MSNBC going 'u wot m8' with its latest 'lean forward' spot

[The Free North]

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/mark-finkelstein/2013/04/10/more-socialism-harris-perrys-latest-lean-forward-most-successful-o

Cant wait for all my free stuff!!! Thanks Washington DC!

Maybe we can discuss the idea of a 'right' as well in this thread.

To me, as a libertarian, a right is something that every human inherently has by virtue of their birth. You things like life, liberty, etc are the most important. In other words, I have a right to my life, simply because i'm alive.

This idea that you have a right to certain 'things' is completely different. Life and liberty are not things like a house and a job. You dont have a right to get things from someone else because you have to infringe upon their liberty to get it. Furthermore, the government gives out these things in most cases, and we all know the governments track record over the last 100 years. The point of the matter is that you dont have a right to stuff. Luckily we live in a system that (at least it was supposed to) ensure that most people had a chance to achieve these basic things.

[Lambsbread]

hardly u wot m8, she's kinda right if you listened

[DrScholl]

You misread what she is saying. Fact of it is, there are people that work hard, but don't have access to necessities and that is a problem. The host didn't even mentioned government or free stuff.

[Ban my account ffs!]

"Life and liberty are not like a house and a job.  They are not concrete things.  They are vague vague vagueness nostalgia warm fuzzy 1950s Murica vague freedom american dream private sector F***K YEAH@!!!@#@!@"

How old are you?  Have you ever been responsible for yourself?  I doubt it.  You probably get all sorts of handouts not only from the government, but from mom and dad, various friends, etc.

And if you're wondering why I assume you're some kid.. it's because you have the political ideology of a child.  You've got everything figured out in your little cocoon that is childhood.

[Lief 🗽]

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I don't see anything wrong with this? Seems like a sensible, mainstream position.

And no one has any rights, intrinsically, by simply existing as a human-being. All rights/privileges are created by the state. The question is which rights/privileges the state should enforce and which it should not. The positive/negative rights distinction is also nonsense. Any right can be positive or negative depending on how you rhetorically frame it.

[Lambsbread]

How old are you?  Have you ever been responsible for yourself?  I doubt it.  You probably get all sorts of handouts not only from the government, but from mom and dad, various friends, etc.

And if you're wondering why I assume you're some kid.. it's because you have the political ideology of a child.  You've got everything figured out in your little cocoon that is childhood.

This is exactly why I stopped being a Libertarian/Republican

[DC Al Fine]

How old are you?  Have you ever been responsible for yourself?  I doubt it.  You probably get all sorts of handouts not only from the government, but from mom and dad, various friends, etc.

This is contradictory to libertarianism how?

[Torie]

Letting folks with shall we say, to be a tough no nonsense daddy type, character flaws, falling through the cracks, with all the collateral damage, starting with whatever issue they have sired, but beyond that, if they have to live under bridges, or steal, sell drugs, or themselves or so forth, to make their way in this world, and then get sick and maybe communicate TB round and about, just doesn't work out too well. No man is an island. There is no escape, even for those who are not naturally bleeding hearts.

The trick is to balance communitarian concerns, with individual liberty, and economic efficiency considerations. Sure it's tough, and is always an ongoing work in progress, requiring a lot of good judgment and wisdom. And all too often ideology gets in the way. Ideology is all too often an anchor, and/or a sail without a tiller,  rather than a sail with one, when it comes to moving the ship of state forward in the right direction without hitting the rocks.

Just one dessicated old man's opinion.

[Antonio the Sixth]

How old are you?  Have you ever been responsible for yourself?  I doubt it.  You probably get all sorts of handouts not only from the government, but from mom and dad, various friends, etc.

And if you're wondering why I assume you're some kid.. it's because you have the political ideology of a child.  You've got everything figured out in your little cocoon that is childhood.

This is exactly why I stopped being a Libertarian/Republican

There seems to be a kind of natural cycle going on in this forum, with clueless libertarian teens joining, then, as they grew older and more mature, move left, only to be replaced by a younger  generation of clueless libertarians. That's funny to watch.

[BluegrassBlueVote]

How old are you?  Have you ever been responsible for yourself?  I doubt it.  You probably get all sorts of handouts not only from the government, but from mom and dad, various friends, etc.

And if you're wondering why I assume you're some kid.. it's because you have the political ideology of a child.  You've got everything figured out in your little cocoon that is childhood.

This is exactly why I stopped being a Libertarian/Republican

There seems to be a kind of natural cycle going on in this forum, with clueless libertarian teens joining, then, as they grew older and more mature, move left, only to be replaced by a younger  generation of clueless libertarians. That's funny to watch.

Freshman year of college is a super serious time, man.

[Paul Kemp]

Newsbusters lol

I also don't even know what "u wot m8" is but I'm sure it shouldn't be used.

[Link]

To me, as a libertarian, a right is something that every human inherently has by virtue of their birth.

