Should ticket scapling be legal?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I remember about 10-15 years ago when Garth Brooks came to Bismarck ticket scalping was so common and the papers noted that it was legal in North Dakota, one of only two states (the other being Kansas)

Now I read in the StarTrib that Minnesota is one of the few states hanging onto its old, mostly unenforced ticket scalping law, and it'll probably be repealed pretty soon (a bit to repeal it starting Aug. 1 is flying through the legislature with little resistance). Quite a change in not a very long time.

But I support it. It should be legal.

[Gustaf]

What is ticket scapling?

[Gabu]

What is ticket scapling?

Ticket scalping is where you buy a large wad of tickets to a show of some kind and then sell them to last-minute ticket shoppers at hugely inflated prices.

[MODU]

I am split on this.  On one hand, buying low and selling high is the hallmark of the economy.  However, buying out all the tickets and then setting the price so high that most people cannot buy them, leading to a half-filled concert hall or stadium where consession sales fall, hurting the venue for their revenue, leading to higher ticket costs and/or reduced touring schedules and layoffs hurts the market economy.  I guess I'll go with no, it shouldn't be legal.

[Gustaf]

I don't see why not. Though perhaps the seller, especially if it is the government, should think twice before selling a lot of tickets to the same person.

[angus]

I don't see why not. Though perhaps the seller, especially if it is the government, should think twice before selling a lot of tickets to the same person.

the seller does think twice about this, and for some events the seller sells lots at discounted rates.  We call it "group rates."  But I hope you're not suggesting that it is the seller's job to determine the intent of the person purchasing the ticket.  We don't need some additional bureaucracy charged with the task of overseeing lots.  For example, I have bought as many as fifty Red Sox tickets at one time.  People often want to take a group of coworkers or children or visiting dignitaries to the game or to a concert.  Nothing wrong with selling in big lots. 

Scalping?  Like MODU, I'm ambivalent.  It does have its rewards.  I've purchased many a ticket from would-be scalpers, not just to shows, but to ball games and even amusement parks.  Usually I wait till after it started then get the guy to sell at a drastically reduced rate.  I've had forty dollar seats for ten dollars.  Sweet deal, so long as you don't mind missing the opening pitch.  On the other hand, as has been pointed out it allows for the possibility that someone could buy every last seat and sell at four times the original price.  Then again, if the market will bear that price, then so be it.  I guess I lean toward YES.

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

Yes

[Gustaf]

I don't see why not. Though perhaps the seller, especially if it is the government, should think twice before selling a lot of tickets to the same person.

the seller does think twice about this, and for some events the seller sells lots at discounted rates.  We call it "group rates."  But I hope you're not suggesting that it is the seller's job to determine the intent of the person purchasing the ticket.  We don't need some additional bureaucracy charged with the task of overseeing lots.  For example, I have bought as many as fifty Red Sox tickets at one time.  People often want to take a group of coworkers or children or visiting dignitaries to the game or to a concert.  Nothing wrong with selling in big lots. 

Scalping?  Like MODU, I'm ambivalent.  It does have its rewards.  I've purchased many a ticket from would-be scalpers, not just to shows, but to ball games and even amusement parks.  Usually I wait till after it started then get the guy to sell at a drastically reduced rate.  I've had forty dollar seats for ten dollars.  Sweet deal, so long as you don't mind missing the opening pitch.  On the other hand, as has been pointed out it allows for the possibility that someone could buy every last seat and sell at four times the original price.  Then again, if the market will bear that price, then so be it.  I guess I lean toward YES.

That wasn't what I meant. What I meant was that if it does actually lead to empty halls and so on (which I actually doubt) then maybe the seller should think twice before selling so many tickets to one person, in their own interest.

When it comes the government the event is presumably such as all citizens should have some sort of equal chance (given certain financial conditions, etc) to attend and thus should perhaps have a requirement to be more cautious.

But what I don't get is how this would work. It seems like a bad deal to me. You have to buy the tickets and thus take a huge risk. In the end, your position isn't much better than the person you're trying to sell to. I guess people may be really desperate but then it's sort of their problem. If one wants tickets so badly, why not be there when they were up for sale?

