McCain/Sanford vs. Obama/Sebelius

[Keystone Phil]

Obama:  364
McCain:  174

This is getting really out of control. I am serious when I say you ought to look into help.

[Keystone Phil]

Obama:  364
McCain:  174

This is getting really out of control. I am serious when I say you ought to look into help.

Stop being a hack, Phil. You know this is what will happen. It is you and I that need to get help for our racism.

Obama seems to be in the right place at the right time.

Enough to win LA, TN, KY, MO and MT? Get real.

The Republicans in this thread are being ridiculous. Poll after poll shows Obama doing better than McCain, crushing him in a number of supposed swing states. Obama is young and inspiring. McCain is old and negative. The economy is plumetting and McCain has tied himself to an unpopular war. Also, I don't know if the Republicans here know this, but there were some elections in US history where the winner netted more than 300 EVs.

LOL ok. What month is it? When is the General? Obama is the big deal now. People don't know about his record. Just wait.

Because only this registers with you people:

anything less shall never happen...EVAR
not even the devine powers of Obama the Almighty can save his homestate...

Uh, ok, hack. I had Obama winning states like NV, CO, NM and IA.

[Keystone Phil]

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The same can be said about McCain. People don't know that he's flip-flopped on issue after issue. People don't know the extent to which he is tied to the Bush administration, to its failed economic policy, to its failed foreign policy. McCain is still the "maverick", the moderate Republican who's a complete repudiation of Bush. People still haven't seen him debate or speak.

Also, every time Obama campaigns in a state, every time people get to know him, his poll numbers go up. McCain, meanwhile, is a lackluster campaigner who can't raise money without flip-flopping and running to lobbyists and only won the nomination because of a split in the conservative vote.

LOL  "Everytime Obama campaigns in a state, every time people get to know him, his poll numbers go up."


People haven't seen McCain speak or debate? Really? Everyone just knows the savior, Obama? Hmmm...how did McCain win the nomination again?

You people really think this is going to last forever? Wow. The end of the honeymoon is coming, guys, and you are going to be hurting.

The word Hack is being used to freely in this thread...im curious how im a hack for in this situation? My hackery for my secret undyling love for McCain in this scenerio? yahookay

You're a hack because you think the insane maps of Texas4Obama are accurate!

[Keystone Phil]

OMG LOLZ MCCAIN RULEZ CUZ HE SURVIVES TILL THE ELECTSHUN!@#!I#!  OBAMA SUCKS!#@!  I HATE THINGS OTHER PEOPL ELIKER#

Again, be mature and address my actual map.

[Keystone Phil]

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Just one question. McCain has been in the Senate for 25 years. What has he done in that time? What are his accomplishments? Apart from a bit of years-old campaign finance reform that no-one cares about and most people who do care about don't like.

There's one candidate here who should really fear an examining of his record.

I'm not even talking about accomplishments because we've had that battle here before (though if you really wish to go into it, fire away). I'm talking about the record in general. Obama is far too liberal. Right now all people know is HOPE anc CHANGE. That only works for so long.

Um... I think that McCain winning Connecticut or Pennsylvania or Wisconsin is more "insane" than winning the west or Virginia.

LOL I never said he'd win CT and considering WI and PA are states that are true swing states and even show McCain leading, your comparison is even more of a joke.

 I think most people would agree that a candidate of the incumbent party winning during a recession, an unpopular war, and the term of a 28% approval-rating President is "insane."

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Ok, sure.

P.S. - Karl Rove won in 2000, 2002 and 2004 > losing in 2006.

[Keystone Phil]

why is there maps with obama winning kentucky and tennessee? why oh why?

Thank you for some sanity!

He stole 2000 and picked up 2 seats in 2002 while the President had a 60%+ approval rating. WHAT A GENIUS.

Nicely ignoring 2004 plus some nice spin with the other two elections.

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Haha, ok.

