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nclib
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« on: December 06, 2004, 11:58:59 PM »

List how you voted and elaborate if possible.

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Strongly Agree. Note the PATRIOT Act.

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Strongly Disagree. Clear and intelligent debate is beneficial.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Disagree.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Strongly Disagree.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Disagree.

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Disagree. This is in the eye of the beholder.

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Strongly Disagree. An emphasis on punishment rather than rehabilitation will decrease the ex-con's ability to become a productive member of society.

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Disagree.

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Disagree, as in "they are equally important".

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Strongly Disagree. While both parents have a moral obligation to provide for their children, the mother should not be burdened any moreso than the father.

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Agree.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Disagree. Although making peace with the establishment may be positive in some situations, it is not necessarily a good thing if it results from apathy.
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Lunar
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« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2004, 01:40:55 AM »



Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Strongly Agree. - I'm a civil libertarian, what can I say?

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Strongly Disagree. - Discussing an idea before we implement it isn't a bad thing!

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Strongly Disagree. - Everyone should be worried about increases in surveillance, even if we agree with implementing them.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Disagree - Weak disagreement.  I'm just uncomfortable with the concept of the state controlling who lives and who dies.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Agree - Unless we're looking at some kind of communal tribe, the alternative seems to be anarchy.

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Agree -Just because crappy "modern art" annoys me.

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Disagree -The focus should be to make everyone else safer.  I think rehabilitation and punishment should be valued as equal detterents, but when it comes down to what should be more important..let's value the direct rehabilitation method of increasing safety.

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Agree - The phrase "some" prevents a disagreement with this phrase as far as I can tell.

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Strongly Agree - The writer has his place too, but entertainment professions are subordinate to ones that have real results.

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Strongly Disagree - Who they hell are you to determine what someone else's "first duty" is?

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Agree I guess.  Plan genetic resources aren't at the top of my mind though.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Agree - Barely.
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patrick1
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« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2004, 04:30:43 AM »

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.
Moderately disagree.  I don't think the Patriot Act has infringed significantly on our civil liberties.  That being said, there have been some instances of abuse and we should remian vigilant so that more abuses do not occur.  Measures must be taken to ensure that another 9/11 does not occur and if that means snooping on suspects so be it.
A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Strongly Disagree.  I don't like Red China's system.  Debate is vital.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Disagree somewhat.  It should be easier to obatain warrants on individuals who have been consorting in suspicious activities.  However, the government should not have access to everyone's information.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Strongly agree.  My cousin was murdered by a piece of garbage.  I don't want the guy breathing the sam air as the rest of us or have a chance of getting out.
I don't think it is a significant deterrant to crime but it does satisfy my biblical sense of justice.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Disagree.  In nature there are hierarchies but this statement smacks of totalitarianism.  Plato, Hobbes and Lenin all abhored the common man's abilities to make up their own mind.  I am not that cynical yet.

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Disagree. Ars gratia ars.  Art does not need to be represenataice or superficial.  Good art makes the audience delve deeper into the meaning behind it.

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Agree.  Some criminals are unable to be rehabilitated.  Crime should have severe consequences and prison should be so bad that it deters people from commiting crimes again.
It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

agree.  Child molesters, rapists etc.  are a disease and should rot forever.

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Disagree.  Business and manufacturers place is to create jobs and corporeal well being.  A true artist can instill spiritual well being.  (Corny, I know)
Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Children should be more important than a career for both parents.

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

I am not sure if I know what this means.  India and China have made some of the greatest breakthroughs in genetic engineering that has made it possible to feed their people.   

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Question everything, always.
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Beet
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« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2004, 06:36:09 AM »

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Disagree. While I would support scaling back the Patriot Act merely because I feel it has eroded the public's confidence in its own liberties and rights, I haven't followed this issue closely so cannot make a positive statement on it.

