FBI search warrant executed at Mar-a-Lago (Update: Trump Indicted!)

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/mehdirhasan/status/1557800420935958529

[GeorgiaModerate]

Looks interesting that Trump was responding to subpoena already. It makes the raid look more excessive to the public at large.

I'm kind of surprised by the rally behind Trump even from Senate and House leadership as well as some left-leaners like Geraldo and Cuomo.

Nope, you've got it backwards.  He returned some boxes early this year.  It was discovered that he still had more, so those were subpoenaed, and returned in June.  But then an informant told the FBI that Trump *still* had more boxes that hadn't been returned -- i.e. he failed to return the remaining documents pursuant to the subpoena.  So they got the search warrant and went in.  This was an entirely reasonable escalation.  Trump had already demonstrated that a subpoena was not sufficient to get him to return all the documents.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/Acyn/status/1557802744563412992

https://twitter.com/Popehat/status/1557801323659112448

[GeorgiaModerate]

Short & to the point.  Basically: Garland calls Trump's bluff by moving to unseal the warrant and receipt for items taken.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Good. I also find it interesting that Team Trump is now telling GOP officials to back off trying to defend Trump because more damning information may begin to come out.

Here's an interesting possibility: will Trump oppose unsealing the warrant?

[GeorgiaModerate]

Good. I also find it interesting that Team Trump is now telling GOP officials to back off trying to defend Trump because more damning information may begin to come out.

Here's an interesting possibility: will Trump oppose unsealing the warrant?

Even if his lawyers do, can't a judge overrule them and unseal it anyway? I don't think it's as simple as Trump saying "no, keep it sealed."

Yes, the judge has the final decision.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Garland says he personally approved it? so then it looks like a Biden political appointment hitjob.

The problem for dems is that this continues to look like a personal witchhunt against Trump for political reasons, not legal reasons.

How's the weather in St. Petersburg today?

[GeorgiaModerate]

What do you think is in it that would be damning enough for people to bail on him? The 74 million voters he got in 2020 when he lost?

It's not about people bailing on him.  It's about whether he broke the law.

[GeorgiaModerate]

What do you think is in it that would be damning enough for people to bail on him? The 74 million voters he got in 2020 when he lost?

There are at least 74 million terrible adult citizens in the US, yes.

#ARAB #AllRepublicansAreBad #All74Million #SorryNotSorry

Gee I wonder why you guys are unable to appeal to people who don’t vote for you guys .

The other top thread on USGD right now is a deranged right winger trying to take down the Cincinnati FBI with lethal force and here you are complaining that a Santander post is excessively alienating. OK 👍

Yes that guy is horrible and should be locked up but to say 74 million people are horrible is extremely condescending and hackish .

How do you feel about Garland's statement today?

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/kyledcheney/status/1557818979858653185

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/robertjdenault/status/1557823028590952449

[GeorgiaModerate]

Please don't derail the thread with partisan bickering. 

[GeorgiaModerate]

Yah Trump really can’t object to this

Well, if this is right, he may want to keep that inventory hidden:

https://twitter.com/maggieNYT/status/1557839391141289986

The Top Secret classification applies to information "the unauthorized disclosure of which reasonably could be expected to cause exceptionally grave damage to the national security." For more information:

Examples of Top Secret information are currently given in National Security Council (NSC) regulations concerning FOIA requests for classified documents. Those examples are "armed hostilities against the United States or its allies," "disruption of foreign relations vitally affecting the national security," "the compromise of vital national defense plans or complex cryptologic and communications intelligence systems," "the revelation of sensitive intelligence operations," and "the disclosure of scientific or technological developments vital to the national security."7 Those examples in NSC regulations are the same those used in EO 11652 and are also found in the DoD Information Security Program Regulations.8 A 1964 DoD instruction provided more-detailed examples of information that might require Top Secret classification. Some of those examples are as follows:

https://sgp.fas.org/library/quist2/chap_7.html

Click the link in the quote to see the actual examples, which are exceptionally serious stuff.

If Trump had Top Secret documents in his possession, he's cooked.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/SpiroAgnewGhost/status/1557779712956440576

I don't believe this for a second.

Nothing damaging will come out.

The search warrant will prove nothing.

Far more important is the AFFADAVIT!!!

