Special Election megathread (6/11: OH-6, 6/25: CO-4)

[The Undefeatable Debbie Stabenow]

Turner dominates both the primary and general. I get to watch Atlas Dems rage while Congress becomes one member more populist; win-win.

Who's raging?  Do you see me raging or crying about Ilhan Omar or Rashida Tlaib or Cori Bush?

They're terrible people (especially Omar).  They're really f---ing obnoxious.  They're breathtakingly arrogant.  They lie constantly.  They say insane things on a weekly basis.  They are embarrassing to the party.  They are embarrassing to those who have to constantly rationalize and defend their stupid statements.  They constantly kneecap our candidates by providing the Republican Party with a paintbrush of stupidity and awfulness which is then used to tar our whole party.

That's not "rage", that's just the truth.  If a blue avatar was on here talking about how horrible and embarrassing Matt Gaetz is, that's not "raging", that's just the truth.  The problem is that so many self-proclaimed "progressives" have turned their movement into little more than a set of personality cults united behind a sophomoric purity test.  They get obsessed with these candidates and buy into this notion that they're going to save America, when really all they're doing is advancing their own careers and raking in cash by repeating the same dozen or so talking points you can hear from a million different leftist pundits a thousand times a day.  None of them have, or ever will, accomplish anything of note other than making themselves rich and famous.

And yet so many "progressives" worship them.  Why?  Because they go around passionately attacking Democrats and repeating your favorite talking points, and because you see a lot of your friends worshipping them.  That's all there is too it.

Nina Turner is just another drop in the bucket.  Nobody is "afraid" of your movement.  Their self-promotional theatrics and arrogance would be eye-rolling if there wasn't so much collateral political damage involved.  And of course there's also the risk that if our majority shrinks enough, a small band of 5-6 crazy people could unite to become the House's version of Joe Manchin and pull aggravating political stunts anytime their fundraising needs a boost, like refusing to vote for a reconciliation package unless Pelosi holds a vote on an official Congressional endorsement of Hamas, or whatever the politically suicidal cause of the week is.

You know that the House majority is already small enough for this, right? It's almost like they aren't trying to sabotage the party in the way that you think that they are. A small cohort of moderates in the Senate are the only individuals responsible for the lack of progress on a myriad of the party's critical initiatives, period. God forbid progressives actually advocate for the sizable share of the Democratic base that wants greater scrutiny on foreign aid to Israel or doesn't want us to eliminate the SALT cap or wants student debt eliminated. I have criticized progressives' political instincts in the past and will continue to do so when I see it fit, but I just don't think that there is compelling evidence to suggest that they pose an existential threat to the Democratic Party's electoral fortunes.

And the difference between you complaining about Rashida Tlaib and Republicans complaining about Matt Gaetz is that Matt Gaetz is almost certainly a literal child predator. Not much of an equivalence there.

[The Undefeatable Debbie Stabenow]

This won't matter, but it's funny to see Turner supports on Twitter talk about Hillary's endorsement being "the kiss of death" when Hillary handily beat Sanders in OH-11 in the 2016 primary.

[The Undefeatable Debbie Stabenow]

This won't matter, but it's funny to see Turner supports on Twitter talk about Hillary's endorsement being "the kiss of death" when Hillary handily beat Sanders in OH-11 in the 2016 primary.

And absolutely nothing has happened since then.

It's still ridiculous to act like this endorsement will harm Brown. Of course it's not 2016 anymore, but I have no reason to believe that a significant number of Hillary's supporters in the 2016 primary have turned against her in the last five years. And as far as everyone wants to make this race and the 2016 primary proxies for the broader moderate-progressive conflict, the 2020 presidential primary certainly was a resounding win for the moderate side, including in the Midwest.

I would probably rather have Turner in Congress, so I'm not endorsing Hillary's endorsement, I'm just saying that Hillary is still a well-liked figure among most Democrats and thus calling her endorsement "the kiss of death" is laughable.

[The Undefeatable Debbie Stabenow]

This won't matter, but it's funny to see Turner supports on Twitter talk about Hillary's endorsement being "the kiss of death" when Hillary handily beat Sanders in OH-11 in the 2016 primary.

And absolutely nothing has happened since then.

It's still ridiculous to act like this endorsement will harm Brown. Of course it's not 2016 anymore, but I have no reason to believe that a significant number of Hillary's supporters in the 2016 primary have turned against her in the last five years. And as far as everyone wants to make this race and the 2016 primary proxies for the broader moderate-progressive conflict, the 2020 presidential primary certainly was a resounding win for the moderate side, including in the Midwest.