In fact, the more I think about it the more I favour it. It basically makes the market run smoother.

[© tweed]

It's the most basic form of capitalism.

[MaC]

Definitely.  If someone is willing to pay a higher price on the spot because of increased demand, than it's their right to make the exchange.

[ilikeverin]

Yes.  My family got some of the best tickets we've ever gotten from a scalper in front of Spartan Stadium earlier this year... we end up going in, and (much to our surprise) the seats were in the high-paying alumni section about 10 rows up right on the 50 yard line.  A vast improvement over the upper deck seats we traded in (with some cash, of course) in order to get them.

Of course, MSU did end up losing to Purdue in the end, but they were nice seats.

[MaC]

Yes.  My family got some of the best tickets we've ever gotten from a scalper in front of Spartan Stadium earlier this year... we end up going in, and (much to our surprise) the seats were in the high-paying alumni section about 10 rows up right on the 50 yard line.  A vast improvement over the upper deck seats we traded in (with some cash, of course) in order to get them.

Of course, MSU did end up losing to Purdue in the end, but they were nice seats.

was it a classic Spartan loss? (where MSU leads for most of the game and at the last 3 minutes f--ks it up) 

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

No - too close to monopolism.

[12th Doctor]

Since it is the only way you can ever hope to get into a Steelers game... yes

[angus]

That wasn't what I meant. What I meant was that if it does actually lead to empty halls and so on (which I actually doubt) then maybe the seller should think twice before selling so many tickets to one person, in their own interest.

When it comes the government the event is presumably such as all citizens should have some sort of equal chance (given certain financial conditions, etc) to attend and thus should perhaps have a requirement to be more cautious.

But what I don't get is how this would work. It seems like a bad deal to me. You have to buy the tickets and thus take a huge risk. In the end, your position isn't much better than the person you're trying to sell to. I guess people may be really desperate but then it's sort of their problem. If one wants tickets so badly, why not be there when they were up for sale?

In fact, the more I think about it the more I favour it. It basically makes the market run smoother.

Ah, well it's a risk for the scalper no doubt.  I imagine if you're good with marketing and have a head for numbers and estimates and pay attention to the weather and all that, then you can probably get to the point of making reasonable predictions over time.

As for the buyer, it's not always easy to be there when they go on sale.  For five years I worked on the fifth floor of Metcalfe Hall at BU, and from my lab I could actually see into Fenway park from my window.  I couldn't see home plate, but I could see inside the park.  And it was simply a matter of going downstairs and walking a couple of blocks to get Red Sox tickets at the office.  (Unless, of course, they were playing my favorite team, the New York Yankees, in which case you needed to camp out on Yawkey Way the night before tickets went on sale if you wanted one.)  Also, when I lived in Arlington, I lived only about a mile from The Ballpark.  In fact, I could hear the organ playing from the balcony of my third-storey apparment, and from the pool/jacuzzi area as well.  It was festive all summer during home games.  And the cheapest tickets were around 2 dollars for the cheesey seats, and since the Rangers weren't selling out, you could get in with the 2 dollar ticket, then make your way to a 30 dollar seat if you were sly about it.  Later, after I moved to Alameda county California, I lived more out in the suburbs, at least an hour by rail (BART) to the SF Giants.  It wasn't so convenient to get seats.  Fortunately for the buyer, the Giants weren't selling out at the time, and often in that market I could find tickets on the street going for less if I waited them out.  Not all scalpers are lucky, I guess. 

So you may or may not live where it's convenient to get tickets the day they go on sale.  If you're coming from out of town, and the game's sold out, then you deal with scalpers.  And as Supersoulty said, for some places they're always out, so even if you live close it's hard to get tickets.  Jacob's Field is like that too.  I stayed in Cleveland most of the summer of '94, and during that time I learned that If you want to see the Indians at home, you deal with scalpers. 

[Frodo]

Ticket scalpers are freedom fighters, obviously. 

[Undisguised Sockpuppet]

Ticket scalpers are freedom fighters, obviously. 

Why?

[Bacon King]

No - too close to monopolism.

What?