Don't worry.  It will come out with the indictment.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/ktbenner/status/1557848942800687106

[GeorgiaModerate]

Maggie Hagemann is a fraud, we all know that.

And so is that Benner girl.

This must be a difficult time for you.  Perhaps you should take a break.

[GeorgiaModerate]

For perhaps the first time on this website, Nuclear Elmo is truly appropriate.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Stealing nuclear docs could be considered treason, right?

Depends what he did with them and what the documents are. But the Rosenbergs were of course executed for sharing "nuclear docs" with the Soviets.

The definition of treason is neccessarily narrow.

I would advise everyone to calm down slightly. I'm always a bit leery of stories like this because they're too unbelievable to be true. That said, this sort of thing would absolutely be in keeping with Trump's past.

Why would he do it? Simple: he believes he can't be touched. Like many autocrats, he believes he is above the law; he pushes the envelope as far as he can. It's now hitting him that he's not Pinochet and that rule of law still applies, and he hates it. He despises the fact that the law applies to him. A quote from my favourite videogame of all time applies well here: "Once a man has grasped the scepter, it is hard to let go of it."

Again, this hasn't been confirmed by official sources, so I would advise everyone to calm down slightly.

I agree that even this may not meet the Constitutional definition of treason.  However, *if* he caused/allowed such information to pass to any foreign power (and that is entirely speculative at this point), I think espionage would be a slam dunk.

For some reason, Kushner's $2 billion deal from the Saudis just crossed my mind.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Conservatives are going to go 100% in on the “FBI planted evidence” conspiracy theories now. It’s the only option left for them.

Either way, you will have 60-80 million Americans on his side.

You can't hang someone for treason that 1/4 of the American population worships like a God. It's playing with fire, especially considering we're likely to be out of control of the House in a few short months.

In short, you believe that popular people are above the law.

[GeorgiaModerate]

So on face value if this was true, the FBI just allowed nuclear documents to sit in the Mar a Lago for 18 months..

Or no one noticed they were gone.

Do you ever get tired of working as a Trump spin doctor for free? Garland literally just said today that they had exhausted every other option to get the documents back before finally seeking a warrant.

Ah, so you just let nuclear secrets just remain in a basement of a property.. periodically requesting for someone to return them.

Remember that according to some reports, it was only recently that an informant tipped off the FBI/DOJ that there were more documents still at MAL.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Garland moving to unseal the search warrant is bonaheaded stupid. I guess he wants the whole world to see US Nuclear Documents? That can't be real.

Trump can only be convicted & indicted if these Docs were there and the Feds have it now. I've seen no evidence of that.

Duh. Nobody has seen the evidence yet except those who collected it today. What a dumb talking point.

Also, the documents themselves won’t be in the warrant! Even their titles could be redacted from the publicly released version if they’re sensitive enough.

[GeorgiaModerate]

Final thought before I go to bed: everyone (both sides) remember that we are far from knowing the details on this. Most of these reports are leaks and/or speculation, which may or may not be informed speculation.

However, no matter how much the Trump defenders spin, *IF* Trump did have Top Secret and/or nuclear documents in his possession, it’s all over for him. There are no excuses or mitigating factors that would save him.

[GeorgiaModerate]

If Trump gets even a single vote after having been revealed to have stolen nuclear secrets, we have failed as a country.

Spoiler alert: He gets AT LEAST 40 million votes in the general (unless he's an Independent instead of a Republican).

...and that is wild lowballing. If Adolf Hitler rose from the grave and somehow was the republican nominee in 2024, he'd still get at least 40% of the vote. That is where we are.

Nah.  Hitler wasn't a natural-born US citizen.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/BillKristol/status/1558109952652222464

[GeorgiaModerate]

Man, if George Will and David Brooks are skeptical, that tells me it really probably won't amount to much. Even if it does, executive privilege is a really, really important thing.

The American people gave Trump alot of breathing space when they elected him in 2016.

By your logic, that means they took it away when they defeated him in 2020.  But that's all irrelevant.  Popularity does not provide a get-out-of-jail-free card, even if -- or especially if -- the person's fans threaten violence if their idol is indicted/arrested/convicted.

I'll put it to you as a direct question, citizenq: do you think Trump should be above the law? Yes or no.