Who won?

[bgwah]

I was laughing because he's...well, stupid.

Yeah he was so "stupid" that he graduated from Yale. Don't you guys get tired of this "Bush is dumb!" stuff? I mean...the guy stumbles on a word here and there and you are rolling on the floor laughing hysterically. Pretty pathetic.

What were his grades, C average?

He is stupid. Or perhaps I just incorrectly learned how to pronounce the words "nuk-u-lar" and "murk-erry."

I bet you couldn't get a 'C' average at Yale.

I bet I could. But I can't blame Bush. After all, he IS a southerner. Expecting him to be intelligent is asking a lot.

Talk a long walk into a hot Mount Saint Helens.

Thanks for proving my point.

[Nym90]

I was laughing because he's...well, stupid.

Yeah he was so "stupid" that he graduated from Yale. Don't you guys get tired of this "Bush is dumb!" stuff? I mean...the guy stumbles on a word here and there and you are rolling on the floor laughing hysterically. Pretty pathetic.

What were his grades, C average?

He is stupid. Or perhaps I just incorrectly learned how to pronounce the words "nuk-u-lar" and "murk-erry."

C average....at Yale! Anywhere else that's pretty good. And you want to talk about mispronouncing words? How about John Kerry's "Lambert" field statements. Maybe you don't know but Kerry was referring to the stadium where the Green Bay Packers play - Lambeau Field. But he's not stupid right?

He probably inadvertantly thought of the St. Louis airport instead.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I was laughing because he's...well, stupid.

Yeah he was so "stupid" that he graduated from Yale. Don't you guys get tired of this "Bush is dumb!" stuff? I mean...the guy stumbles on a word here and there and you are rolling on the floor laughing hysterically. Pretty pathetic.

What were his grades, C average?

He is stupid. Or perhaps I just incorrectly learned how to pronounce the words "nuk-u-lar" and "murk-erry."

I bet you couldn't get a 'C' average at Yale.

I bet I could. But I can't blame Bush. After all, he IS a southerner. Expecting him to be intelligent is asking a lot.

he's not really a southerner

[Nym90]

I was laughing because he's...well, stupid.

Yeah he was so "stupid" that he graduated from Yale. Don't you guys get tired of this "Bush is dumb!" stuff? I mean...the guy stumbles on a word here and there and you are rolling on the floor laughing hysterically. Pretty pathetic.

What were his grades, C average?

He is stupid. Or perhaps I just incorrectly learned how to pronounce the words "nuk-u-lar" and "murk-erry."

C average....at Yale! Anywhere else that's pretty good. And you want to talk about mispronouncing words? How about John Kerry's "Lambert" field statements. Maybe you don't know but Kerry was referring to the stadium where the Green Bay Packers play - Lambeau Field. But he's not stupid right?

He probably inadvertantly thought of the St. Louis airport instead.

He was pandering.  Irreleveant but Kerry is no sports fan.  His favorite Red Sox is Eddie Yost who never played for them.

I was just pointing out that it wasn't a mispronunciation, he just probably got the St. Louis airport mixed up with the Packers stadium.

Bad choice of words, but most people from outside Wisconsin wouldn't know the difference between Lambeau Field and Lambert Field either.

[bgwah]

I was laughing because he's...well, stupid.

Yeah he was so "stupid" that he graduated from Yale. Don't you guys get tired of this "Bush is dumb!" stuff? I mean...the guy stumbles on a word here and there and you are rolling on the floor laughing hysterically. Pretty pathetic.

What were his grades, C average?

He is stupid. Or perhaps I just incorrectly learned how to pronounce the words "nuk-u-lar" and "murk-erry."

I bet you couldn't get a 'C' average at Yale.

I bet I could. But I can't blame Bush. After all, he IS a southerner. Expecting him to be intelligent is asking a lot.

Talk a long walk into a hot Mount Saint Helens.

Thanks for proving my point.