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Strongly Disagree. If the decision is well thought out, it will take a while and require many inputs no matter what the party system. If the decision is poorly thought out or not done in the national interest, then the speed by which it is implemented has no effect on its benefit. Further, the centralization of executive power is harmful rather than helpful when that power does not serve the national interest, as is most often the case. Just look at Iraq under Saddam Hussein. Exceptions usually occur only when executive power appears centralized but is in fact reliant on invisible external societal pressures.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Strongly Disagree. The CIA has proven untrustworthy when given too many powers in the past. The growing possibility of government overreaching should be a matter of concern for everyone.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Strongly Agree. Though the most strenuous attempts at personal reform and rehabilitation should always be made first.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Disagree. Obeyed no matter what? I would agree if "always" were changed to "sometimes".

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Disagree. The abstraction of art was a necessary adaptation to save the physical visual aesthetics from complete extinction with the arrival of photography. Why try to accurately depict something with watercolor that could be done in a second just with a camera?

This statement is like saying that architecture which doesn't have columns or flying buttresses shouldn't be considered architecture. Abstract art reflects well the dawn of the age of psychology.

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Strongly Disagree. Rehabilitation should always be the first choice. It's the Christian thing to do.

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Disagree. Some attempt should be made to rehabilitate all criminals.

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Strongly Disagree. Its comparing apples and oranges.

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Strongly Disagree. Why single out mothers? What's missing in today's family more often than not is the father.

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Disagree. I have little idea what this is supposed to mean. But the word "exploit" has been thrown around far too much. For example, it's not exploiting someone (at least not unethically) to give them a job that allows them to feed their family, even if it's not a job that pays very much. On the contrary it's helping them. Once the labor pool tightens up, employees will develop their own bargaining power.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Strongly Disagree. One does not "make peace" with the establishment-- one becomes the establishment: or at least that is the hope.
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minionofmidas
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« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2004, 08:47:35 AM »

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.
Strongly Agree. Counterterrorism is terrorism.

A significant etc
Strongly Disagree.  I don't like Red China's system.  Debate is vital.
I think at times I just put "disagree", tho. Out of a spirit of "well, there may be emergency situations where this its sole and very minor advantage may play a role".

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Strongly Disagree somewhat. Take, once again, the Patriot Act, threatening every Librarian in America with rotting in jail.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Strongly disagree. Not just because of what it does to the victim (the man executed). Also because of what it does to the society that has to live with legal killers in their midst. And to the the killers themselves.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Strongly Disagree.  In nature there are hierarchies but this statement smacks of totalitarianism. 

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Once upon a time, painting served the purpose of conserving reality. It also sometimes served other purposes, such as spiritual ones.
Nowadays, that first purpose doesn't exist anymore. If you want to conserve reality the way portrait paintings did, buy an instant camera.
Art that doesn't serve any purpose - according to the artist himself that is, not just according to me - shouldn't be considered art at all.
Strongly Disagree.

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.
Strongly Disagree. "Punishment" without a strong Rehabilitation context is simply Sadism.

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Strongly Disagree. Just because it's hard to do doesn't it mean it's not worth doing.

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Disagree.  Business and manufacturers place is to create jobs and corporeal well being.  A true artist can instill spiritual well being.  (Corny, I know)
The artist's and, perhaps especially, the writer's influence is much more far-reaching, especially on the time scale. (Plus of course, every artist is a businessman and manufacturer.)

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Somewhat agree. Children should be more important than a career for both parents. The state should provide them with the means to make this possible.

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.
Strongly Agree.
Securing patents on plants that have been used for ages is not ethical.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity
It's an important aspect of senility.
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A18
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« Reply #5 on: December 07, 2004, 11:28:20 AM »

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Disagree.

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Disagree.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Disagree.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Agree.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Nice job spelling civilized. Disagree.

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Agree.

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Strongly Agree.

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Disagree.

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Strongly Agree.

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Agree.

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Disagree.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Disagree.
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I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
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« Reply #6 on: December 07, 2004, 11:59:36 AM »

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Strongly Agree. The Patriot Act should be repealed in its entirety.

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Disagree. Although I wouldn't mind outlawing third parties just because this would eliminate that utterly vile scum known as Ralph Nader from ever tainting the election with his disgusting precense ever again.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Strongly Disagree.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Strongly Disagree.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Strongly Disagree.