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What a joke. If issues don't matter, why does it matter that McCain is far too conservative?

[Keystone Phil]

In 2004, an incumbent president during a time of war with a decent economy barely defeated a lackluster candidate. Again, whoopee.

LOL the spin!

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Haha, right. Ok.

[Keystone Phil]

You seriously think that Bush's defeat of John Kerry was some masterful political task, that only a genius like Karl Rove could have accomplished? Riiiiight...

You forget the accomplishments they made with Congressional races?

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"The economy," "Healthcare," "The environment"...it's pointless to argue this with you. You are so set in believing that vague Obama is so mainstream on such general topics.

[Keystone Phil]

All I see from you, Phil, and Naso, is a bunch of maps where you switch a few states around and call as close to 50/50 as you can with your candidate still managing to take the win.

Or I think it will be fairly close (like most) instead of showing my candidate winning in a complete landslide (like you).

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Point out for me where I said my candidate couldn't lose. Please. Go. Now.

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More reasonable than having a liberal Democrat winning LA, KY, TN, MT, MO, etc. And I'm the hack?

Er... they would have gained 0 seats if not for the illegal redistricting in Texas. How is tying, if not for cheating, an accomplishment?

Uh, I'm pretty sure that we'd still take the House and maybe you forgot about the Senate?

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Desire for universal healthcare is mainstream? Tax hikes are mainstream? How is he mainstream on "terrorism." So very, very vague just like your overrated candidate.

[Keystone Phil]

Phil, the days of the Reaganism are over. People are no longer scared silly by taxes and the boogeyman of government. They understand that if we want a balanced budget and a government safety net, we shouldn't be cutting taxes for the very wealthy and hoping that some of their excess money "trickles down." They understand that a first world nation shouldn't have 40 million people uninsured. They understand that the healthcare industry is over-charging, that they can no longer afford to pay the medical bills, and that things need to change. The free market cannot solve everything, and unfortunately for the regressive party, ordinary Americans are beginning to understand that again.

Thanks, though, for returning to attacks instead of debate.

How did I attack?

Thanks for the Dem talking points.

Desire for universal healthcare is mainstream?

Absolutely.

Tax hikes are mainstream?

On the wealthiest top few percent, yes. Especially in a time of recession and a big deficit. And Obama is proposing a middle class tax cut so that will help as well.
 

How is he mainstream on "terrorism."

61% of the country wants us out of Iraq within a year. The Obama plan gradually withdraws our troops over the span of 16 months. McCain says no end in sight and the possiblity of another 100 years in Iraq.

Ok, we separated "Iraq" and "Terrorism" so stop recycling answers. Thanks.

The Republicans on this board are stuck in a 2002/2004 mindset.

Public opinion has changed drasticlly over the past 3-4 years, Bush has gotten incredibly unpopular since 2004 (as has the Iraq War), we are slipping into recession, and there is a lot of Republican fatigue at this point.

And your are stuck in the thought process that the Dems will landslide no matter what.

[Keystone Phil]

Obama wins all the Kerry states + Nevada, New Mexico, Colorado, Iowa, Ohio, Virginia, and probably Missouri.  Florida is possible but unlikely.

Probably Missouri? Give me a break.

[Keystone Phil]

Guys, Phil says that the Democrats can't win more than 300 EV. Please listen to him and stop making incorrect predictions. Thank you.

Uh, they won't and most reasonable people agree.

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And your map showed what? I sound like gporter?

[Keystone Phil]

Obama 343 EV, 53% PV
McCain 195 EV, 46% PV

LOL And I'm the hack! Right! Kansas goes for Obama. Sure thing.

This forum's cult like obsession with Obama is dangerous.

[Keystone Phil]

Guys, Phil says that the Democrats can't win more than 300 EV. Please listen to him and stop making incorrect predictions. Thank you.

Uh, they won't and most reasonable people agree.

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And your map showed what? I sound like gporter?

