They grew themselves into saturation and have lost the wind in their sales.  But Wal-Mart isn't going anywhere any time soon.  But look at the way businesses grow... they explode and overbuild, then collapse.  KMart did it in the 60s and 70s... Wal-Mart has followed suit in the 90s-now.

Of course Target has taken the more cautious "steady growth" approach, and they've weather storms better.

[HagridOfTheDeep]

They're adapting for urban areas though. You used to see these mega edge city Wal-Marts built in their own sprawling, isolated parking lots... but Wal-Mart is slowly creeping into areas where space is more of a commodity. These Wal-Marts are smaller Wal-Marts (known, I think, as "Neighbourhood Markets"), but it could be interesting to see what these changes mean for the company if they're successful.

Maybe this is old news in the States though... I don't know. We've got one coming to our neighbourhood, and it's pretty novel. We've got a typical narrow "Main Street" lined with shops, and let me tell you—no one would've thought a Wal-Mart could fit in here ten years ago. But it's looking like it just might.

[LastVoter]

They're adapting for urban areas though. You used to see these mega edge city Wal-Marts built in their own sprawling, isolated parking lots... but Wal-Mart is slowly creeping into areas where space is more of a commodity. These Wal-Marts are smaller Wal-Marts (known, I think, as "Neighbourhood Markets"), but it could be interesting to see what these changes mean for the company if they're successful.

Maybe this is old news in the States though... I don't know. We've got one coming to our neighbourhood, and it's pretty novel. We've got a typical narrow "Main Street" lined with shops, and let me tell you—no one would've thought a Wal-Mart could fit in here ten years ago. But it's looking like it just might.

Fortunately there's too much neighborhood opposition for this to be a common thing.

[HagridOfTheDeep]

Well, we've put up a hell of a fight. Wal-Mart's learning.

Anyhow, I'm not convinced it would be terrible for local business. By now, most of the local stores in my area are basically just niche "shoppes" anyway. If people want to go to Wal-Mart, they're still going to go to Wal-Mart. This new one will just cut down on the cost of gas. The only real damage it'll do is if it's got a grocery section. On the other hand, I sure won't complain if it brings down prices at Metro and Loblaw's. So... meh.

[memphis]

I wish they'd put one up near me. There's not a Wal-Mart anywhere in or even close to the 240 loop. It's a pain in the butt driving all the way out to the burbs to get cheap groceries. Most of the time, I'm too lazy and pay extra for the convenience of Kroger. Wal-Mart seems to have a phobia about cities. And it's not just about the logistics of density because that's not much of problem in my hometown. There are two Targets near me, both generic single story big boxes with acres of parking. And it's not about avoiding bad areas, because they have stores in neighborhoods that I would avoid.

[Indy Texas]

Part of their problem is that the strategy of skimping on labor costs is starting to catch up to them. Every time I go into a Walmart, I see pallets of product still shrink-wrapped sitting in the middle of aisles. I see empty shelves or misplaced items. That's what happens when you run a massive store on a skeleton crew. There are literally not enough people to get their merchandise on the shelves to be sold. Their sales decline as a result; they cut back on workforce more; and they get stuck in a feedback loop.

Self check-out registers don't seem to be helping. Usually they're concerned about "loss prevention" and you just have a person watching you check yourself out to make sure you ring everything up instead of just checking you out themselves.

There really isn't any room in the marketplace anymore for brick-and-mortar stores that offer such a mediocre customer environment. People who want to pay as little as possible will buy things online; they won't stand in line for 20 minutes, scour empty shelves and deal with underpaid, undertrained staff. If they're buying something they don't want to wait 3-5 days to get in the mail, like soap or toothpaste or groceries, they'll go to a drugstore or a supermarket. If they're buying something that's too big to get online, like a TV or a washing machine, they'll go to Home Depot.

[krazen1211]

Amazon now offers the standard batch of household items as add-on products. You can get those shipped to your door rather than wait 20 minutes in walmart's absurd lines.

[DC Al Fine]

Part of their problem is that the strategy of skimping on labor costs is starting to catch up to them. Every time I go into a Walmart, I see pallets of product still shrink-wrapped sitting in the middle of aisles. I see empty shelves or misplaced items. That's what happens when you run a massive store on a skeleton crew.