You my friend are a dick even if it was in jest.  Coastal elitist bias that makes me want to puke.

You are right. Insulting people based on where they come from is stupid. I was just joking, hence the "," but I have a problem with not responding well to people who insult me.

I'm sorry StatesRights.

[Keystone Phil]

I was laughing because he's...well, stupid.

Yeah he was so "stupid" that he graduated from Yale. Don't you guys get tired of this "Bush is dumb!" stuff? I mean...the guy stumbles on a word here and there and you are rolling on the floor laughing hysterically. Pretty pathetic.

What were his grades, C average?

He is stupid. Or perhaps I just incorrectly learned how to pronounce the words "nuk-u-lar" and "murk-erry."

C average....at Yale! Anywhere else that's pretty good. And you want to talk about mispronouncing words? How about John Kerry's "Lambert" field statements. Maybe you don't know but Kerry was referring to the stadium where the Green Bay Packers play - Lambeau Field. But he's not stupid right?

He probably inadvertantly thought of the St. Louis airport instead.

Ok so what is he thinking when he says "idear." Now I know what an Idea is (Kerry doesn't seem to have many of those...or maybe he does and changes them too often..) but an idear? And if it's because of his New England accent, isn't it fair to say a lot of Bush's mispronounciations is because of his southern accent?

[patrick1]

I was laughing because he's...well, stupid.

Yeah he was so "stupid" that he graduated from Yale. Don't you guys get tired of this "Bush is dumb!" stuff? I mean...the guy stumbles on a word here and there and you are rolling on the floor laughing hysterically. Pretty pathetic.

What were his grades, C average?

He is stupid. Or perhaps I just incorrectly learned how to pronounce the words "nuk-u-lar" and "murk-erry."

C average....at Yale! Anywhere else that's pretty good. And you want to talk about mispronouncing words? How about John Kerry's "Lambert" field statements. Maybe you don't know but Kerry was referring to the stadium where the Green Bay Packers play - Lambeau Field. But he's not stupid right?

He probably inadvertantly thought of the St. Louis airport instead.

He was pandering.  Irreleveant but Kerry is no sports fan.  His favorite Red Sox is Eddie Yost who never played for them.

I was just pointing out that it wasn't a mispronunciation, he just probably got the St. Louis airport mixed up with the Packers stadium.

Bad choice of words, but most people from outside Wisconsin wouldn't know the difference between Lambeau Field and Lambert Field either.

He is not a sports fan.  I don't really care but he should stop making lame jokes.
He claims to be a Red SoX fan, he is not. He once claimed to be Irish-he also is not.  He is sucking up. No politician is really immune to it though

[ATFFL]

I was laughing because he's...well, stupid.

Yeah he was so "stupid" that he graduated from Yale. Don't you guys get tired of this "Bush is dumb!" stuff? I mean...the guy stumbles on a word here and there and you are rolling on the floor laughing hysterically. Pretty pathetic.

What were his grades, C average?

He is stupid. Or perhaps I just incorrectly learned how to pronounce the words "nuk-u-lar" and "murk-erry."

C average....at Yale! Anywhere else that's pretty good. And you want to talk about mispronouncing words? How about John Kerry's "Lambert" field statements. Maybe you don't know but Kerry was referring to the stadium where the Green Bay Packers play - Lambeau Field. But he's not stupid right?

He probably inadvertantly thought of the St. Louis airport instead.

He was pandering.  Irreleveant but Kerry is no sports fan.  His favorite Red Sox is Eddie Yost who never played for them.

I was just pointing out that it wasn't a mispronunciation, he just probably got the St. Louis airport mixed up with the Packers stadium.

Bad choice of words, but most people from outside Wisconsin wouldn't know the difference between Lambeau Field and Lambert Field either.

You must not be a football fan.  Lambeau field is a bit of a legend among fans.  Not as big a deal for non-cheesies, but still not good to not know the proper location of the frozen tundra.