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Strongly Disagree.

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Strongly Disagree.

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Disagree

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Disagree

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Strongly Disagree.

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Strongly Agree.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Strongly Disagree. If the establishment isn't doing what's good, you shouldn't get along with them.
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Redefeatbush04
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« Reply #7 on: December 07, 2004, 03:29:24 PM »
« Edited: December 07, 2004, 05:07:58 PM by Redefeatbush04 Redefeatbush04 »

I DON'T FEEL LIKE ELABORATING. IF YOU WANT TO CHALLENGE ANY OF MY POSITIONS I WOULD BE GLAD TO DEBATE THEM

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Disagree

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Strongly Disagree

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Disagree

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Strongly Disagree

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.


Agree

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.


Agree

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Disagree


It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.


Strongly Agree

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.


Strongly Agree

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Disagree

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Agree

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity


Agree
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Gustaf
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« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2004, 04:54:46 PM »


Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Agree.

I'm worried, but not hyperworried.

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Strongly Disagree.
Like, duh. Tongue This is to sort the democrats from the non-democrats.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Strongly Disagree.

We all need to worry about the state getting too much power.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Disagree.

I'm opposed to the death penalty, but I can see both sides.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Strongly Disagree.

I don't believe in übermensch-ideals.

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Agree/Strongly Agree.

That's my view, but it has no bearing on my political stands. Tongue

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Agree.

Punishment is what we can actually administer, rehabilitation is hard to prove. Ideally, those who can be rehabilitated shouldn't be criminals in the first place. But this sort of varies from case to case.

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Strongly agree.

Some people are just plain bad. That doesn't necessarily mean we shouldn't keep trying though.

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Disagree.

Not sure either way, so equally important I guess.

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Strongly Disagree.

Too lazy to start writing paragraphs on this one.

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Agree.

Eh, sure, whatever...my answers to this one varies,  but usually I  pick agree on pure instinct. I have no idea, actually.
Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Strongly disagree.

One should stick to one's conscience! The establishment can be plain wrong! Etc!
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Lunar
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« Reply #9 on: December 07, 2004, 06:49:05 PM »

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Nice job spelling civilized.

Considering the test is British, they would be spelling it wrong if they used a Z.
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Julien
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« Reply #10 on: December 07, 2004, 06:53:56 PM »


Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Disagree

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Strongly Disagree.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Strongly Disagree.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Disagree.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Strongly Disagree.

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Agree

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Disagree

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Strongly Agree

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Disagree

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Disagree.

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Agree.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Agree
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Storebought
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« Reply #11 on: December 07, 2004, 08:55:41 PM »




Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Strongy DISAGREE. If anything, we aren't profiling enough people

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Strongly DISAGREE. This isn't Massachusetts!

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

AGREE

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

AGREE, but the Death Penalty isn't the cure-all against crime advocates say it is

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Strongly DISAGREE I'm sorry, only a European could print a question this stupid

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

DISAGREE Kandinsky's studies in blue are beautiful

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

AGREE In fact, I'd say that there can be no rehabilitation until there has been retribution.

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Strongly AGREE The Death Penalty could never be applied too inhumanly to these scum (ex. Terrorists, communist traitors, etc.)

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

AGREE, very weakly. Scientists are more important than businessmen

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

DISAGREE, only because our economy no longer really supports a 100% stay-at-home mother

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Strongly DISAGREE It is the moral imperative of industry to manipulate natural material for mankind's benefit. That multinational corporations do so is no real concern for me.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Strongly DISAGREE The Establishment is a UN-coddling, free-interprise smothering brothel of Leftism. The mainstream media functions today just as the Communist Internationale did 80 years ago. The sooner the Establishment is eliminated, the sooner true liberty can return to the US

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StatesRights
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« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2004, 02:38:43 AM »


Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Disagree

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Agree.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Agree

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Strongly Agree.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Agree

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Strongly Agree.

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Strongly Agree.

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Strongly Agree

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Agree

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Light Agree

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Strongly Disagree

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Agree
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Nym90
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« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2004, 04:35:57 AM »

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Strongly Agree.