I've noticed this too. Remember that lots of people (especially over 40) still don't shop online. In another 10 years this trend will be even stronger, as people will be less willing to leave their houses for cheap products/crappy service.

[memphis]

You can't buy groceries online. Maybe if you want to live off of crackers. Yes, Wal-Mart is unpleasant to look at and has long lines. That's part of the package. But they're also cheaper than every other large grocery. They'll do just fine.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

You can't buy groceries online. Maybe if you want to live off of crackers. Yes, Wal-Mart is unpleasant to look at and has long lines. That's part of the package. But they're also cheaper than every other large grocery. They'll do just fine.

Actually it depends on what you buy.  For instance, you rarely want to buy soda there because they almost never put it on sale as a loss-leader.  But if it's something other stores don't usually put on sale, then Wal-Mart is a good place to buy stuff.  However, in my experience, the produce department at a Wal-Mart is fairly hit or miss, and I wouldn't buy fresh meat there, but that's because of quality issues, not price.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

I like the super Wal Marts......one stop shopping, good prices.

[Link]

Hopefully this abomination dissappears soon.

Move to Europe and enjoy the pain in the @$$ of driving or more likely taking the bus/subway/tram all over the place to do basic shopping.  In all seriousness though I like the aesthetics of a lot of European cities like Vienna.  But you pay a price.

I like the super Wal Marts......one stop shopping, good prices.

My parents live next to a new well run Super Wal Mart.  The place is amazing.  They currently live in a rural area but I can easily walk into the Wal Mart and purchase all the basics for life at a reasonable price.  For reasons that are not clear the checkout lanes are pretty decently staffed.  Near where I live in an urban area out of state there are no decent Walmarts.  There are no Super Walmarts.  All the Walmarts are decrepit and understaffed.  I don't go there much anymore.  My time is worth more.  I suppose if money was tighter and I was shopping for an entire family my attitude would be a little different.

To the Walmart haters out there please realize there is a wide variation in the quality of the stores.  As far as the labor practices... I think they are pretty crappy everywhere.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

My parents live next to a new well run Super Wal Mart.  The place is amazing.  They currently live in a rural area but I can easily walk into the Wal Mart and purchase all the basics for life at a reasonable price.  For reasons that are not clear the checkout lanes are pretty decently staffed.

The reason is that it is a new store.  When it opens a store, it is having to attract new customers and that means it needs to be certain of having decent customer service, which for a Wal-Mart means having adequate staffing levels.  Also, since it can't be certain of what customer traffic patterns will be like, a new store has to err on the side of having an excess of checkout people.  Older stores both have a better idea of when it needs people and since they already have a customer base, don't feel the need to impress.  As a result, they don't schedule for as much of a safety margin.

[Link]

Okay by "new" I mean around 4 years old.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

It takes time for the older stores to sink into decrepitude of poor service.

[Link]

It takes time for the older stores to sink into decrepitude of poor service.

I hope that doesn't happen.  It really is the best shopping experience around.

[memphis]

It takes time for the older stores to sink into decrepitude of poor service.

I hope that doesn't happen.  It really is the best shopping experience around.

I like a lot about Wal-Mart but "best shopping experience" isn't one of them. They have a wide variety of stuff at cheap prices. That's about it. If you want a good shopping experience, go to Target or a frou frou grocery like Whole Foods or Fresh Market. You won't leave with the indellible stench of failure.

[Ban my account ffs!]

It's also worth remembering that there are still plenty of poor people (and elderly people, as DC mentions) in this country who don't have internet access, except maybe on their cell phones, or who just aren't in the habit of purchasing things online. The very low end of the market that Wal-Mart caters to isn't about to be displaced by Amazon or any other online marketplace.

Yeah.. our local school district has wifi on its school buses now for kids because enough of them don't have access to the internet at home (and we're a big, rural district so bus rides can be up to 90 minutes).  It turned out to be great because the kids are quieter and well behaved.

When I was in like 6th and 7th grade.. our school bus was so bad we had to have another adult ride to keep us in check.  Not like that really stopped us.

We got into a war with our bus driver because a girl (a high schooler) lit a cigarette on the bus so the bus driver made us keep our windows closed as punishment on a hot day.  So finally we just all opened the windows and so she stopped and pulled over and said she wouldn't go any further (she was paid by the hour)... so we all started up a nice round of "This is the song that never ends" and did that for 15 minutes before she finally relented and went.

