FBI search warrant executed at Mar-a-Lago (Update: Trump Indicted!)

[GeorgiaModerate]

I see people on here saying that Trump 2024 wouldn't even get 40 million votes...when the guy just lost with 74 million a year and a half ago.

The amount of delusion is insane.

How many votes did Debs receive from federal prison?

A bit over 900,000 (3.4% of the PV), but he was running on the Socialist ticket and not a major party.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/sgurman/status/1558140291449765888?s=21&t=8CjPqO959CaH2s...

The article is paywalled, but the first paragraph is visible and says:

FBI agents who searched former President Donald Trump’s Mar-a-Lago home Monday removed 11 sets of classified documents, including some marked as top secret and meant to be only available in special government facilities, according to documents reviewed by The Wall Street Journal.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Will info on the nature of the documents be released today if Trump doesn't object before 3?

I'm sure there will be some vagueness and/or redactions.  For some classified documents, especially at the higher levels, even the document titles can be classified.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/sgurman/status/1558140291449765888?s=21&t=8CjPqO959CaH2s...

The article is paywalled, but the first paragraph is visible and says:

FBI agents who searched former President Donald Trump’s Mar-a-Lago home Monday removed 11 sets of classified documents, including some marked as top secret and meant to be only available in special government facilities, according to documents reviewed by The Wall Street Journal.

Another possible scenario that comes to mind ...

Do you think some of the stuff trump wanted to keep, for bragging purposes, were Area 51 and UFO/alien related classified documents/photos ?

Imagine if Trump just panics and blurts out that aliens are real, and this is how the world finds out...

"I took the documents with me because nobody can make better deals with the aliens than me!"

Not likely.  Trump doesn't like undocumented aliens.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/sgurman/status/1558141405004013568

"TS/SCI" means Top Secret / Sensitive Compartmented Information.  SCI is one of the strictest classification levels and is generally used for information that could compromise sensitive intelligence sources or methods.  AFAIK, TS/SCI documents should never be kept *anywhere* except a SCIF (Sensitive Compartmented Information Facility, a secure room protected against electronic surveillance or intrusion).

Not to overstate the case, but this is very very very bad.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/sgurman/status/1558140291449765888?s=21&t=8CjPqO959CaH2s...

The article is paywalled, but the first paragraph is visible and says:

FBI agents who searched former President Donald Trump’s Mar-a-Lago home Monday removed 11 sets of classified documents, including some marked as top secret and meant to be only available in special government facilities, according to documents reviewed by The Wall Street Journal.

One can listen to more than one can read. The scope of the warrant was to search just about everywhere in the puzzle palace, that docs at various levels of classification were seized (the levels having bureaucratic jargon monikers), and that while Trump world claims that everything he has he declassified, there is a process to doing that, and it is not just a matter of Trump claiming he mentally declassified everything one minute before Biden took office.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/fbi-recovered-eleven-sets-of-classified-documents-in-trump-search-inventory-shows-11660324501


Oh, I see you found a tweet from someone who listened, and you seem familiar with the moniker jargon. You must have worked for the CIA or something. 

I worked in the defense contracting business for almost 20 years (before, as I like to say, escaping into the real world).  So I was quite familiar with it at the time.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Regarding whether Trump declassified the information...

https://twitter.com/steve_vladeck/status/1557930815006408705

[GeorgiaModerate]

Bretibart and WSJ got the warrent at the same time.

https://twitter.com/maggieNYT/status/1558155382945619971?s=20&t=tarkDRpDqNK1...

Which suggests they were leaked by Trump insiders.  Why...?

[GeorgiaModerate]

Bretibart and WSJ got the warrent at the same time.

https://twitter.com/maggieNYT/status/1558155382945619971?s=20&t=tarkDRpDqNK1...

Wait, have they released the warrent?

No, someone (presumed to be in the Trump camp) has leaked it to Breitbart, WSJ, and now reportedly Fox.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Of all the crazy and awful things Trump has done, I think this is the first one that has left me truly flabbergasted.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/RonFilipkowski/status/1558150949537021953

[GeorgiaModerate]

There is a reason the NYT is number one:

"The search warrant for Trump’s residence cited three criminal laws, all from Title 18 of the United States Code. Section 793, better known as the Espionage Act, which covers the unlawful retention of defense-related information that could harm the United States or aid a foreign adversary; Section 1519, which covers destroying or concealing documents to obstruct government investigations or administrative proceedings; and Section 2071, which covers the unlawful removal of government records. Notably, none of those laws turn on whether information was deemed to be unclassified."

The section 1519 mention makes me wonder what he was trying to obstruct, unless it just means the investigation of the related counts.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/oneunderscore__/status/1558187290555457538

[GeorgiaModerate]

There is a reason the NYT is number one:

"The search warrant for Trump’s residence cited three criminal laws, all from Title 18 of the United States Code. Section 793, better known as the Espionage Act, which covers the unlawful retention of defense-related information that could harm the United States or aid a foreign adversary; Section 1519, which covers destroying or concealing documents to obstruct government investigations or administrative proceedings; and Section 2071, which covers the unlawful removal of government records. Notably, none of those laws turn on whether information was deemed to be unclassified."

Twitter user @KDbyProxy (wonderful follow btw, whip smart, especially wrt this sort of thing) caught this yesterday. Here's the relevant tweet:

https://twitter.com/KDbyProxy/status/1557872185959751681

This seems like a stretch.

They're going to put Trump in jail for ten years for possessing unclassified documents?  That doesn't pass the smell test

I mean, they weren’t unclassified, for one. They were top secret in some cases.

