Opinion of the Mccloskey couple in St.Louis? (user search)
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  Opinion of the Mccloskey couple in St.Louis? (search mode)
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Author Topic: Opinion of the Mccloskey couple in St.Louis?  (Read 1018 times)
Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 38,094
United States


Political Matrix
E: 5.29, S: -5.04


« on: August 24, 2020, 09:15:19 AM »

Huge FF’s.
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Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 38,094
United States


Political Matrix
E: 5.29, S: -5.04


« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2020, 09:23:49 AM »

I don't really have an opinion of the McCloskeys as people, but there's certainly nothing wrong with trying to defend yourself and your property from trespassers who broke open your front gate and threatened you.
Most people I know in that situation would have opened fire. If a hundred Klansmen in white robes marched into the hood with nooses, I’d say the same thing about the people in that neighborhood too.
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Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 38,094
United States


Political Matrix
E: 5.29, S: -5.04


« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2020, 09:39:44 AM »

I don't really have an opinion of the McCloskeys as people, but there's certainly nothing wrong with trying to defend yourself and your property from trespassers who broke open your front gate and threatened you.

Didn't they "break open" a gate to the neighborhood, not something that actually belonged to the McCloskeys? I think this distinction actually makes a pretty big difference in how unreasonable their actions were.
You don’t have a right not break open a gate in a private community. They went to that neighborhood with the specific goal of harassing white people. The McCloskeys were right to protect their property from these goons.
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Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 38,094
United States


Political Matrix
E: 5.29, S: -5.04


« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2020, 11:35:27 AM »

When your house gets ransacked don’t come crying here.
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Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 38,094
United States


Political Matrix
E: 5.29, S: -5.04


« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2020, 04:06:26 PM »

1. So it turns out the idea that the protesters tore down the McCloskey's gate to enter their property is false. The gate belonged to the neighborhood, and there is also video confirmation that they just opened it up and walked through without breaking/entering. The gate did end up broken so, maybe someone near the back of the line vandalized it or something, but it's a little different than the way the narrative is portraying it.
Um, yeah, that's called a gated community. People who live there choose to live there because it is walled off and gated to prevent, well, exactly this situation. What business do they have there? Why is invading this (mostly white neighborhood) meaningful. They clearly went there to intimidate people who have been exercising their right to not be involved.

This whole "silence is violence" narrative has driven a lot of people off, so I guess they decided to chase them.

2. Have you ever dealt with an automatic gate ever in your life? I deal with one every day when I go to work. You can't just "pull it open." If you pull it open, the chain gets loose and the wheels jump out of the freaking track. Pulling it open breaks it. They broke the gate. Quit whitewashing this.


Next, it turns out that the idea that the protesters trespassed on the McCloskey's property is exaggerated and potentially false. Yes, they did trespass in the neighborhood since they weren't there by invitation, but they were walking on the streets and sidewalks. The crowd was in the neighborhood to protest at the mayor's house and no one knew or cared who the McCloskeys even were. The only connection is that they happened to walk by their house. I obviously don't have access to the property deeds to ensure that no protester set foot on any McCloskey property before the confrontation, but if they did it was inadvertent and inconsequential.

1. They still didn't have the right to be there. "At least...." doesn't matter. Anything you wrote after those two words is b.s. I don't like gated communities (in south Florida they all look alike and are centered around a golf course. I prefer my "old Florida" end of town) but I understand why people live in them.

2. Again, the Mayor's house doesn't exist on a public street. These people had no right to be in the neighborhood. If his house was outside of the private community in a normal neighborhood like my own, I wouldn't contest their right to be there.

inally, the idea that it was a violent, angry mob who threatened the lives of the McCloskeys appears to be false, at least almost entirely false with vanishingly few exceptions. The crowd was by all accounts peaceful until the McCloskeys revved it up by threatening them and pointing guns.
So.....in other words, they were threatened. "By all accounts" - who's accounts? Theirs? MSNBCs?

If a bunch of masked strangers came up my street, you'd best be sure I would be thinking what my defense options would be. I'm not a gun owner, and never wanted to be one. That is likely to change in the next month. I keep a hatchet in my car these days.

Some protesters said some ugly things in response, including at least 1 threat on the level of what the McCloskeys were throwing at the protesters. However, had the McCloskeys just stayed in their house, the protesters would have just kept on walking by and everything would have been fine for everyone, because as I pointed out, the protesters weren't there for the McCloskeys. They were walking past that house to get to the mayor's house.

"They weren't there to harass McCloskeys! They were there to intimidate the mayor. It's all good guys!"

I'm just not seeing anyway for the McCloskeys to be in the right on this. The protesters had nothing to do with the McCloskeys until the McCloskeys decided to have something to do with them, and it was the McCloskeys who escalated the encounter to include threats and pointing guns. The fact that the Trumpist side has to make up a fake narrative about them in order to have a competent-sounding defense speaks volumes.

You're not capable enough of independent thinking to see anyway for the McCloskey's to be right in any scenario.
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