That's your simplistic definition.  I think in the richest country in the world every child or at least every child that is a citizen or legal resident has a right to basic healthcare, water, clothing, shelter, food, education, and safety.  Do you disagree?  And if so what kind of animal are you?

Providing some of those things to every child may be impractical at times.  But that doesn't mean it shouldn't be a goal.  I mean what is the goal of life really?  To live in a big house while a child dies of an easily preventable disease because you don't want to pay $100 a year more in taxes?  My advice to you and people like you is to move to libertarian third world countries where you can bribe your way to government noninterference and low taxation.  Let me know how nice it is to drive to work in you bullet proof Benz while staring out the window at starving children.  C'mon man.  People have tried all these experiments already.  The planet is littered with the results.

[Vosem]

To me, as a libertarian, a right is something that every human inherently has by virtue of their birth.

That's your simplistic definition.  I think in the richest country in the world every child or at least every child that is a citizen or legal resident has a right to basic healthcare, water, clothing, shelter, food, education, and safety.  Do you disagree?  And if so what kind of animal are you?

Oh, certainly. But the folks who provide those services deserve to get paid for it, wouldn't you say so?

Providing some of those things to every child may be impractical at times.  But that doesn't mean it shouldn't be a goal.  I mean what is the goal of life really?  To live in a big house while a child dies of an easily preventable disease because you don't want to pay $100 a year more in taxes?

The goal of life, for all organisms, is to ensure stability for yourself, reproduce, and (for certain organisms, such as humans) also to ensure stability for your children.

  My advice to you and people like you is to move to libertarian third world countries where you can bribe your way to government noninterference and low taxation.  Let me know how nice it is to drive to work in you bullet proof Benz while staring out the window at starving children.  C'mon man.  People have tried all these experiments already.  The planet is littered with the results.

Like where? Name one 'libertarian Third World country'.

[Link]

The goal of life, for all organisms, is to ensure stability for yourself, reproduce, and (for certain organisms, such as humans) also to ensure stability for your children.

I, unlike some reptiles on the right, am more than an "organism."

[Vosem]

The goal of life, for all organisms, is to ensure stability for yourself, reproduce, and (for certain organisms, such as humans) also to ensure stability for your children.

I, unlike some reptiles on the right, am more than an "organism."

You do have roughly the cognitive abilities of the average mineral, but nevertheless you, and I, and trillions of things in both of our immediate surroundings are all organisms.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

The goal of life, for all organisms, is to ensure stability for yourself, reproduce, and (for certain organisms, such as humans) also to ensure stability for your children.

I, unlike some reptiles on the right, am more than an "organism."

You do have roughly the cognitive abilities of the average mineral, but nevertheless you, and I, and trillions of things in both of our immediate surroundings are all organisms.

Do you not think it behovely to at least pretend to think of ourselves as worthy of a more compassionate and idealistic level of consideration than, for example, sea pens?

[Vosem]

The goal of life, for all organisms, is to ensure stability for yourself, reproduce, and (for certain organisms, such as humans) also to ensure stability for your children.

I, unlike some reptiles on the right, am more than an "organism."

You do have roughly the cognitive abilities of the average mineral, but nevertheless you, and I, and trillions of things in both of our immediate surroundings are all organisms.

Do you not think it behovely to at least pretend to think of ourselves as worthy of a more compassionate and idealistic level of consideration than, for example, sea pens?

Certainly. But he asked what the "goal of life" was, and there exists a biological answer to that question which is common to all life.

[Link]

Do you not think it behovely to at least pretend to think of ourselves as worthy of a more compassionate and idealistic level of consideration than, for example, sea pens?

Certainly. But he asked what the "goal of life" was, and there exists a biological answer to that question which is common to all life.

Just saw some episodes of that old show.  This character was my favorite.  It is interesting watching a robot try and figure out what it means to be human.

[King]

Quality food for children in a 21st century first world nation?  Damn these crazed utopian idealists!

[Paul Kemp]

Wait I just actually read what she said...this is controversial?

lolibertarians

[Roemerista]

The outrage I think is suggesting that she can decide what a "fair" evaluation of another human being's merits, that is "just a little more."

[Zioneer]

Quality food for children in a 21st century first world nation?  Damn these crazed utopian idealists!

[Keystone Phil]

I'd love for MSNBC to have a promo about reporting the news and not opinions (whether they're mainstream or super controversial) but that's asking a lot of a non-news network.

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

I'd love for MSNBC to have a promo about reporting the news and not opinions (whether they're mainstream or super controversial) but that's asking a lot of a non-news network.

The difference is that MSNBC's opinions are correct, and they don't blatantly lie nearly as often as the "fair and balanced" network.

[Joe Republic]

I'd love for MSNBC to have a promo about reporting the news and not opinions (whether they're mainstream or super controversial) but that's asking a lot of a non-news network.

At least they're honest about it.  That'd be asking a lot of any of the other non-news networks.