Conservatives, what is your most liberal aspect(s)? & vice versa

[Gustaf]

I have to admit I have a little trouble with this.  I keep thinking about the terms Left and Right.  Which we get from France.  (I have no problems with the most of the French people whom I've met.)  The aristocracy sat to the right (droit) of the king and the unwashed masses sat to the left (gauche) of the king.  So, if you're poor you probably support socialized medicine, etc.  If you're rich, you probably say, "let them eat cake."  But, on non-economic issues, how do we define liberal?  Can you give me a succint definition, so that I might consider whether my positions on non-economic issues are 'liberal' or 'conservative'.

Thanks for the history lesson, though I was aware of the hitory of left and right...

I link conservatism to Hobbes and Golding, the belief that man is evil and has to be controlled by a strong state, i.e. a strong law and order. I also link it to Burke and the concept of pragmatism, not being to interested in moral principles. Liberals, in the classic sense, which I THINK is appliable even in the US on social issues, value the individual and want to keep the state out of people's lives. With that base I find it easy to characterize opposition to capital punishment as liberal.

[angus]

I have to admit I have a little trouble with this.  I keep thinking about the terms Left and Right.  Which we get from France.  (I have no problems with the most of the French people whom I've met.)  The aristocracy sat to the right (droit) of the king and the unwashed masses sat to the left (gauche) of the king.  So, if you're poor you probably support socialized medicine, etc.  If you're rich, you probably say, "let them eat cake."  But, on non-economic issues, how do we define liberal?  Can you give me a succint definition, so that I might consider whether my positions on non-economic issues are 'liberal' or 'conservative'.

Thanks for the history lesson, though I was aware of the hitory of left and right...

I link conservatism to Hobbes and Golding, the belief that man is evil and has to be controlled by a strong state, i.e. a strong law and order. I also link it to Burke and the concept of pragmatism, not being to interested in moral principles. Liberals, in the classic sense, which I THINK is appliable even in the US on social issues, value the individual and want to keep the state out of people's lives. With that base I find it easy to characterize opposition to capital punishment as liberal.

Given Burke, I am extremely conservative.  Given Hobbes and Golding, I am extremely liberal.  Take your pick.  I support decriminalization of prostitution, marijuana, and all forms of gambling.  I also support the right to keep and bear arms and the right to terminate a pregnancy and the right to keep your hard-earned paycheck.  I'm a strong believer in questioning all authority as well.  For me, those come from the same place.  Limited government.  Yet some of those positions are rather arbitrarily labelled liberal while others are arbitrarily labelled conservative.  

I think NickG hit the nail on the head when he said that the unfortunate language used by many 'liberals' in opposition to abortion restrictions is insulting to individuals who come to their Pro-Life positions from deeply held moral beliefs.  Teresa Heinz Kerry gave a wonderful interview to the NYT, a few weeks ago, in which she excoriated those who use such offensive (and rather unsophisticated) language as 'keep your laws offa my body' in defense of abortion rights.  I appreciated her insight.

In any case, I can't imagine that a candidate's position on such trivial matters as abortion rights and homosexual marriage would affect something important as the selection of our Commander-in-Chief.

[Gustaf]

I have to admit I have a little trouble with this.  I keep thinking about the terms Left and Right.  Which we get from France.  (I have no problems with the most of the French people whom I've met.)  The aristocracy sat to the right (droit) of the king and the unwashed masses sat to the left (gauche) of the king.  So, if you're poor you probably support socialized medicine, etc.  If you're rich, you probably say, "let them eat cake."  But, on non-economic issues, how do we define liberal?  Can you give me a succint definition, so that I might consider whether my positions on non-economic issues are 'liberal' or 'conservative'.

Thanks for the history lesson, though I was aware of the hitory of left and right...

I link conservatism to Hobbes and Golding, the belief that man is evil and has to be controlled by a strong state, i.e. a strong law and order. I also link it to Burke and the concept of pragmatism, not being to interested in moral principles. Liberals, in the classic sense, which I THINK is appliable even in the US on social issues, value the individual and want to keep the state out of people's lives. With that base I find it easy to characterize opposition to capital punishment as liberal.

Given Burke, I am extremely conservative.  Given Hobbes and Golding, I am extremely liberal.  Take your pick.  I support decriminalization of prostitution, marijuana, and all forms of gambling.  I also support the right to keep and bear arms and the right to terminate a pregnancy and the right to keep your hard-earned paycheck.  I'm a strong believer in questioning all authority as well.  For me, those come from the same place.  Limited government.  Yet some of those positions are rather arbitrarily labelled liberal while others are arbitrarily labelled conservative.  

I think NickG hit the nail on the head when he said that the unfortunate language used by many 'liberals' in opposition to abortion restrictions is insulting to individuals who come to their Pro-Life positions from deeply held moral beliefs.  Teresa Heinz Kerry gave a wonderful interview to the NYT, a few weeks ago, in which she excoriated those who use such offensive (and rather unsophisticated) language as 'keep your laws offa my body' in defense of abortion rights.  I appreciated her insight.

