Singapore PM: US not in decline

[Simfan34]

Read this in the times. Will post link. Singapore continues to be an FF country.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/07/world/asia/singapores-prime-minister-warns-china-on-view-of-us.html

The world's best-run nation stands up for the world's greatest nation. If Asia can act in concert... it would be a formidable force against China.

[Franzl]

Singapore is an FF country?

[Antonio the Sixth]

Lee Hsien Loong's endorsement of Obama is clearly a game changer in this election. It is hard to see how the GOP could recover from such a forceful debunking of their campaign message.

[後援会]

Well, for all extents and purposes for Singapore, America isn't in decline. After all, our financial sector (our largest economic sector of engagement with Singapore), our trade with China and Asia, and our political/diplomatic engagement with Asia (pivot to Asia woo) will probably not decline anytime soon.

I refrain to make any such prediction regarding American living standards.

[opebo]

Hah, what a funny little 'country'.  I wouldn't take anything seriously about their opinions.

[後援会]

Hah, what a funny little 'country'.  I wouldn't take anything seriously about their opinions.

Typical Westerner. As always, Europeans are the only non-Americans with "legitimate" politics.

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

Hah, what a funny little 'country'.  I wouldn't take anything seriously about their opinions.

Typical Westerner. As always, Europeans are the only non-Americans with "legitimate" politics.

1. Opebo lives in Thailand and hates America.
2. Singapore is literally fascist. I wouldn't listen to them either (and I don't get why we have a FTA with a nation that bans unions).

http://abstractnonsense.wordpress.com/2006/09/05/the-fascism-of-singapore/

Singapore, other than being non-white, is what the GOP wants for America.

[後援会]

Hah, what a funny little 'country'.  I wouldn't take anything seriously about their opinions.

Typical Westerner. As always, Europeans are the only non-Americans with "legitimate" politics.

1. Opebo lives in Thailand and hates America.
2. Singapore is literally fascist. I wouldn't listen to them either (and I don't get why we have a FTA with a nation that bans unions).

http://abstractnonsense.wordpress.com/2006/09/05/the-fascism-of-singapore/

Singapore, other than being non-white, is what the GOP wants for America.

Oh, so another Westerner trying to teach the "natives" how to act like Europe.

And the idea of Singapore as some horrible oppressive dictatorship is laughable. If there was ever any serious opposition to the very basis of the government, you would actually see electoral defeats. Which as we know, has not materialized. Singapore provides an economic and political model in contrast to the failing Western style of governance, so it's only natural it would inspire such hostility. And why so many lobby to try to impose Western styles.

Also, the GOP doesn't have a vision anything like Singapore. The GOP is very suspicious of what government can do. Of course, the GOP can point at Singapore to show how non-progressive taxation, free trade, and all of that work. But they're not actually willing to emulate the governance model. Which is a great pity.

Though in all fairness, don't take me wrong. I'm not particularly bullish on Singapore. It's far too dependent on the USA and China (I am bearish on both). And there's been serious social decay as so many youth have taken towards mimicking Western social mores. Which is already turning into a disaster (see: birth rates).

[LastVoter]

Hah, what a funny little 'country'.  I wouldn't take anything seriously about their opinions.

Typical Westerner. As always, Europeans are the only non-Americans with "legitimate" politics.

1. Opebo lives in Thailand and hates America.
2. Singapore is literally fascist. I wouldn't listen to them either (and I don't get why we have a FTA with a nation that bans unions).

http://abstractnonsense.wordpress.com/2006/09/05/the-fascism-of-singapore/

Singapore, other than being non-white, is what the GOP wants for America.

Oh, so another Westerner trying to teach the "natives" how to act like Europe.

And the idea of Singapore as some horrible oppressive dictatorship is laughable. If there was ever any serious opposition to the very basis of the government, you would actually see electoral defeats. Which as we know, has not materialized. Singapore provides an economic and political model in contrast to the failing Western style of governance, so it's only natural it would inspire such hostility. And why so many lobby to try to impose Western styles.

Also, the GOP doesn't have a vision anything like Singapore. The GOP is very suspicious of what government can do. Of course, the GOP can point at Singapore to show how non-progressive taxation, free trade, and all of that work. But they're not actually willing to emulate the governance model. Which is a great pity.

Though in all fairness, don't take me wrong. I'm not particularly bullish on Singapore. It's far too dependent on the USA and China (I am bearish on both). And there's been serious social decay as so many youth have taken towards mimicking Western social mores. Which is already turning into a disaster (see: birth rates).

Low birth rates are not a disaster, they increase the price of labor which is a good thing.

[Simfan34]

Hah, what a funny little 'country'.  I wouldn't take anything seriously about their opinions.

Typical Westerner. As always, Europeans are the only non-Americans with "legitimate" politics.

1. Opebo lives in Thailand and hates America.
2. Singapore is literally fascist. I wouldn't listen to them either (and I don't get why we have a FTA with a nation that bans unions).

http://abstractnonsense.wordpress.com/2006/09/05/the-fascism-of-singapore/

Singapore, other than being non-white, is what the GOP wants for America.

Singapore is what I want for America, yes. If only my party shared that view. Singapore shows what a country can do when a government is committed to governing and has a longterm vision of improvement and a goal of self determination. Singapore was once a swamp. Now look at it today. The PAP government is a good demonstration of state intervention being used towards a greater goal of development and a sustainable free market economy. Unlike Hong Kong, dominated by a few oligarchs and wholly undemocratic, Singapore is far more open, both economically and politically. Also, its the world's only slum free major city, but don't let that get in the way of your agenda.

