Anyone seen this:

[Andrew]

In 2000, when a badly flawed ballot design favored Bush in Florida, Republicans blamed the voters.  This absentee ballot, with a clearly flawed design, favors Kerry.  If Kerry wins Ohio by a very slim margin, will Republicans again blame the voters?

[A18]

What is flawed about it?

[SirMuxALot]

I'd also note that the Cuyahoga County Board of Elections is split evenly, 2 Democrats, 2 Republicans.  And the Chairman is a Republican.  Just so this thread doesn't start to go down that road...

Even though it's a strong Democrat county, it's a big county, population-wise.  Bush drew over 192,000 votes in the county in 2000.  So this could have an impact.

[Alcon]

Yeah, that's what I've never understood. People point out voter fraud by saying that more people registered in a certain county than there are people in that county, and that county is heavily Democratic. That doesn't mean the Democrats are the one comitting the fraud.

[Jake]

I'd also note that the Cuyahoga County Board of Elections is split evenly, 2 Democrats, 2 Republicans.  And the Chairman is a Republican.  Just so this thread doesn't start to go down that road...

Even though it's a strong Democrat county, it's a big county, population-wise.  Bush drew over 192,000 votes in the county in 2000.  So this could have an impact.

It just means that whoever made the ballot, are morons.

[SirMuxALot]

Bah! Why do news sites have to require registration.

Sorry, didn't require registration on my end.

Key bits:

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Also:

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[Andrew]

What is flawed about it?

I'll assume you're being serious.

The instructions say to ". . . punch the hole beside the number for the set of candidates of your choice."  The hole beside the number for Bush and Cheney is hole #14.  The hole you must punch to actually vote for Bush and Cheney is hole #4.

If this is not a ballot design flaw, then there is no such thing.

[??????????]

Why is Bush on the bottom in the first place? That makes no sense whatsoever.

[jimrtex]

Ohio ballot - it sucks beyond belief...

Looking at Cuyahoga County's web site:

Cuyahoga County Board of Elections

It appears that the candidate order is different in each precinct.  One I picked at random had "Disqualified Candidate" first, followed by Badnarik and Peroutka, and finally Bush and Kerry.

So this would imply that candidates are given different hole numbers in each precinct (I wonder what safeguards they have to avoid mixing ballots?).   They would simply have to print a dozen or so guides with the candidates in the correct order for each precinct.

Absentee voters would use the hole numbers for their voting precinct.  But there would have to be 10s of thousands of voter guides printed.  Rather than doing a customized printing for each precinct, it might be easier to print all the guides with one order, and add in the hole numbers.

The problem is if people follow the arrows.  When Harris County used punch cards, I would always follow the arrows.  I was not aware until Palm Beach 2000 that the holes were numbered.  In the particular example shown, it is even worse, since you might assume that the tens digit of the number was lost (the arrows are apparently pointing at holes "12" and "14", though they are labelled "2" and "4".

[Democratic Hawk]

What in the hell? I can't make heads nor tails of it.

Me neither!

Dave

[stry_cat]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6322737/

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I wonder if this is the idiot who designed the ballot or who is just taking the fall.

[SirMuxALot]

It appears that the candidate order is different in each precinct.  One I picked at random had "Disqualified Candidate" first, followed by Badnarik and Peroutka, and finally Bush and Kerry.

So this would imply that candidates are given different hole numbers in each precinct (I wonder what safeguards they have to avoid mixing ballots?).

Well spotted, jimrtex.  You're right, it appears they've randomized the ballot order in each precinct.

I'm sure ballots are kept seperate by precinct, even when they are taken back to wherever they end up for counting.  And I'm sure it's not that difficult to re-set the counting machines.  Presumably the arrows in the voting booths will line up, so this shouldn't result in big problems with polling-place ballots.

But the absentee ballots are another matter.  It's almost certain that there will be a higher rate of "voter error" among the absentees.  Since the ballot order is randomized, it could be that any of the candidates arrows won't line up.  As such, it should impact each candidate proportionally.

And since Cuyahoga county was a strong Gore county in 2000 (Gore 63%, Bush 33%), this may end up costing Kerry more votes among absentees, by about 2:1 margin.  (Assuming absentees party IDs are proportional to voter registration/turnout, which may not be the case.)

As soon as any Democrat lawyer picks up on this (or reads this thread?), this will be in court.  So, yes, it's official.  Ohio will be the Florida of 2004.

[khirkhib]

My ballot is pretty well designed though they didn't say what type of pen or pencil to use.

[A18]

What is flawed about it?

I'll assume you're being serious.

The instructions say to ". . . punch the hole beside the number for the set of candidates of your choice."  The hole beside the number for Bush and Cheney is hole #14.  The hole you must punch to actually vote for Bush and Cheney is hole #4.

If this is not a ballot design flaw, then there is no such thing.

It has a huge 4 with an arrow next to it.

[willhsmit]

From what I see of the picture, both the left and the right portions have been cropped to make them the same size (there are obviously numbers 1 and 2 on the punch card not shown in the picture). In practice I would doubt they are the same size.

I've voted absentee in previous elections using a similar punchcard and it would never have occurred to me to line them up like that. For one thing, you need to hold the card with one hand while punching a hole with a sharp object held in the other. Which hand do you use to hold the instruction paper with? For another, the punch card is totally separate from the instruction booklet (and much smaller in both dimensions), the instruction booklet probably has a much larger margin than is shown in the picture, and there is no indication on the booklet at what offset to line up the shorter card. By changing the offset, I could easily make the card line up with the Bush setting.

[Andrew]

What is flawed about it?

I'll assume you're being serious.

The instructions say to ". . . punch the hole beside the number for the set of candidates of your choice."  The hole beside the number for Bush and Cheney is hole #14.  The hole you must punch to actually vote for Bush and Cheney is hole #4.

If this is not a ballot design flaw, then there is no such thing.

It has a huge 4 with an arrow next to it.

And the hole next to that number, which the instructions say to punch, is hole #14, not hole #4.

[willhsmit]

I'll assume you're being serious.

The instructions say to ". . . punch the hole beside the number for the set of candidates of your choice."  The hole beside the number for Bush and Cheney is hole #14.  The hole you must punch to actually vote for Bush and Cheney is hole #4.

If this is not a ballot design flaw, then there is no such thing.

It has a huge 4 with an arrow next to it.

And the hole next to that number, which the instructions say to punch, is hole #14, not hole #4.

Again, the words "next to" don't really apply in this case. If you place any two pieces of paper next to each other, you can make anything on one paper line up to anything on the other by moving one piece up and down. I guarantee that, in this case, the difference in size between the two pieces means that no way of lining them up is any more logical or intuitive than any other.