In any case, I can't imagine that a candidate's position on such trivial matters as abortion rights and homosexual marriage would affect something important as the selection of our Commander-in-Chief.

Well, this problem occurs b/c you Americans messed up the political labels... You're basically a liberal, in the real sense. That makes you conservative on some issues and liberal on other in the American context and makes you seem inconcsistent. But you're basically a classic liberal.

[California Dreamer]

Pro Vouchers (our family sent us all to catholic school, could have used a hand)

Pro NAFTA and free trade

Pro Balanced Budget Ammendment

Pro Burger Bill (no suing cause Mc Donalds made you fat)

Pro Tort Reform (frivilous lawsuits drive up costs)

Anti Affirmative action


...I am also for a lot of thigns that I think should be considered 'conservative' but are considered liberal for some reason:

Pro envirnonmental protections

Pro civil liberties

Pro equal rights (including gay civil unions)

[angus]

Thank you.  I have saying just that, as you well know from my previous posts.  

But don't go around calling me a 'liberal' as it is a very pejorative term in some circles    

[Gustaf]

Thank you.  I have saying just that, as you well know from my previous posts.  

But don't go around calling me a 'liberal' as it is a very pejorative term in some circles    

Lol, of course not, the L-word will not pass my lips as a reference to you, oh, ye mighty arch-conservative.

And I'll add being against AA like CD is.

[© tweed]

One thing I can think of:  Free Trade.

If I was a senator, I would be the most pro-free trade senator in US History.  No joke.

[GOPhound]

I'm a seriously staunch conservative politically.  Definitely to the right of W, more along the lines of a Cheney or Ashcroft.  It's difficult for me to think of an issue that I'm, let's say, progressive on.

I'd say humane treatment of animals is something that hits home with me.  I love animals and revile hunting.  Those hunting shows on ESPN make me sick.  

What else....hmmm, I guess somewhat on abortion.  I support it only in the first trimester, after that I'm against it under all circumstances, with the exception of the life of the mother being at risk.

[CTguy]

I think it says a lot that some people here are trivializing gay rights and abortion rights.  Perhaps if you were gay or having an abortion it wouldn't be so trivial.  

And I agree with the previous poster...  hunting is a disgusting "sport."

[Wakie]

I'm a gun rights guy ... but I staunchly favor background checks.

I favor small government.

I'm very shaky on the whole abortion issue.

[zachman]

I don't really care about social security, I'm
for responsible spending, and I am pro-free trade.

[dazzleman]

I would say that I support certain liberal goals, but not the methods that liberals use to achieve those goals.

I believe in equality of opportunity, to the greatest extent possible, but I am enough of a realist to know that it is not within the power of government to equalize everybody's opportunity.  We are all born into, and raised with, certain circumstances, both good and bad, that make our opportunities in life unequal.  But we should not allow anybody's opportunities to be limited by factors such as race, gender, etc.

I believe in racial equality, but to me that doesn't mean that government should designate certain groups as perennial victims, and favor them over other citizens.  I also don't think that government should be in the business of telling people where to live or go to school, based on skin color.  I don't believe that racial equality will ultimately come through government, but through private initiative, and I think the failure of the civil rights movement to move beyond dependency on government has set black progress back substantially.

I have no objection to background checks for people buying guns, but I don't believe gun control is the answer to our crime problems.  The same people who strongly favor gun control are the ones who have undermined law enforcement by claiming every criminal is really a victim.  Those who are not constrained by laws against robbery and murder will not be constrained by laws against gun possession.

I favor certain anti-poverty programs, those that teach initiative and self-reliance, rather than liberal-style programs that foster dependency and encourage the type of behavior that can only perpetuate the cycle of poverty.

I am not against rehabilitation for criminals, but it has to be accompanied by punishment too.  The "rehabilitation only" philosophy of the liberals has only led to inexorably higher crime rates.

With respect to the financial markets, I think that every effort should be made to allow average investors to have the same level of information as fat-cat insiders, so they can more easily keep from being taken advantage of.

I am relatively tolerant of gay rights.  I don't think that gays should face discrimination in employment, housing, etc.  But I think the institution of marriage should be reserved to the union of one man and one woman.

[ilikeverin]

I'm Gen X Politics-a-riffic!

Conservative:

1. (This has somebow become conservative... I don't know why...) BALANCE THE BUDGET!  NOW!  GAH!

2. Free Trade is good.  More good products for us

[opebo]

I'm very socially liberal - basically a Liberal with the capital L, or a 'libertarian'.
Issues I would disagree most with the GOP:

1) Legalization of prostitution.
2) Legalization of drugs.

[angus]

good to hear you chime in on this.  been waiting for rightwingnut.

