How would you vote ...

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

BTW: Has any country ever voted in a draft referendum ? And did it vote Yes ?

Canada did during WWII. Passed overwhelmingly everywhere except Quebec.

[Tender Branson]

New poll by OGM for "Kurier" newspaper:



Should the draft be abolished ?

54% YES (Men: 50%, Women: 58%)
41% NO (Men: 44%, Women: 38%)

If the draft is abolished, with what should it be replaced ?

67% Professional army
27% Volunteer army

Should there be a mandatory "Social Year" instead of the Civil Service ?

69% In Favor (Men: 79%, Women: 60%)
27% Opposed (Men: 19%, Women: 36%)

[Franzl]

Saying no to the draft and yes to the mandatory social year is the ultimate moderate hero position.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Peace and love, man. And no reports or infractions for nobody.

[YL]

I'd vote to abolish the draft.

[Хahar 🤔]

BTW: Has any country ever voted in a draft referendum ? And did it vote Yes ?

Canada did during WWII. Passed overwhelmingly everywhere except Quebec.

IIRC, conscription was never implemented because of the degree of Francophone opposition.

[Tender Branson]

Side fact:

My parents, who are both right-leaning voters, will vote to abolish the draft.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

BTW: Has any country ever voted in a draft referendum ? And did it vote Yes ?

Canada did during WWII. Passed overwhelmingly everywhere except Quebec.

IIRC, conscription was never implemented because of the degree of Francophone opposition.

It was, but only near the end of the war.

[Tender Branson]

Defense Minister Norbert Darabos (SPÖ) prefers the Swedish army model:

A professional army with a militia component, in which each soldier starts with a pay of 2500$ a month, 14 times a year. Each soldier would have to sign up for 8 years of service, for a total of 20.000 soldiers.

The Civil Service would be scrapped and a all-voluntary Social Year would be introduced instead. The SPÖ thinks 4000 people will volunteer each year because the starting wage would be about 1900$ a month, 14-times a year, which would be about 4 times more than what a Civil Servant now gets.

The ÖVP and FPÖ have already said that they strongly oppose these plans and that they are in favor of keeping the draft and the Civil Service.

SPÖ, Greens and BZÖ favor the SPÖ plan.

SPÖ, Greens, BZÖ have a 94-88 majority in the parliament, with 1 Independent (former BZÖ).

There's a new Gallup poll out today, in which Austrians would favor the professional army by 60-31 over the draft, if there were a referendum on the issue.

http://derstandard.at/1293370749550/Darabos-fuer-schwedisches-Modell

[Franzl]

Any chance of the government breaking over this?

At any rate, congratluations for recognizing what the correct thing to do is....

[Tender Branson]

Any chance of the government breaking over this?

At any rate, congratluations for recognizing what the correct thing to do is....

Could be. The issue is very polarizing and important and Austrian coalitions have already fallen because of issues that were much less important -> see 2008.

Let's see what the party of "no" (ÖVP) does in the next months.

[Tender Branson]

For anyone who can read German (Franzl, Lewis etc.) here's a good article about the issue:

Weg mit der Wehrpflicht! Warum das Bundesheer völlig neu definiert gehört.

[Antonio the Sixth]

What the hell, they still have conscription in Austria ?

Horrendous. Abolish it immediately.

[Franzl]

What the hell, they still have conscription in Austria ?

Horrendous. Abolish it immediately.

We still do in Germany as well......until the 1st of July officially

[Franzl]

For anyone who can read German (Franzl, Lewis etc.) here's a good article about the issue:

Weg mit der Wehrpflicht! Warum das Bundesheer völlig neu definiert gehört.

Good article, BTW.

[Antonio the Sixth]

What the hell, they still have conscription in Austria ?

Horrendous. Abolish it immediately.

We still do in Germany as well......until the 1st of July officially

So you actually did your military service ? Well, congratulations.

The two only good things Chirac has ever done were abolishing conscription and opposing the Irak war.

[Franzl]

No, Antonio....I have a good lawyer. I didn't do military service

[Antonio the Sixth]

No, Antonio....I have a good lawyer. I didn't do military service

You dirty privileged...