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Strongly Disagree.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Strongly Disagree.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Disagree.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Agree.

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Disagree.

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Disagree

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Agree.

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Strongly Disagree.

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Disagree.

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Strongly Agree.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Agree.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2004, 04:46:24 AM »

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

U.K context: Disagree. U.S context: Agree

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Strongly Disagree. Fascism is immoral and vile.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Loaded Question

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Strongly Disagree.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Loaded Question

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Strongly Agree (half a cow pickled in a big jar isn't "Art". Unless "con" is added in front of art...)

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Disagree

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Strongly Agree

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Strongly Disagree.

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Loaded Question

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Strongly Agree.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

You guessed it... another Loaded Question!
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minionofmidas
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« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2004, 06:23:46 AM »

Last time I took the Political Compass, there wasn't a "Loaded Question" option.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2004, 06:37:32 AM »

Last time I took the Political Compass, there wasn't a "Loaded Question" option.

Should be
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Storebought
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« Reply #17 on: December 08, 2004, 06:08:41 PM »

I'm actually slightly disappointed in the number of you who chose to "make peace with the establishment." I would encourage making peace with history instead
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Alcon
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« Reply #18 on: December 08, 2004, 06:30:46 PM »

I'm actually slightly disappointed in the number of you who chose to "make peace with the establishment." I would encourage making peace with history instead

That question is loaded. It can be interpreted either as doing whatever the establishment wants or not being violent against the establishment. This is the sort of question that needs to be removed.
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Nym90
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« Reply #19 on: December 08, 2004, 10:05:20 PM »
« Edited: December 08, 2004, 10:07:06 PM by Senator Nym90 »

Ok, I actually have a little more time to explain my answers now.

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Strongly Agree.  Our liberties are what make us different from the terrorists and fascist/communist dictatorships in general. Curbing them is exactly what they want us to do.

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Strongly Disagree. A healthy debate of the issues is always good, even if it does delay progress. True progress requires a full consideration of the issues.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Strongly Disagree. Power tends to corrupt. It's good to limit the amount of power that any one person or group has. I'd rather live with a slightly higher risk of terrorism than know that I'm being watched all the time.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Disagree. The chance of a mistake is too great. I also feel it's immoral for the state to have the right to kill someone.

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Agree, generally. There has to be some sort of structure to any system; we always need leaders. Those below should know fully well that their opinions are valued, but ultimately someone has to be in charge.

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Disagree. It's in the eye of the beholder. As has been said by others, good art really makes you think, and just because it doesn't represent something to you doesn't mean that it isn't meaningful to someone else. While I may personally not see any value in some art, I respect that others may.

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Disagree. Both should be about equally important. Rehabilitation slightly moreso, because I feel that most "bad" people are not inherently bad, rather they've had a bad upbringing and life. The costs of rehabilitation may outweigh the benefits for some, but most people can be rehabilitated. At the same time, there do have to be clear consequences for wrongdoing.

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Agree. Some, yes, though not many. It is too expensive and/or time consuming to rehabilitate some people, unfortunately.

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Strongly Disagree. Equally important; life is about more than just productivity and efficiency, there needs to be leisure and entertainment as well. Anything that makes people happy is valuable, provided that it doesn't unduly compromise the happiness of others, of course.

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Disagree. Families have a duty to take care of children, but men can do it as well as women.

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Strongly Agree. I believe it's morally wrong to make huge profits off of these; corporations should feel an obligation to do what's best for all of humanity.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Agree. Making peace is important, and there's a big difference between making peace and agreeing. One can respectfully disagree without having to be violent about it. The reality is that the establishment is usually right; that's why they are the establishment. That doesn't mean that they are always right, by any means, and authority should always be questioned, but should also be given the benefit of the doubt, assuming a position that they hold is held by the majority of all people. Most people are reasonable. So I'd say that one should make peace with the establishment, but still respectfully and strongly disagree if one is so inclined. But peace is the key word; violent, radical change is unlikely to win approval from enough people to get adopted, and smaller, more mainstream steps first in order to test the potentially unknown effects of the change before moving on to more radical change is what mature, responsible, prudent, pragmatic people do.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #20 on: December 09, 2004, 03:54:56 AM »