I would probably rather have Turner in Congress, so I'm not endorsing Hillary's endorsement, I'm just saying that Hillary is still a well-liked figure among most Democrats and thus calling her endorsement "the kiss of death" is laughable.

I agree with you that "kiss of death" is a bit extreme, but it's also likely more tongue-in-cheek than it is a serious statement. Like you say, this will have absolutely no impact on the race. Still, this endorsement reeks of yet another stab at a Bernie acolyte for the sake of doing so. Did she ever endorse a primary challenge to Ilhan Omar, Rashida Tlaib, etc?

I wish it was entirely tongue-in-cheek, but online progressives are largely convinced that Hillary is genuinely disliked by a majority of the Democratic base, much as they are still in disbelief that Hillary and Biden actually won their respective primaries.

I mean, there's really no doubt that Hillary harbors some resentment towards the Sanders campaign; she pretty much said it herself during her Hulu documentary, and I think she talks at length about it in her book. But at the end of the day, this race is between a mainstream Democrat and a progressive who has repeatedly criticized the party and its figureheads, so it shouldn't be surprising that Hillary would endorse the former even if the latter had nothing to do with Bernie Sanders personally. Was her personal animus towards Turner a motivating factor? I'm sure it was, but it's a totally predictable endorsement from an ideological angle. And no, she didn't endorse Tlaib's or Omar's challengers last year, but that's pretty different because they were incumbents whereas this is an open race. (And Omar and Tlaib pretty aggressively associated themselves with Sanders too, so I guess I don't understand the contrast you're trying to make. Hell, Tlaib got in some hot water for booing Hillary's name at an event in 2020.)

She made plenty of endorsements in open congressional primaries in 2018 and 2020, so this isn't really unusual. Once again, I'm not denying that there was any personal animus involved, but it's still par for the course.

[The Undefeatable Debbie Stabenow]

This won't matter, but it's funny to see Turner supports on Twitter talk about Hillary's endorsement being "the kiss of death" when Hillary handily beat Sanders in OH-11 in the 2016 primary.

And absolutely nothing has happened since then.

It's still ridiculous to act like this endorsement will harm Brown. Of course it's not 2016 anymore, but I have no reason to believe that a significant number of Hillary's supporters in the 2016 primary have turned against her in the last five years. And as far as everyone wants to make this race and the 2016 primary proxies for the broader moderate-progressive conflict, the 2020 presidential primary certainly was a resounding win for the moderate side, including in the Midwest.

I would probably rather have Turner in Congress, so I'm not endorsing Hillary's endorsement, I'm just saying that Hillary is still a well-liked figure among most Democrats and thus calling her endorsement "the kiss of death" is laughable.

I agree with you that "kiss of death" is a bit extreme, but it's also likely more tongue-in-cheek than it is a serious statement. Like you say, this will have absolutely no impact on the race. Still, this endorsement reeks of yet another stab at a Bernie acolyte for the sake of doing so. Did she ever endorse a primary challenge to Ilhan Omar, Rashida Tlaib, etc?

I'm amazed at how she manages to consistently throw her support behind the most incompetent politicians possible. It's different from picking someone like Henry Cuellar to own the bros. Her congressional endorsements since her loss have been:

* Donna Shalala (lazy, dog**** campaigner, from the Clinton/Feinstein school of thought where their experience entitles them to power)
* Eliot Engel (got caught in 4k, constantly fueled the narrative that he was out of touch with his district)
* Shontel Brown (Has been an absolute trainwreck running the CCDP, can't even lock down her own machine. Probably the most incompetent congressional candidate I've seen in my lifetime.)

1 for 4 still isn't a very good track record, but you are conveniently omitting Haley Stevens.

[The Undefeatable Debbie Stabenow]

This won't matter, but it's funny to see Turner supports on Twitter talk about Hillary's endorsement being "the kiss of death" when Hillary handily beat Sanders in OH-11 in the 2016 primary.

And absolutely nothing has happened since then.

It's still ridiculous to act like this endorsement will harm Brown. Of course it's not 2016 anymore, but I have no reason to believe that a significant number of Hillary's supporters in the 2016 primary have turned against her in the last five years. And as far as everyone wants to make this race and the 2016 primary proxies for the broader moderate-progressive conflict, the 2020 presidential primary certainly was a resounding win for the moderate side, including in the Midwest.

I would probably rather have Turner in Congress, so I'm not endorsing Hillary's endorsement, I'm just saying that Hillary is still a well-liked figure among most Democrats and thus calling her endorsement "the kiss of death" is laughable.