Seriously though, I would also probably have tried any possible way to escape it.

[Franzl]

No, Antonio....I have a good lawyer. I didn't do military service

You dirty privileged...

Seriously though, I would also probably have tried any possible way to escape it.

Yeah it's pretty crazy, the way it works in Germany right now. Only about 50% of 18-year olds are declared "medically fit" to serve......and of those, only about 50% ever actually get a letter telling them to report for duty.

Unfortunately, I was unlucky on both

[Antonio the Sixth]

No, Antonio....I have a good lawyer. I didn't do military service

You dirty privileged...

Seriously though, I would also probably have tried any possible way to escape it.

Yeah it's pretty crazy, the way it works in Germany right now. Only about 50% of 18-year olds are declared "medically fit" to serve......and of those, only about 50% ever actually get a letter telling them to report for duty.

Unfortunately, I was unlucky on both

What do you need to be "mentally fit" to serve in the military ? I thought officers prefered when their soldiers don't think too much.

[Chancellor of the Duchy of Little Lever and Darcy Lever]

No, Antonio....I have a good lawyer. I didn't do military service

You dirty privileged...

Seriously though, I would also probably have tried any possible way to escape it.

Yeah it's pretty crazy, the way it works in Germany right now. Only about 50% of 18-year olds are declared "medically fit" to serve......and of those, only about 50% ever actually get a letter telling them to report for duty.

Unfortunately, I was unlucky on both

What do you need to be "mentally fit" to serve in the military ? I thought officers prefered when their soldiers don't think too much.

Officers don't want loose cannons either (if you'll excuse the analogy).  If you're going to order someone to fly a helicopter somewhere you want to make sure the person receiving the orders is capable of carrying them out.  That takes training, skill and some sort of mental competence.  Repeat argument for tanks, artillery, drill, teamwork etc.

[Tender Branson]

No, Antonio....I have a good lawyer. I didn't do military service

You dirty privileged...

Seriously though, I would also probably have tried any possible way to escape it.

Yeah it's pretty crazy, the way it works in Germany right now. Only about 50% of 18-year olds are declared "medically fit" to serve......and of those, only about 50% ever actually get a letter telling them to report for duty.

Unfortunately, I was unlucky on both

What do you need to be "mentally fit" to serve in the military ? I thought officers prefered when their soldiers don't think too much.

In Austria, about 15% of those drafted each year are determined "unfit" for service due to medical or psychlogical reasons, including me. That's why I had the luck to do neither service: military, nor civil service ...

[Antonio the Sixth]

No, Antonio....I have a good lawyer. I didn't do military service

You dirty privileged...

Seriously though, I would also probably have tried any possible way to escape it.

Yeah it's pretty crazy, the way it works in Germany right now. Only about 50% of 18-year olds are declared "medically fit" to serve......and of those, only about 50% ever actually get a letter telling them to report for duty.

Unfortunately, I was unlucky on both

What do you need to be "mentally fit" to serve in the military ? I thought officers prefered when their soldiers don't think too much.

In Austria, about 15% of those drafted each year are determined "unfit" for service due to medical or psychlogical reasons, including me. That's why I had the luck to do neither service: military, nor civil service ...

Do you take a test or something like that to be deemed unfit ? How does than work.

And @belgiansoc : It was supposed to be a joke.

[Insula Dei]

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That's why I didn't react to it. You got me mixed up with andrewteale

No big deal, I sometimes also mix him up with myself and consequently am puzzled at what I wrote for a couple of instants. No idea why he has a Belgian avatar. Maybe this is an occasion for him to explain that.

[Chancellor of the Duchy of Little Lever and Darcy Lever]

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That's why I didn't react to it. You got me mixed up with andrewteale

No big deal, I sometimes also mix him up with myself and consequently am puzzled at what I wrote for a couple of instants. No idea why he has a Belgian avatar. Maybe this is an occasion for him to explain that.

My foreign trips this year are to Flanders.  Leuven and Ostend in May/June, Brugge in November.  I have some friends on the Flemish quiz circuit.

Seems as good an excuse as any to declare myself Belgian.