Agree. Making peace is important, and there's a big difference between making peace and agreeing. One can respectfully disagree without having to be violent about it. The reality is that the establishment is usually right; that's why they are the establishment. That doesn't mean that they are always right, by any means, and authority should always be questioned, but should also be given the benefit of the doubt, assuming a position that they hold is held by the majority of all people. Most people are reasonable. So I'd say that one should make peace with the establishment, but still respectfully and strongly disagree if one is so inclined. But peace is the key word; violent, radical change is unlikely to win approval from enough people to get adopted, and smaller, more mainstream steps first in order to test the potentially unknown effects of the change before moving on to more radical change is what mature, responsible, prudent, pragmatic people do.

More-or-less my line of thinking (though I think the question is loaded and could mean other things).
Great post, BTW
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The Duke
JohnD.Ford
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« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2004, 02:13:43 AM »

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Disagreeb]- A ludicrous claim.  My side has repeatedly asked for examples from the left, and we hardly ever get any.

A significant advantage of a one-party state is that it avoids all the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system.

Disagree- I really don't see how this is a good thing.  All decisions need to be publcily vetted.

Although the electronic age makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need to be worried.

Agree- No comments.

The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes.

Disagree- No for civilian crimes.  Only things like treason should be eligible, but that's not reall a crime

In a civilised society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to be commanded.

Disagree- Individual intiative and entrepreneurship is better.

Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all.

Agree- The whole point of art is that it DOES represent some feeling the artist has.  Otherwise, it has no meaning.

In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation.

Agree- For the benefit of society, fix these guys up.

It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals.

Agree- While rehab is the first goal, smetimes it can't be done.

The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist.

Agree- The industrialist makes the life of the artist possible.

Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers.

Agree- The first duty of all parents is to their children (this goes for fathers too).

Multinational companies are unethically exploiting the plant genetic resources of developing countries.

Agree- Not a lot of respect for the environment in a lot of their operations.

Making peace with the establishment is an important aspect of maturity

Agree - Gotta stop rebelling sometime.
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The Duke
JohnD.Ford
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« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2004, 02:20:10 AM »

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Strongly Agree.  Our liberties are what make us different from the terrorists and fascist/communist dictatorships in general. Curbing them is exactly what they want us to do.

Actually, they want us to convert to Wahhabism and make Osama bin Laden the Caliph of Earth.  What they don't want is for us to do things that make it easier for us to catch them.
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Nym90
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« Reply #23 on: December 12, 2004, 02:59:06 AM »

Our civil liberties are being excessively curbed in the name of counter-terrorism.

Strongly Agree.  Our liberties are what make us different from the terrorists and fascist/communist dictatorships in general. Curbing them is exactly what they want us to do.

Actually, they want us to convert to Wahhabism and make Osama bin Laden the Caliph of Earth. What they don't want is for us to do things that make it easier for us to catch them.

Agreed, but they also don't want us to have freedom, either. Freedom is one thing that we have that they don't, and I'm loathe to surrender it. I don't want to give up any civil liberties at all unless it can be clearly shown that there is a huge safety benefit. That's just my personal conviction about what I prefer; I fear an intrustive government meddling and spying on our personal affairs, and while I do feel that terrorism needs to be curbed if at all reasonably possible, if it's an even trade of security vs. freedom, I'll take freedom.

I don't support allowing the government to take away someone's civil liberties simply out of suspicon that they are a terrorist. That's too much power and can be abused too easily.
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The Duke
JohnD.Ford
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« Reply #24 on: December 13, 2004, 03:21:45 AM »

John Ford, what do you think about programs such as Magic Lantern? They bother me as a security person.

I actually had to look it up.  I'd never heard of it.

As far as I can tell, the government would need a warrant just like for a wiretap.  If they recieve a warrant, this method of search is acceptable to me.
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