[Keystone Phil]

I was laughing because he's...well, stupid.

Yeah he was so "stupid" that he graduated from Yale. Don't you guys get tired of this "Bush is dumb!" stuff? I mean...the guy stumbles on a word here and there and you are rolling on the floor laughing hysterically. Pretty pathetic.

What were his grades, C average?

He is stupid. Or perhaps I just incorrectly learned how to pronounce the words "nuk-u-lar" and "murk-erry."

C average....at Yale! Anywhere else that's pretty good. And you want to talk about mispronouncing words? How about John Kerry's "Lambert" field statements. Maybe you don't know but Kerry was referring to the stadium where the Green Bay Packers play - Lambeau Field. But he's not stupid right?

He probably inadvertantly thought of the St. Louis airport instead.

He was pandering.  Irreleveant but Kerry is no sports fan.  His favorite Red Sox is Eddie Yost who never played for them.

I was just pointing out that it wasn't a mispronunciation, he just probably got the St. Louis airport mixed up with the Packers stadium.

Bad choice of words, but most people from outside Wisconsin wouldn't know the difference between Lambeau Field and Lambert Field either.

You must not be a football fan.  Lambeau field is a bit of a legend among fans.  Not as big a deal for non-cheesies, but still not good to not know the proper location of the frozen tundra.

Yeah and didn't Kerry claim to be a Packers fan? Hmmmm a fan that doesn't know the name of his team's stadium? Sound strange to anyone?

[ian]

I called it a draw.  It won't attract any voters for either side.  There were parts where Bush used total propoganda that Kerry would have difficulty denying and I cringed.  However, there were also parts where Kerry used total propoganda that Bush would have difficulty denying and I cheered.  So I call it a draw b/c there was no clear winner.

[Rococo4]

Bush.....but not by as much as Kerry won last Thursday.  Just saw the "I own a timber company" line again on the rerun.  that was great

[Wakie]

Kerry stomped Bush.  I know this sounds partisan, but Bush was confused, making silly faces, and was argumentative.  A few items of note.

*Bush wanted to fight with everyone, even Charlie Gibson.

*Bush got confused when trying to talk about the Dredd Scott case (which frankly was a bizarre reference).

*Kerry kept his cool and seemed FAR more Presidential than Bush.

*Bush's denial of owning stock in a timber company.  According to factcheck.org (the Cheney endorsed website), Bush DOES own some of a timber company.  So either the President is an idiot and unaware of what he owns, or he blatantly lied to America.

*Bush completely dodged the "name 3 mistakes" question.  Sorry, but that is a softball question and anyone with ANY humility could answer it.  Heck, it is a standard interview question.  Belly-flopper for George.

*And Kerry definitely scored big points when he pointed out that if it was an independent nation, the state of Missouri would be the third biggest contributor of forces to the "Grand Coalition" which Bush is so proud of.

A huge Kerry win and the online polls on the major news websites back me up.

[??????????]

Kerry stomped Bush.  I know this sounds partisan, but Bush was confused, making silly faces, and was argumentative.  A few items of note.

*Bush wanted to fight with everyone, even Charlie Gibson.

*Bush got confused when trying to talk about the Dredd Scott case (which frankly was a bizarre reference).

*Kerry kept his cool and seemed FAR more Presidential than Bush.

*Bush's denial of owning stock in a timber company.  According to factcheck.org (the Cheney endorsed website), Bush DOES own some of a timber company.  So either the President is an idiot and unaware of what he owns, or he blatantly lied to America.

*Bush completely dodged the "name 3 mistakes" question.  Sorry, but that is a softball question and anyone with ANY humility could answer it.  Heck, it is a standard interview question.  Belly-flopper for George.

*And Kerry definitely scored big points when he pointed out that if it was an independent nation, the state of Missouri would be the third biggest contributor of forces to the "Grand Coalition" which Bush is so proud of.