[opebo]

good to hear you chime in on this.  been waiting for rightwingnut.

angus, ever read Republican Party Reptile by P.J. O'Rourke?  I like his vision of a right-winger who enjoys life's pleasures.

[angus]

know it well my friend.  that deserves its own thread, but not here.

how's life back in the USA.

[opebo]

know it well my friend.  that deserves its own thread, but not here.

how's life back in the USA.

Thanks for asking.. I have to admit its a difficult adjustment.  Though I like being American, I generally don't like living here that much.  I don't like being one of those people who go abroad and then complain when they get home... but I will there's too much driving to be done here (driving makes me tense), I really can't stand the food, and everything's expensive.  

But it is interesting to see how things are going back home.  I was surprised to see 'Help Wanted' signs everywhere in the St. Louis and eastern Missouri area, even in small towns.. of course these were for below-subsistence $7-10 an hour type jobs, but still not a bad sign for the economy.

[angus]

know it well my friend.  that deserves its own thread, but not here.

how's life back in the USA.

Thanks for asking.. I have to admit its a difficult adjustment.  Though I like being American, I generally don't like living here that much.  I don't like being one of those people who go abroad and then complain when they get home... but I will there's too much driving to be done here (driving makes me tense), I really can't stand the food, and everything's expensive.  

But it is interesting to see how things are going back home.  I was surprised to see 'Help Wanted' signs everywhere in the St. Louis and eastern Missouri area, even in small towns.. of course these were for below-subsistence $7-10 an hour type jobs, but still not a bad sign for the economy.

Full faith and credit in whatever papers you carry are what cause '...noble kings and princes to bow when'eer they come...'  Let's hope that your observations speak for your state.  

[TheWildCard]

1. I'm very moderate on the abortion issue(though in recent months I've started to lean more to the right on this issue....)
2. I'm Pro Civil-Unions
3. I am against tobacco products such as cigs and cigars(But I'm not against chewing tobacco)
4.I'm for stronger gun control laws such as back ground checks whenever you buy a gun and I'm for gun locks on all new guns.

and for the heck of it I'm very Conservitive on economic issues, I'm also pro Death penalty, I dislike the way Affirmitive Action is currently set up, and I'm against welfare for those who don't go out and at least try to find a job.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

I don't like abortions but think that banning it would only benifit the manufacturers of wire coat-hangers...

I'm anti-free trade

[Gustaf]

Ok I am a Libertarian, which most folks confuse with conservative, but here goes..

1) Don't like Death Penalty.
       a)  - I think making 'em rot in Jail for 50 years is actually worse punishment
       b) -  There are documented cases where innocent people have been convicted
       c) -   Poor people with bad lawyers get executed for murder, rich people with good laywers get 8-12 for manslaughter
       d) - I am unable to draw that fine a moral line in my own mind.  Usually it is not enough to "just" kill somebody - usually there has to be a "special circumstance" - So if you kill and rape, you die, but not if you "just" kill...  What about 1 murder, two robberies, 5 assualts and 87 parking tickets.. where EXACTLY do you draw the line between life and death.. I do not feel I personally am able to draw that line.

2) Gay Marriage
        a) - How two consenting adults define the terms of their own private personal relationship is the business of the government because....? (waiting for an answer...)

3) War on Drugs
        a) - Tossing a 18 year old with 2 ounces of pot into Jail for 20 years, costing the taxpayer millions in prison costs, wrecking his family, and defacto making it impossible for that person to ever have a productive life is good public public because...? (waiting for an answer...)

       

Lol, we have too many heated debates on gay marriage already...

I certainly wouldn't confuse libertarian with liberal...when did it become 'THE Vorlon'?

[dazzleman]

My most liberal aspect is probably my belief that the legal system discriminates against people who don't have a lot of money.

That's not to say that I think the legal system is too hard on criminals from poor backgrounds.  I think it is too easy on rich and famous people.

I think that if you are rich enough, and can get the right lawyer, you can either beat legitimate charges, or reduce your punishment to far less than it would be if you were the average Joe.

Because it takes a lot of money to utilize our slow and ponderous legal system, it inherently favors those who can afford to wade through the whole legal thicket, while those without the resources to do that are forced to settle cases, even if they are right.

On the civil side, so many cases are settled wrongly because it would cost too much money to see the case through legally, and there is so little confidence of a sensible result in any case.

[StevenNick]

My economic philosophy can be summed up in one word, PRIVITIZE.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I am against Affirmative Action in its current form.

I have some viewpoints which are more libertarian than liberal, but not neccesarily all that alien to liberals, such as on drugs and prostitution.

I am against gay marriage, but I am against heterosexual marriage as well. I think the government should only recognize civil unions for ALL couples, and leave marriage out of it altogether and leave that to the churches. However as long as the government recognizes heterosexual marriage I believe there should be gay marriage as well, as an equal rights issue.  Definately not a conservative position but worth mentioning.

eh, that's about it. and just to chime in, I am anti-death penalty and anti-free trade.