Dems (and others on the left), do you prefer to "battle" Libertarians or Fundies (user search)
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  Dems (and others on the left), do you prefer to "battle" Libertarians or Fundies (search mode)
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Poll
Question: Who would you rather have as your political enemies?
#1
Fundies
 
#2
Libertarians
 
#3
Neo-Cons
 
#4
Other (explain)
 
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Partisan results

Total Voters: 24

Author Topic: Dems (and others on the left), do you prefer to "battle" Libertarians or Fundies  (Read 7885 times)
The Mikado
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« on: June 08, 2008, 08:57:55 PM »

Wiki claims a lot more "factions" in the GOP. cite  But most of them overlap with big three above.  I'm just curious.  I always assumed the left would be friendlier with Libertarians than they would be with Fundies and other more "traditional" Republicans, but recently I've seen a LOT of anti-Libertarian posts.  Culminating with the thread in U.S. GP where left leaning posters are hammering Libertarians and praising Fundies.  I could have sworn that you guys have been bemoaning the Fundies as the worst thing since Hitler for the past 7 years or so, has Ron Paul scared you?  I have a theory or two as to why this is, but I'll wait and see how this turns out.

In my personal opinion, Libertarianism is a far more dangerous ideology than politicized religious fundamentalism (though I of course oppose both).  This is mainly because Libertarianism's infantile grasp on government and its role in society manages to capture the imagination of many intelligent and talented people, something that politicized religious fundamentalism, for the most part, cannot do.

Libertarians who engage in so-called "good government" rhetoric and try to take away earmarks and so-called "pork projects" that revitalize communities and smooth the passage of good legislation.  Libertarians who oppose government subsidies of attempts to culture and enlighten Americans (from the NEA to PBS&NPR) assist in the dumbing-down of our great land.  Libertarians attack one of the largest employers in the nation, the US Federal Government, along with state and municipal governments all the way down, endangering the livelihoods of countless civil servants while slandering these hard-working Americans as "inefficient bureaucrats."  Libertarianism is a dangerous ideology that I wholeheartedly oppose.
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The Mikado
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Posts: 21,870


« Reply #1 on: June 09, 2008, 09:16:59 PM »

In my personal opinion, Libertarianism is a far more dangerous ideology than politicized religious fundamentalism (though I of course oppose both).

Right, the ideology that wishes for freedom of speech, thought, belief, etc. is far more dangerous than the ones that throw rocks at you until you die because you dare to disagree with them. Clearly.

No, the ideology that wishes for the dismantling of the intergenerational social contract known as Social Security, that opposes the very concept of societal responsibility with their divisive "individualism" rhetoric, that is opposed to every protection and reform the reformers of the 1930s bravely fought for, especially calling for the deregulation of public utilities which puts institutions crucial to the functioning of our country into the hands of plunderers like Enron...that's the ideology I oppose.

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Given they'd be following a non-aggressive philosophy for the most part, I don't see what would be so frightening about that. Frankly I'd be more scared of the ideologies that appeal to the uneducated and gullible masses, given that's where the real power is.[/quote]

Those people never actually make it to the seat of power.  People who pander to them (like George W. Bush) do.  With a few exceptions, like Governor Huckabee and Senator Brownback, true believers in the message of Christian conservatism don't rise to prominence and elected power.

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As Ernest mentioned, some projects can do a lot of good, but frankly I don't see a $25 million bridge to an island of just 50 people who were already content to live there without a bridge as a wise investment. There's numerous other ridiculous items as well.[/quote]

You know, I've actually met someone from Ketchikan who said that he'd really appreciate a bridge so that he wouldn't have to take a ferry to get to the airport on the island.  I tend to agree that some cases are a bit beyond the pale, like that one, but constituent service, including pork, is actually a legitimate government function.  All these attacks on earmarks and government projects in congressmen's home districts as if they were evidence of corruption really aggravates me.  There are legitimately corrupt people on Capitol Hill, but the relatively small amounts of discretionary spending spent on pet projects is necessary for the horse trading needed to pass major legislation, and many times, has legitimately beneficial results for the districts it is used on.

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I doubt if those disappeared that the nation would become any dumber. And you know, I think we could do without Barny or the Teletubbies.[/quote]

Ha ha.  I was first exposed to Charles Dickens by a made-for-TV adaptation of David Copperfield on PBS.  Without that, I might still not know who Mr. Micawber was.  I've seen some fairly incredible things on Masterpiece Theatre.  And all for free on the public airwaves, not on some premium HBO channel.

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If the government was downsized, a number of the services would legitimately have a good chance of privatizing. (not all of course, but I don't advocate downsizing every bit of government) And yes, many of those civil servants are inefficient bureaucrats - again, not all, but enough to significantly slow down important projects and increase their costs.[/quote]

Privatized and deregulated like the power companies?  No more Enrons, please.

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Yes, non-aggression and freedom are exceptionally dangerous.
[/quote]

Any ideology whose definition of "freedom," undermines social cohesion, involves the further atomization of society, and advocates a lack of interest in collective action to benefit mankind, yes, is dangerous.
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