A huge Kerry win and the online polls on the major news websites back me up.

Yes spammed polls are reliable. Next we will be hearing how you trust Zogby. Get a clue, Bush won.

[Wakie]

Yeah, that's about the response I figured I'd get from you.

Tell ya what, explain to me WHY you think Bush won and we can talk rationally.  Otherwise all you are doing is pulling the old childish "nuh-uh".

[??????????]

Yeah, that's about the response I figured I'd get from you.

Tell ya what, explain to me WHY you think Bush won and we can talk rationally.  Otherwise all you are doing is pulling the old childish "nuh-uh".

You are not worth debating. You are just some democrat hack blinded by the lies of your socialist leader Kerry. Last debate it was "Oh we won we won we won" and even most Republicans here admit that. But you aren't even willing to admit the fact that Bush clearly won. You believe some trash polls done on the internet showin  80+% thinking Kerry won. Bush won because he connected with the people and they understand where he is coming from. Kerry leaves you asking "What the hell is his position again?"

[Wakie]

Yeah, that's about the response I figured I'd get from you.

Tell ya what, explain to me WHY you think Bush won and we can talk rationally.  Otherwise all you are doing is pulling the old childish "nuh-uh".

You are not worth debating. You are just some democrat hack blinded by the lies of your socialist leader Kerry. Last debate it was "Oh we won we won we won" and even most Republicans here admit that. But you aren't even willing to admit the fact that Bush clearly won. You believe some trash polls done on the internet showin  80+% thinking Kerry won. Bush won because he connected with the people and they understand where he is coming from. Kerry leaves you asking "What the hell is his position again?"

Sigh.  There ya go.  Can't defend your position so you resort to insults.  You know it doesn't matter what you and I think about who won, folks will make up their own minds.  But the least you can do is explain your position.

A contradiction without explanation is just whiney.

[??????????]

Yeah, that's about the response I figured I'd get from you.

Tell ya what, explain to me WHY you think Bush won and we can talk rationally.  Otherwise all you are doing is pulling the old childish "nuh-uh".

You are not worth debating. You are just some democrat hack blinded by the lies of your socialist leader Kerry. Last debate it was "Oh we won we won we won" and even most Republicans here admit that. But you aren't even willing to admit the fact that Bush clearly won. You believe some trash polls done on the internet showin  80+% thinking Kerry won. Bush won because he connected with the people and they understand where he is coming from. Kerry leaves you asking "What the hell is his position again?"

Sigh.  There ya go.  Can't defend your position so you resort to insults.  You know it doesn't matter what you and I think about who won, folks will make up their own minds.  But the least you can do is explain your position.

A contradiction without explanation is just whiney.

If you think Kerry won you must have been watching a re-run of the first debate. One question for you. Did the crowd react better to Bush or Kerry? The issues are small in comparison to likeability.

[Citizen James]

Kerry stomped Bush.  I know this sounds partisan, but Bush was confused, making silly faces, and was argumentative.  A few items of note.

*Bush wanted to fight with everyone, even Charlie Gibson.

*Bush got confused when trying to talk about the Dredd Scott case (which frankly was a bizarre reference).

*Kerry kept his cool and seemed FAR more Presidential than Bush.

*Bush's denial of owning stock in a timber company.  According to factcheck.org (the Cheney endorsed website), Bush DOES own some of a timber company.  So either the President is an idiot and unaware of what he owns, or he blatantly lied to America.

*Bush completely dodged the "name 3 mistakes" question.  Sorry, but that is a softball question and anyone with ANY humility could answer it.  Heck, it is a standard interview question.  Belly-flopper for George.

*And Kerry definitely scored big points when he pointed out that if it was an independent nation, the state of Missouri would be the third biggest contributor of forces to the "Grand Coalition" which Bush is so proud of.

A huge Kerry win and the online polls on the major news websites back me up.