It is unfortunate to see that Singaporean youth are becoming decadent, I assume embracing immorality, promiscuity, and delayed maturation like their American fellows. One might hope the traditional values of society shall react against that. Thankfully Singapore is not Japan in the regards that it rejects immigrants, that certainly would be an odd stance for a Chinese enclave in Malaya. There are many wealthy Chinese (and others not so wealthy) who seek to leave that country, and since regrettably the United States does not seem willing to accommodate them and take as many immigrants from Asia as possible, hopefully Singapore can have another influx or two.

Of course declining birth rates are a bad thing. They mean smaller workforces, labour shortages, unfunded pension obligations, lack of innovation, smaller tax bases, etc. etc.

[Foucaulf]

He's saying what the top echelons of China are all thinking. Both sides want to push each other's hand, but not to the point of collapse. The political structure of China and its foreign-dependent economy makes the nation unable to lead like the US for at least the next decade or two.

Oh, so another Westerner trying to teach the "natives" how to act like Europe...
Singapore provides an economic and political model in contrast to the failing Western style of governance, so it's only natural it would inspire such hostility.

The funny thing being that the Lee family - educated in Cambridge and all - follow a very western style of governance. It's more of a conservative-modern thing.

It is unfortunate to see that Singaporean youth are becoming decadent, I assume embracing immorality, promiscuity, and delayed maturation like their American fellows. One might hope the traditional values of society shall react against that.

I would view the "decadence" problem in a more dialectical light.

[Simfan34]

He's saying what the top echelons of China are all thinking. Both sides want to push each other's hand, but not to the point of collapse. The political structure of China and its foreign-dependent economy makes the nation unable to lead like the US for at least the next decade or two.

Oh, so another Westerner trying to teach the "natives" how to act like Europe...
Singapore provides an economic and political model in contrast to the failing Western style of governance, so it's only natural it would inspire such hostility.

The funny thing being that the Lee family - educated in Cambridge and all - follow a very western style of governance. It's more of a conservative-modern thing.

So a model very much adaptable to the West? Shall I found the Peoples' Action Caucus, or do I misunderstand you?

But it's not surprising long-lasting and strong founded ways of conservative governance would arouse such passion amongst leftists.

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I would view the "decadence" problem in a more dialectical light.
[/quote]

Might you explain?

[Foucaulf]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Basically I meant the homogenizing forces of capitalism would've changed attitudes sooner or later, but that sounds a bit too doctrinaire. I was very happy to hear from some Singapore students at my school that clubs and raves do exist. It's not all "Disneyland with the Death Penalty" down there.

Which is relevant to your previous point...

So a model very much adaptable to the West? Shall I found the Peoples' Action Caucus, or do I misunderstand you?

But it's not surprising long-lasting and strong founded ways of conservative governance would arouse such passion amongst leftists.

I was trying to highlight how the Singapore model wouldn't work in the factitious politics of Asia either. It can no longer work in today's developed world because populations are either so homogeneous that a mass opposition movement may be developed or so heterogeneous that the system would never get built. Be technocratic all you want, but you may want to do so in a different city after Bloomberg's soda fiasco.

I don't really have much of a bone to pick with Singapore anymore - it's clearly a country designed more for living than visiting. What irks me are the people who tout of a "Singaporean model" like others did of the technocracies in the thirties.  Governance is one thing, but "inspirational" is a different matter. I'll save talk of anti-Westernism from Asians for another time.

[opebo]

Hah, what a funny little 'country'.  I wouldn't take anything seriously about their opinions.

Typical Westerner. As always, Europeans are the only non-Americans with "legitimate" politics.

What now?  Singapore is more British in character than Asian - it is a phoney 'country', a residual of imperialism - a tax-and-'free trade' dodge for big companies, like Hong Kong, Macau, Bahamas, etc.  

China, Japan, Korea - I would consider their opinions important.  Not Singapore.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Singapore is a city-state at the end of a peninsula which happens to be the world's busiest straits for shipping. That is hardly a 'model' of practically any other state. Ditto with Hong Kong.

[Insula Dei]

I'm looking forward to the day that any Singapore PM would answer a question like that by saying that the US is in decline.

[Vosem]

It is unfortunate to see that Singaporean youth are becoming decadent, I assume embracing immorality, promiscuity, and delayed maturation like their American fellows. One might hope the traditional values of society shall react against that.

My opinion of you just went down several notches

It's still very positive, just not as much as it was before.

[Beet]

The idea of the US in decline is patently absurd. America is as powerful now, economically and militarily, as it has ever been. Sometimes, someone with a bit of distance from the zeitgeist of the American newsmedia sees things a bit clearer, as it's hard to see the shape of the battle when you're in the midst of it.

[Simfan34]

It is unfortunate to see that Singaporean youth are becoming decadent, I assume embracing immorality, promiscuity, and delayed maturation like their American fellows. One might hope the traditional values of society shall react against that.

My opinion of you just went down several notches

It's still very positive, just not as much as it was before.

But why?

[LastVoter]

It is unfortunate to see that Singaporean youth are becoming decadent, I assume embracing immorality, promiscuity, and delayed maturation like their American fellows. One might hope the traditional values of society shall react against that.

My opinion of you just went down several notches

It's still very positive, just not as much as it was before.

But why?

Stop pretending to be a part of the moral majority.

[tik 🪀✨]

Decadence is good for the soul. It should be seen as a positive step. Singaporeans often score poorly in terms of happiness.