Collective bargaining is such a wonderful thing.  

[DC Al Fine]

It's also worth remembering that there are still plenty of poor people (and elderly people, as DC mentions) in this country who don't have internet access, except maybe on their cell phones, or who just aren't in the habit of purchasing things online. The very low end of the market that Wal-Mart caters to isn't about to be displaced by Amazon or any other online marketplace.

Yeah.. our local school district has wifi on its school buses now for kids because enough of them don't have access to the internet at home (and we're a big, rural district so bus rides can be up to 90 minutes).  It turned out to be great because the kids are quieter and well behaved.

When I was in like 6th and 7th grade.. our school bus was so bad we had to have another adult ride to keep us in check.  Not like that really stopped us.

I remember those days. Good reason to live walking distance from your school.

[opebo]

It's also worth remembering that there are still plenty of poor people (and elderly people, as DC mentions) in this country who don't have internet access, except maybe on their cell phones, or who just aren't in the habit of purchasing things online. The very low end of the market that Wal-Mart caters to isn't about to be displaced by Amazon or any other online marketplace.

Great point.  And speaking of those poor people - they have no credit cards or any other way to buy something online - most of them don't even have bank accounts.  They simply cash their pay-checks at check-cashing rip-off joints and spend the cash at WalMart buying poisons and shoddy garbage.  America!

[memphis]

It's also worth remembering that there are still plenty of poor people (and elderly people, as DC mentions) in this country who don't have internet access, except maybe on their cell phones, or who just aren't in the habit of purchasing things online. The very low end of the market that Wal-Mart caters to isn't about to be displaced by Amazon or any other online marketplace.

Great point.  And speaking of those poor people - they have no credit cards or any other way to buy something online - most of them don't even have bank accounts.  They simply cash their pay-checks at check-cashing rip-off joints and spend the cash at WalMart buying poisons and shoddy garbage.  America!

You've been in Thailand too long, opie. Times have changed! It's now standard practice at crap jobs to be given a debit card upon hiring. Each paycheck sees the money automatically loaded onto the cards. Of course, there are fees of a dollar or two associated with each transaction as well as a monthly fee in the neighborhood of $10 for "account maintenance." This arrangement is much cheaper for the employer because they no longer have to pay a payroll company. The financial institutions are often willing to pay the employer for the privilege of making so much money off of the employees. Plus, instead of getting a printed explanation of hours worked and taxes and so forth, all pay statements are merely available online for the employees to check which very few of them frequently do.

[opebo]

It's also worth remembering that there are still plenty of poor people (and elderly people, as DC mentions) in this country who don't have internet access, except maybe on their cell phones, or who just aren't in the habit of purchasing things online. The very low end of the market that Wal-Mart caters to isn't about to be displaced by Amazon or any other online marketplace.

Great point.  And speaking of those poor people - they have no credit cards or any other way to buy something online - most of them don't even have bank accounts.  They simply cash their pay-checks at check-cashing rip-off joints and spend the cash at WalMart buying poisons and shoddy garbage.  America!

You've been in Thailand too long, opie. Times have changed! It's now standard practice at crap jobs to be given a debit card upon hiring. Each paycheck sees the money automatically loaded onto the cards. Of course, there are fees of a dollar or two associated with each transaction as well as a monthly fee in the neighborhood of $10 for "account maintenance." This arrangement is much cheaper for the employer because they no longer have to pay a payroll company. The financial institutions are often willing to pay the employer for the privilege of making so much money off of the employees. Plus, instead of getting a printed explanation of hours worked and taxes and so forth, all pay statements are merely available online for the employees to check which very few of them frequently do.

Ugh.  It is disgusting but of course unsurprising that this is legal.  I had never heard of any such crimes before, memphis, thanks.

[angus]

They're adapting for urban areas though....  These Wal-Marts are smaller Wal-Marts...

Not necessarily.  I've been in some hyper-urban Walmarts in very densely populated areas.  One in Mexico City and one in Shanghai.  They were huge, multi-story Walmarts with escalators and elevators.  They come in all shapes and sizes.  Urban doesn't have to mean small.