No, you and your fellow hacks agree. There is a very good chance that the Democrats will have over 300 electoral votes this election. I'd list them, but frankly you haven't listened to a single thing I or anyone else has said in this thread, so I won't bother.

You and every Dem hack says 300+ electoral votes so I'm supposed to believe you?

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No, I call you a hack when you have Kansas going for Obama. I call you a hack for having NC going for Obama. I can respect maps that show Obama winning CO, NV, NM, IA, OH but not states like MO, FL, NC, KS, etc.

I don't know how I am "ridiculously" Pro McCain when I have McCain losing CO, NM, IA?

Obama 343 EV, 53% PV
McCain 195 EV, 46% PV

LOL And I'm the hack! Right! Kansas goes for Obama. Sure thing.

This forum's cult like obsession with Obama is dangerous.

9 months from now, with Sebelius on the bottom of the ticket, why the hell not? I never said that it will definitely happen, but it's definitely a possibility, and about as likely as senile old John "100 years in Iraq" McCain winning any Kerry states.

About as likely as McCain winning states that actually have close General election matchups? Yeah, ok. McCain winning PA, WI > Obama winning KS.

You are completely delusional if you think him winning KS is more reasonable. The bottom of the ticket never helps someone out that much especially in a reliable GOP state.

[Keystone Phil]

And the GOP krewe has become more senile along with their inevitable nominee....im done trying to argue in this thread. Matchu out.

Way to fight valid points with reason!

Seriously, people, you want to go crazy over Obama? Fine. Go ahead. However, don't argue with me that this man will win states like Kansas, North Carolina, Louisiana, Tennessee, Kentucky...and then call me the hack and senile.

[Keystone Phil]

Kerry won Pennsylvania in 2004 by 2.5%, while Bush won nationally by 2.5%. You really think that McCain will win by 5% this year? Keep dreaming.

Sorry but the truth is that there are still plenty of people here that will be wary of voting for a black man. Should it be that way? No. Is it that way? Yes.

He's also inexperienced and an amatuer. Kerry wasn't.

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It will be that way until almost solid states under go a complete realignment. Having a popular Governor on the ticket with a liberal Democratic Senator doesn't flip KS.


Why not put the popular Governor of Wyoming on the ticket with Obama and flip Wyoming! Hey, Larry Craig is unpopular in Idaho so find a random Dem from Idaho for Vice President and Obama can take that state, too!

It's pointless to continue. I should have known that arguing with a cult like following would get me no where.

[Keystone Phil]

Sorry but the truth is that there are still plenty of people here that will be wary of voting for a black man. Should it be that way? No. Is it that way? Yes.

He's also inexperienced and an amatuer. Kerry wasn't.

https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=70767.0

You've heard Phil, he doesn't believe in polls, as Obama is so unexperienced and unelectable compared to the inspiring, charismatic, heroic, political giant that is John S. McCain.

Ok. I asked earlier to point out where I said Obama couldn't win. No response. Now point out where I said Obama was unelectable.

[Keystone Phil]

Sorry but the truth is that there are still plenty of people here that will be wary of voting for a black man. Should it be that way? No. Is it that way? Yes.

He's also inexperienced and an amatuer. Kerry wasn't.

https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=70767.0

You've heard Phil, he doesn't believe in polls, as Obama is so unexperienced and unelectable compared to the inspiring, charismatic, heroic, political giant that is John S. McCain.

Oh, by the way, in that thread....

Amusing that you all chose this PA poll to comment on

[Keystone Phil]

keystone phil, you are dramatically overstating the importance of 'experience' in an election. People vote for who looks to be the best person, not who has the longest CV. The Presidency isn;t a Lifetime Achievement Award.

Though of course, McCain's supposed experience itself is overrated, but that's another story.

Well, saying someone "looks to be the best person" is very vague so I don't know how to argue against that. Being young and a great speaker doesn't mean he's necessarily the "best person" to most.