Well, online polls are a joke, the Dred Scott reference was just bizzare (if he wanted to complain about judicial activism and fire up his base, all he had to do was reference Roe v. Wade - generally conisered the biggest complaint amidst advocates of judicial restraint.), and the total lack of being able to admit error reinforces the stereotype of him being arrogant. (Though he seemed clearly tempted to name those who had 'betrayed' him - O'neil, Clarke, et al.  He seemed to be hinting at it, but probably showed better sense in not doing so)

And yes, Bush has incorporated as part of a timber company.  It was an awkward delivery for Kerry, but the underlying point is valid -  that most of the huge number of 'small companies' paying individual income tax are simply incorporated individuals who aren't hiring anyone.  An incorporation for an $86 profit on timber isn't going to be affected at all with a tax hike for income over 200,000 - and a lot of the 'small companies' which file personal taxes are companies of one individual in a similar manner.  Factcheck.org does back that up.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Neither candidate ed up

[Silent Hunter]

The debate- which I, as for the VP debate, watched without reading any analysis- could be described by soccer pundits as a score draw.

Both Bush and Kerry did well. Both made excellent points and came across as having conviction. Bush was better at content and foreign policy, Kerry at rhetoric and domestic policy.

As for the race- no change. Bush will still be up one or two.

So far, the debates are a draw.

[Democratic Hawk]

Kerry but not big. I found it pretty evenly matched.
I thought Kerry stood out on economic/domestic issues.

The one thing that lingers with me from this debate is Bush's audacity to berate Kerry as a 'tax-and-spend' liberal, which, frankly, sounds rich coming from a guy, who presides over a record federal deficit.

Kerry's 'pay and go' program is pragmatic. Clinton was fiscally responsible and I expect that a President Kerry would be too.

Dave

[J. J.]

Kerry stomped Bush.  I know this sounds partisan, but Bush was confused, making silly faces, and was argumentative.  A few items of note.

*Bush wanted to fight with everyone, even Charlie Gibson.

*Bush got confused when trying to talk about the Dredd Scott case (which frankly was a bizarre reference).

*Kerry kept his cool and seemed FAR more Presidential than Bush.

*Bush's denial of owning stock in a timber company.  According to factcheck.org (the Cheney endorsed website), Bush DOES own some of a timber company.  So either the President is an idiot and unaware of what he owns, or he blatantly lied to America.

*Bush completely dodged the "name 3 mistakes" question.  Sorry, but that is a softball question and anyone with ANY humility could answer it.  Heck, it is a standard interview question.  Belly-flopper for George.

*And Kerry definitely scored big points when he pointed out that if it was an independent nation, the state of Missouri would be the third biggest contributor of forces to the "Grand Coalition" which Bush is so proud of.

A huge Kerry win and the online polls on the major news websites back me up.

Kerry, in a room of voters, used Senate speak, seemed remote, gave answers that even Gibson called him on.  Those "polls," as have pointed out, are being spammed and are never statistically valid.  You'll see a slight bounce (which won't last) in the real polls.

[Umengus]

Kerry but bush was better than at first debate.  Bush was sometimes angry and Kerry has (still) a lack of charism. I'm seeing that polls agree with me.

[Acastus]

This poll would have been more informative had it been framed like the VP debate poll in an earlier string.  The choices needed to be keyed by both choice of debate winner and the respondent's party.

[Democratic Hawk]

I think both camps can take comfort from this debate. The pressure was on Bush and he delivered, while Kerry held his own.

This was a pretty evenly matched debate but it was by no means a decisive win one way or another. I feel that Kerry won, especially on domestic/economic issues. I didn't take too kindly to Bush scaremongering about taxes. As for Bush being a 'fiscally conservative'? Fiscally irresponsible, more like! Moreover, Congress has aided and abetted such prolificacy.

Kerry has spending plans,  which he'll implement once they can be afforded. What's so wrong with that?

Dave