Opinion of Scoop Jackson

[Kaine for Senate '18]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_M._Jackson
Very positive, we need more Democrats like him.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Bump.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Bump

It's a pity he never won the nomination; he'd have been a better President than Nixon, Ford, or Carter.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

One of the most biggest disgraces to the party ever.

I'd save that for the likes of Bilbo, myself.

Indeed, Bilbo or Eastland; certainly not Scoop Jackson, the pro-civil rights Democrat.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

His foreign policy earns him a negative rating.

He had a great foreign policy:

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[Kaine for Senate '18]

One of the most biggest disgraces to the party ever.

I'd save that for the likes of Bilbo, myself.

Don't know about him but I'd vote for J. William Fulbright over Scoop Jackson a million times.

Fulbright's great, but Jackson is a stronger supporter of Israel.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Vietnam was winnable. It's just that LBJ focked it by micromanagement.

Yes, yes it was.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Vietnam was winnable. It's just that LBJ focked it by micromanagement.

Yes, yes it was.

No, it wasn't. Not with the lack of clear objectives.

Yes it was.  It just would have cost to much in money, men and resect in the rest of the world (and would have likely lead to WWIII).

Well, I wouldn't really consider that "winning".

That isn't winning.  Winning would have been preventing Communism from spreading to South Vietnam; that could have been attained.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Preventing communism from spreading to South Vietnam = Not worth a single dead US soldier. No oppressive regime like South Vietnam is ever worth a single American life no matter what the alternative is. Diem and his gang should've just've been told to go to hell like NATO European allies did.

I'm guessing you don't think it was worth in Korea either?

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Preventing communism from spreading to South Vietnam = Not worth a single dead US soldier. No oppressive regime like South Vietnam is ever worth a single American life no matter what the alternative is. Diem and his gang should've just've been told to go to hell like NATO European allies did.

I'm guessing you don't think it was worth in Korea either?

That was a UN-approved action against aggression by the north while Vietnam was just the US attempting to continue France's ridiculous colonial war.

We were attempting to preserve a non-Communist government, which is what mattered.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Preventing communism from spreading to South Vietnam = Not worth a single dead US soldier. No oppressive regime like South Vietnam is ever worth a single American life no matter what the alternative is. Diem and his gang should've just've been told to go to hell like NATO European allies did.

I'm guessing you don't think it was worth in Korea either?

That was a UN-approved action against aggression by the north while Vietnam was just the US attempting to continue France's ridiculous colonial war.

We were attempting to preserve a non-Communist government, which is what mattered.

OK, so lets force thousands of our citizens to go to a hell hole and likely die so we can prevent a despotic Communist government from replacing a despotic non-Communist government. Brilliant! Wonderful cause! Especially considering the despotic non-Communist government DID not survive and where was the stack of dominos that were going to fall?

If LBJ had not attempted to balance guns and butter, and had gone into the war full scale, fewer American lives would have been lost.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Preventing communism from spreading to South Vietnam = Not worth a single dead US soldier. No oppressive regime like South Vietnam is ever worth a single American life no matter what the alternative is. Diem and his gang should've just've been told to go to hell like NATO European allies did.

I'm guessing you don't think it was worth in Korea either?

That was a UN-approved action against aggression by the north while Vietnam was just the US attempting to continue France's ridiculous colonial war.

We were attempting to preserve a non-Communist government, which is what mattered.

OK, so lets force thousands of our citizens to go to a hell hole and likely die so we can prevent a despotic Communist government from replacing a despotic non-Communist government. Brilliant! Wonderful cause! Especially considering the despotic non-Communist government DID not survive and where was the stack of dominos that were going to fall?

If LBJ had not attempted to balance guns and butter, and had gone into the war full scale, fewer American lives would have been lost.

But why go to war? You haven't answered that. The Vietnamese people clearly wanted Minh.

Aside from the fact that they attacked us first, the Communists were never elected in South Vietnam.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

That's because there never were fair and free elections there.

And you still buy the Gulf of Tonkin incident? It was obviously faked.

That was a problem, but it doesn't justify what the Communists did.

Yes, I still believe the Gulf of Tonkin incident.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

That's because there never were fair and free elections there.

And you still buy the Gulf of Tonkin incident? It was obviously faked.

That was a problem, but it doesn't justify what the Communists did.

How was the government of South Vietnam more legitimate than the communists?

They were equally legitimate; but the North Vietnam government attacked South Vietnam.

That's because there never were fair and free elections there.

And you still buy the Gulf of Tonkin incident? It was obviously faked.

That was a problem, but it doesn't justify what the Communists did.

Yes, I still believe the Gulf of Tonkin incident.

What the hell does that mean?

That I believe the Gulf of Tonkin incident happened.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Hmm... Let's ask Scoop Jackson Democrat what he thinks of Scoop Jackson. That's as silly as asking MarkWarner08 what he thinks of Mark Warner.

Yeah, but I wasn't using that name when I made the poll.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Continued LOL @ Benconstine for supporting Vietnam because a Democrat started it but opposing Afghanistan because a Republican started it

For the last fu(king time, I support Afghanistan.

That's because there never were fair and free elections there.

And you still buy the Gulf of Tonkin incident? It was obviously faked.

That was a problem, but it doesn't justify what the Communists did.

Yes, I still believe the Gulf of Tonkin incident.

so you think the fact that the North Vietnamese government were not fairly elected is justification for a military invasion, yet the fact that the South Vietnamese government was not fairly elected is merely a 'problem'.

I don't justify invading North Vietnam, merely preventing them from taking over South Vietnam.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Hopefully the Obama Administration will embrace Jackson's ideology fully, rather than the horrible, twisted way the Bush Administration did.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

I think Jackson's views certainly had a big influence on our modern day neo-cons, but they sadly abandoned his domestic views, leading to a twisted, horrible ideology.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Wow, Positive has a majority? And people call this forum left wing biased.

The Democratic Party needs to be more like Scoop Jackson.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Also never apologized for his cheerleading of Japanese Internment.

That's the biggest problem I have with him; although, Earl Warren never apologized either.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

People seem to ignore Jackson's excellent record on enviromental affairs.  He wrote many of the landmark legislation, and was able to make sure it passed Congress.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

People seem to ignore Jackson's excellent record on enviromental affairs.

Not I.  Jackson's work is a major reason that Washington developed a reputation as a green state.

Good.  Many Democrats, then and now, fail to appreciate his record on that issue.  He probably had a better record than many Democrats in Congress today.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

In every sense of the term, one of the greatest freedom fighters of the 60's-80's era.

And the 50's, as well.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Unprincipled neocon scumbag collectivist.

Unprincipled?  He was anything but unprincipled.  He stood by his views, and didn't change them for political convenience.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Awesome article here from a few years ago about the Scoop-Neocon connection:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2005/nov/23/iraq.comment