El-Sisi vs. Erdogan

[Sir Mohamed]

Both horrible, but Erdo is the lesser evil. He's "just" an autocrat, while El-Sisi fully qualifies as dictator.

[Antonio the Sixth]

What's more, Sisi isn't killing Kurds ... .

Sisi ... has fewer minorities to oppress. Narrow Sisinvote I guess.

Imagine thinking that Erdogan in particular, or the Islamic right in Turkey in general, is any more "anti-Kurdish" or "anti-minority" than any of the other viable political factions or leaders who have ever ruled Turkey since the Tanzimat Reforms or who ever will realistically rule Turkey in the near-future.

So what? He doesn't get a pass on oppressing Kurds just because it's been Turkey's favorite pastime for a century.

Also the fact that he was a lot better for Kurds in his first decade in power and then made the conscious choices to return to the old ways when it became politically convenient if anything makes him more despicable than his predecessors who just did it out of habit.

To the extent that it's true Erdogan "made the conscious choices to return to the old ways," he did so because he had to, not because he wanted to. Erdogan's Islamic conservative political forces represent an absolute minority of the country's population and parliament, and Erdogan's administration in order to stay in power cannot afford to offend the ethnic-nationalist/secular-rightist sector of the voting public. Erdogan got away with being "a lot better for Kurds in his first decade in power" because the economy was doing very well and because the international diplomatic pressures created by the aftermath of the 2016 coup attempt did not yet exist, but ever since then Erdogan has been more desperate to maintain greater than 50% toleration by the voting public and elected parliament, and the easiest way to do so is by "returning to the old ways" in regards to policies concerning the Kurds (since "oppression of Kurds" is a broadly popular position among the sound majority of ethnic-Turk Turkish citizens and ergo Turkish swing voters, and is among the primary list of demands among the secular/nationalist-right faction which Erdogan constantly has to appease in order to keep power).

"He had to"?? Do you hear yourself?? Poor little baby boy had no choice but to oppress the Kurds or he'd lose his grip on power, and we can't have that. Is that seriously the best you can do to simp for your new favorite autocrat?

[America Needs R'hllor]

Without Sisi, Egypt would be a full-blown Islamist dictatorship instead of a country that is run in an authoritarian way but is still semi-free as long as you stay out of politics.

Without Erdogan, Turkey could have been actually developing instead of committing economic suicide and letting AKP cronies conduct gross mismanagement, leading to the building permits disaster we've seen regarding the earthquake. Turkey is also backsliding in terms of personal freedom.

What's more, Sisi isn't killing Kurds and is acting like a responsible adult in the current Israel-Gaza crisis, unlike Erdogan, who gets irresponsibly unhinged.

The answer is quite easy, honestly. Yes, Turkey is more democratic than Egypt, but that's despite Erdogan, not because of him. I'd still rather live in Turkey than in Egypt but that's not the question here.

Agree with this. Sisi is an authoritarian but, frankly, being a moderating force in one of the most wartorn and unstable regions of the world is an extremely important positive. Sisi is taking Egypt into a direction of trying to mitigate crises and minimize conflict in the Middle East, while Erdogan, leading a very important country, has botched every single attempt to conduct a positive foreign policy. In the 2010s, he attempted to dial the antizionism and antisemitism to 100 in order to realize his fever dream of becoming the new Sultan via influence on the Arab world, and failed miserably because no one wanted him despite his loud admonishment of Israel. Attempted to be a power broker in the Russia-Ukraine war by mediating, failed in his endeavours and isn't really a factor in this war despite Turkey's potentially immense importance in the Black Sea. Attempted to meddle in Syria, by attacking one of the least bad forces operating in that hellscape. Attempted to crawl back to Israel's good side to get some airplanes, and now is an absolute non-factor while screeching that Bibi is Hitler to no one's ears in particular. He's a total failure who took Turkey in a direction of a destabilizing and destructive force despite its immense potential to help mitigate suffering.

[President Johnson]

Congratulations, you just made me vote for the sultan of the Bosporus.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

Erdogan

[Aurelius2]

Sisi at least knows how interest rates work.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

I don't really get how you can call Sisi a better economic manager than Erdogan, and that is not a compliment to erdogan. Endless IMF bailouts, a ballooning and corrupt military shadow state gobbling up resources, endless white elephants (including a pointless new capital) - guy has been disastrous since day one

[All Along The Watchtower]

Leaders like Sisi make leaders like Erdogan possible in that part of the world.

Anyway, I have the Scorching Hot Take that murderous military dictators and the coups that put them in power are Bad, period. Furthermore, as an American and someone who posts on an election forum (ie. this forum); I don’t see why I should oppose people in other countries the right to elect odious, horrifying authoritarians—particularly since my country will quite possibly bring back an odious, horrifying authoritarian as President (who incidentally, is a “Tremendous Fan” of both Sisi and Erdogan).