Libya: Benghazi unrest, to Civil War, to a new government and Gaddafi's death.

[Platypus]

I agree. I am not in a fit state to judge the Libyans. Perhaps it would've been nice for him to be put to a trial to face the truth of his regime, but the ICC isn't really much beyond a feel-good way for the west to deal with former dictators and their cronies.

Perhaps if he were to have been tried in Libya, I'd feel more disappointed in his death, but that's also presuming that the new Libyan courts would have had any respect whatsoever for due process. Considering the ICC barely does, that's probably too much to ask for.

[WMS]

I, naturally, am happy to see another tyrant fall. I regret that it was so bloody, but with Gaddafi's regime being what it was there was never any chance of it being otherwise...

I'm also filled with a warm gleeful feeling thinking of how upset Gaddafi's international buddies are - the thought of Fidel Castro, Hugo Chavez, Daniel Ortega, Evo Morales, Rafael Correa, and Robert Mugabe screaming over this makes me smile.

I wonder what the Shinners think of this?

[Јas]

I wonder what the Shinners think of this?

Gaddafi death, the Eta ceasefire and Northern Ireland - Mark Davenport, BBC

[Antonio the Sixth]

Well, yeah, of course we can easily understand the lynchers. Probably a good share of them had a brother, a sister, a parent who was tortured and killed by the regime, probably a good share of them have themselves been in jail for a long time in horrendous conditions. Understanding doesn't mean approving, anyways. The only institution which was legitimate to try Gaddafi would have been an international court. Then, I definitely wouldn't mind if such court had eventually sentenced him to death.

[Landslide Lyndon]

I, naturally, am happy to see another tyrant fall. I regret that it was so bloody, but with Gaddafi's regime being what it was there was never any chance of it being otherwise...

I'm also filled with a warm gleeful feeling thinking of how upset Gaddafi's international buddies are - the thought of Fidel Castro, Hugo Chavez, Daniel Ortega, Evo Morales, Rafael Correa, and Robert Mugabe screaming over this makes me smile.

I wonder what the Shinners think of this?

Ortega, Morales and Correa were elected democratically, so your attempt to tie them with Gaddhafi and Mugabe is a fail of epic proportions.

[The Mikado]

Of all the thousands of people to die in this conflict on both sides, Qaddafi is the one least mourning.  I don't understand condemning the death of a man that fired on unarmed protesters with AA guns back in February.  Where was their due process?  Their trials?  Live by the sword, die by the sword.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Of all the thousands of people to die in this conflict on both sides, Qaddafi is the one least mourning.  I don't understand condemning the death of a man that fired on unarmed protesters with AA guns back in February.  Where was their due process?  Their trials?  Live by the sword, die by the sword.

This is what I mean, yeah. I mean... it's not exactly ideal, but who can blame them? And what right do we have to get outraged? For Gaddafi, see Ceauşescu, I think.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Of all the thousands of people to die in this conflict on both sides, Qaddafi is the one least mourning.  I don't understand condemning the death of a man that fired on unarmed protesters with AA guns back in February.  Where was their due process?  Their trials?  Live by the sword, die by the sword.

This is what I mean, yeah. I mean... it's not exactly ideal, but who can blame them? And what right do we have to get outraged? For Gaddafi, see Ceauşescu, I think.

Has anybody claimed that, though ?

[Lief 🗽]

I have absolutely no problem with Gaddafi being murdered by a mob of angry rebels. If anything there's something cosmically pleasing about it, much like when Ceausescu was executed, as Al brings up. Brutal, lawless dictators should die brutally and lawlessly at the hands of their own people.

[GMantis]

I, naturally, am happy to see another tyrant fall. I regret that it was so bloody, but with Gaddafi's regime being what it was there was never any chance of it being otherwise...

I'm also filled with a warm gleeful feeling thinking of how upset Gaddafi's international buddies are - the thought of Fidel Castro, Hugo Chavez, Daniel Ortega, Evo Morales, Rafael Correa, and Robert Mugabe screaming over this makes me smile.

I wonder what the Shinners think of this?

Ortega, Morales and Correa were elected democratically, so your attempt to tie them with Gaddhafi and Mugabe is a fail of epic proportions.

Wasn't Chavez also democratically elected?

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

the video was a trip...as are all Islamic executions.  It's never a solemn occasion, rather it is filled with a yodelling style chant to Allah.   Even in Sadam's state hanging (or even in the beheadings carried out by al Qaeda), the execution mob sounds like a pack of laughing hyenas enjoying the ripping of flesh.

But executions aren't solemn in America either, jmfcst. They're clinical, which isn't the same thing, and which is in a lot of ways an even worse attitude towards death than absurdist celebration.

[lowtech redneck]

I, naturally, am happy to see another tyrant fall. I regret that it was so bloody, but with Gaddafi's regime being what it was there was never any chance of it being otherwise...

I'm also filled with a warm gleeful feeling thinking of how upset Gaddafi's international buddies are - the thought of Fidel Castro, Hugo Chavez, Daniel Ortega, Evo Morales, Rafael Correa, and Robert Mugabe screaming over this makes me smile.

I wonder what the Shinners think of this?

Ortega, Morales and Correa were elected democratically, so your attempt to tie them with Gaddhafi and Mugabe is a fail of epic proportions.