Still seems like a novel application of the Espionage Act when we have a separate law that explicitly deals with presidential records

I think bringing up the fact that it applies to unclassified docs is a response to potential claims by Trump that he declassifed them.  As cited earlier, the 2nd CA determined that the President simply saying that something is declassified (as Trump did a few times during his term) does not make it so, unless the actual declassification process was followed through. 

If the documents retrieved from MAL didn't have declassification markings on them, they were still classified.  Trump is, of course, free to argue otherwise at trial.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/juliegraceb/status/1558201612694331392

This will of course go nowhere, but it will be interesting to see who signs on to it.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/steve_vladeck/status/1558210074765660160

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/RonFilipkowski/status/1558227491537436672

LOL

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/AnaCabrera/status/1558234570654375940

[GeorgiaModerate]

What's the general Republican voter consensus here?

Fuzzy and that ilk. I'm assuming they're excusing this, deflecting it, or ignoring it?

DT and particularly OSR have had measured and reasonable responses.  Some others have not.  I don't recall seeing Fuzzy in the thread.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Attacking a poster not here is infra dig. I dissent. I would far prefer that I were attacked in his stead, as one who is here. I mean that.

Well, since you asked...

Whattaya mean with that Latin stuff?  You calling us a bunch of pigs or something?  Talk American!!

[GeorgiaModerate]

FORMER PRESIDENT TRUMP HAD A GENERAL DECLASSIFICATION ORDER, particularly related to the FBI's Crossfire Hurricane Investigation....

Now we know why they went in. Instead of asking for it when they were there in June they raided the thing two months later.

MEMORANDUM FOR THE ATTORNEY GENERAL
THE DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE
THE DIRECTOR OF THE CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY

SUBJECT:    Declassification of Certain Materials Related to the FBI’s Crossfire Hurricane Investigation

By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, I hereby direct the following:

Section 1.  Declassification and Release.    At my request, on December 30, 2020, the Department of Justice provided the White House with a binder of materials related to the Federal Bureau of Investigation’s Crossfire Hurricane investigation.  Portions of the documents in the binder have remained classified and have not been released to the Congress or the public.  I requested the documents so that a declassification review could be performed and so I could determine to what extent materials in the binder should be released in unclassified form.

I determined that the materials in that binder should be declassified to the maximum extent possible.  In response, and as part of the iterative process of the declassification review, under a cover letter dated January 17, 2021, the Federal Bureau of Investigation noted its continuing objection to any further declassification of the materials in the binder and also, on the basis of a review that included Intelligence Community equities, identified the passages that it believed it was most crucial to keep from public disclosure.  I have determined to accept the redactions proposed for continued classification by the FBI in that January 17 submission.

I hereby declassify the remaining materials in the binder.  This is my final determination under the declassification review and I have directed the Attorney General to implement the redactions proposed in the FBI’s January 17 submission and return to the White House an appropriately redacted copy.

My decision to declassify materials within the binder is subject to the limits identified above and does not extend to materials that must be protected from disclosure pursuant to orders of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court and does not require the disclosure of certain personally identifiable information or any other materials that must be protected from disclosure under applicable law.  Accordingly, at my direction, the Attorney General has conducted an appropriate review to ensure that materials provided in the binder may be disclosed by the White House in accordance with applicable law.

Sec. 2.  General Provisions.   (a)  Nothing in this memorandum shall be construed to impair or otherwise affect:

(i)   the authority granted by law to an executive department or agency, or the head thereof; or

(ii)  the functions of the Director of the Office of Management and Budget relating to budgetary, administrative, or legislative proposals.

(b)  This memorandum shall be implemented consistent with applicable law and subject to the availability of appropriations.

(c)  This memorandum is not intended to, and does not, create any right or benefit, substantive or procedural, enforceable at law or in equity by any party against the United States, its departments, agencies, or entities, its officers, employees, or agents, or any other person.

(d)  The Attorney General is authorized and directed to publish this memorandum in the Federal Register.

DONALD J. TRUMP

https://trumpwhitehouse.archives.gov/presidential-actions/memorandum-declassification-certain-materials-related-fbis-crossfire-hurricane-investigation/

The Memorandum was issued January 19th 2021.

I’m not seeing how this is a “general declassification order”. It seems to be limited to a set of documents relating to Crossfire Hurricane/the Russia investigation.

Yes, "general declassification order" is a figment of 2016's imagination.  Read the order and it specifically applies only to the items in one binder, and with some limitations spelled out.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/joshtpm/status/1558473537081458688

[GeorgiaModerate]

As I mentioned day ago, the American people electing him in 2016 gave him alot of power. Executive privilege is a very powerful thing.

Mediocre trolling aside, only a complete moron would believe the president can will his private citizen self government property, particularly after being fired by the electorate.

Government secrets, the White House, Air Force One, the Resolute Desk, the silverware, and busts of Abraham Lincoln belong to the people's government, not disgruntled former employees.

So the ACLU and every liberal hated the "Espionage Act" for decades, but now they like it to try and go after Trump?

I think the best result is to let the American people decide his fate at the ballot box.

You ignored the question I asked you earlier, but I'm going to keep asking it until you answer:

Do you believe that Trump should be above the law?  Yes or no.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/maggieNYT/status/1558483432170217476

Game over.

[GeorgiaModerate]

About that Unitary Executive theory someone brought up earlier...

https://twitter.com/AshaRangappa_/status/1558446297186811904
https://twitter.com/AshaRangappa_/status/1558448126268215296