Wasn't Chavez also democratically elected?

Yes, he is a democratically elected tyrant in control of an illiberal democracy that oppresses the opposition.

[phk]

I only wish what happened to Musa al-Sadr was revealed.

[Middle-aged Europe]

Those bloodthirsty Brits...

[2952-0-0]

To play a devil's advocate, what if Adolf Hitler fled Berlin and was found hiding in a pipe under a highway just outside Tel Aviv in 1950? Would he be treated any more humanely than Gaddafi?

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Those bloodthirsty Brits...

~

Like Libyan rebels ever heard or cared about Yvonne Fletcher.

[Хahar 🤔]

I have absolutely no problem with Gaddafi being murdered by a mob of angry rebels. If anything there's something cosmically pleasing about it, much like when Ceausescu was executed, as Al brings up. Brutal, lawless dictators should die brutally and lawlessly at the hands of their own people.

Yeah, they don't deserve execution, particularly not in its modern, sanitized form.

[J. J.]

To play a devil's advocate, what if Adolf Hitler fled Berlin and was found hiding in a pipe under a highway just outside Tel Aviv in 1950? Would he be treated any more humanely than Gaddafi?

The Israelis actually did try Eichmann.

That said, Gaddafi alive was very dangerous.  I can live with the summary execution.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Let's talk about class...

When FDR died, Japanese Government, although the two sides waged a total war against each other, actually did offer condolences to the American people, following death of "the great man".

Now, compare it to some Western leaders reactions (especially laughing Hillary) on Gaddafi death, even if they were almost bowing to him before revolution started.

So, regardless of our opinions of Gaddafi himself, let's compare behavior of those "savage Japs" with current Western, civilized leaders.

[Lief 🗽]

FDR committed crimes against humanity against his own people?

Anyway, we all know the Japanese are more civilized than Americans, but not for anything to do with this situation.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

FDR committed crimes against humanity against his own people?

You missed the point. It's impossible to compare FDR with Gaddafi, of course. But we must remember there was no more hated foreign leader in Japan in 1940s than Roosevelt. Yet, class of Japanese officials was astonishing.

Also, Gaddafi was U.S. ally recently.

[WMS]

I, naturally, am happy to see another tyrant fall. I regret that it was so bloody, but with Gaddafi's regime being what it was there was never any chance of it being otherwise...

I'm also filled with a warm gleeful feeling thinking of how upset Gaddafi's international buddies are - the thought of Fidel Castro, Hugo Chavez, Daniel Ortega, Evo Morales, Rafael Correa, and Robert Mugabe screaming over this makes me smile.

I wonder what the Shinners think of this?

Ortega, Morales and Correa were elected democratically, so your attempt to tie them with Gaddhafi and Mugabe is a fail of epic proportions.

Are you really this goddamned stupid? I was referring to all those leaders who backed Gaddafi during the Libyan Civil War, you f***tard! Have you paid no attention to the international aspect of this? Do some basic research, boy, before you accuse me of an epic fail.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

Let's talk about class...

When FDR died, Japanese Government, although the two sides waged a total war against each other, actually did offer condolences to the American people, following death of "the great man".

Now, compare it to some Western leaders reactions (especially laughing Hillary) on Gaddafi death, even if they were almost bowing to him before revolution started.

So, regardless of our opinions of Gaddafi himself, let's compare behavior of those "savage Japs" with current Western, civilized leaders.

Well, Japan and America were at war. Declared war. So there were "rules". The US sent condolences to North Vietnam after Ho Chi Minh died, if I am not mistaken (though Vietnam was not a declared conflict), and the US frequently sent our condolences to the USSR in the 1980's, when the 3 leaders in a row died. Qaddafi truly hated the USA, and our people. And not for the classic Bush line "they hate our freedom". He hated us (along with Bin Laden and A-Jad) for our support of Israel. And that inspired Qaddafi to attack us (Pam Am 103, Berlin, etc). Japan also hated America in WW2, but if the chain of events that led to that war in the 1930's didn't happen, we most likely would be on friendly-frenemy terms (like the US and Russia today). Tojo was, to some extent, a "legitimate" leader. The Japanese people, by all accounts, did not resist his rule. The same can be said for Minh in North Vietnam. Qaddafi, on the other hand, has always been widely hated.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Let's talk about class...

When FDR died, Japanese Government, although the two sides waged a total war against each other, actually did offer condolences to the American people, following death of "the great man".

Now, compare it to some Western leaders reactions (especially laughing Hillary) on Gaddafi death, even if they were almost bowing to him before revolution started.

So, regardless of our opinions of Gaddafi himself, let's compare behavior of those "savage Japs" with current Western, civilized leaders.

Well, Japan and America were at war. Declared war. So there were "rules". The US sent condolences to North Vietnam after Ho Chi Minh died, if I am not mistaken (though Vietnam was not a declared conflict), and the US frequently sent our condolences to the USSR in the 1980's, when the 3 leaders in a row died.

Again... I don't recall Richard Nixon laughing publicly at Ho Chi Minh death.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Gaddafi was never taken particularly seriously. When Western governments started talking to him again (something that was, of course, essentially a consensus position at the time) it wasn't because they suddenly respected him; it was because of the money. Because that's the way these things work.