I agree with you that "kiss of death" is a bit extreme, but it's also likely more tongue-in-cheek than it is a serious statement. Like you say, this will have absolutely no impact on the race. Still, this endorsement reeks of yet another stab at a Bernie acolyte for the sake of doing so. Did she ever endorse a primary challenge to Ilhan Omar, Rashida Tlaib, etc?

I'm amazed at how she manages to consistently throw her support behind the most incompetent politicians possible. It's different from picking someone like Henry Cuellar to own the bros. Her congressional endorsements since her loss have been:

* Donna Shalala (lazy, dog**** campaigner, from the Clinton/Feinstein school of thought where their experience entitles them to power)
* Eliot Engel (got caught in 4k, constantly fueled the narrative that he was out of touch with his district)
* Shontel Brown (Has been an absolute trainwreck running the CCDP, can't even lock down her own machine. Probably the most incompetent congressional candidate I've seen in my lifetime.)

1 for 4 still isn't a very good track record, but you are conveniently omitting Haley Stevens.

Who won by less than Elissa Slotkin in a bluer district and also seems a tad unstable.

I’m not saying she’s an electoral titan, only that she’s certainly a league above the other three. (And Slotkin has proven herself to be an exceptionally good candidate, so I don’t know if comparisons to her are all that telling.)

[The Undefeatable Debbie Stabenow]

This won't matter, but it's funny to see Turner supports on Twitter talk about Hillary's endorsement being "the kiss of death" when Hillary handily beat Sanders in OH-11 in the 2016 primary.

And absolutely nothing has happened since then.

It's still ridiculous to act like this endorsement will harm Brown. Of course it's not 2016 anymore, but I have no reason to believe that a significant number of Hillary's supporters in the 2016 primary have turned against her in the last five years. And as far as everyone wants to make this race and the 2016 primary proxies for the broader moderate-progressive conflict, the 2020 presidential primary certainly was a resounding win for the moderate side, including in the Midwest.

I would probably rather have Turner in Congress, so I'm not endorsing Hillary's endorsement, I'm just saying that Hillary is still a well-liked figure among most Democrats and thus calling her endorsement "the kiss of death" is laughable.

I agree with you that "kiss of death" is a bit extreme, but it's also likely more tongue-in-cheek than it is a serious statement. Like you say, this will have absolutely no impact on the race. Still, this endorsement reeks of yet another stab at a Bernie acolyte for the sake of doing so. Did she ever endorse a primary challenge to Ilhan Omar, Rashida Tlaib, etc?

I'm amazed at how she manages to consistently throw her support behind the most incompetent politicians possible. It's different from picking someone like Henry Cuellar to own the bros. Her congressional endorsements since her loss have been:

* Donna Shalala (lazy, dog**** campaigner, from the Clinton/Feinstein school of thought where their experience entitles them to power)
* Eliot Engel (got caught in 4k, constantly fueled the narrative that he was out of touch with his district)
* Shontel Brown (Has been an absolute trainwreck running the CCDP, can't even lock down her own machine. Probably the most incompetent congressional candidate I've seen in my lifetime.)

1 for 4 still isn't a very good track record, but you are conveniently omitting Haley Stevens.

And you are conveniently omitting Joe Crowley. lol

When did she endorse Crowley in his primary? Don’t think she did.

[The Undefeatable Debbie Stabenow]

Not mentioned yet here, but Ayanna Pressley endorsed Nina Turner yesterday. Fairly big news considering Pressley's role as a major Warren surrogate in 2019/20. I wonder if other "Warren Democrats" will be announcing their support for Turner as well.

I mean, Porter already endorsed Turner and is probably a higher-profile member of the Warren sphere than Pressley is.

[The Undefeatable Debbie Stabenow]

Not mentioned yet here, but Ayanna Pressley endorsed Nina Turner yesterday. Fairly big news considering Pressley's role as a major Warren surrogate in 2019/20. I wonder if other "Warren Democrats" will be announcing their support for Turner as well.

I mean, Porter already endorsed Turner and is probably a higher-profile member of the Warren sphere than Pressley is.

Hard disagree. The general public is way more likely to know who Ayanna Pressley is than Katie Porter.

Katie Porter gets a ton of press from nearly every important congressional hearing she attends; she’s all over left-leaning media. While Pressley is a part of the original four-person “Squad,” she’s definitely the least known of the bunch because she’s not AOC, she hasn’t had Omar and Tlaib’s repeated controversies, and she’s never been targeted by the right in the same way that the other three have been.

Case in point: Porter is currently trending on Twitter for no reason other than because a bunch of Democrats want her specifically to be on the 1/6 commission.

[The Undefeatable Debbie Stabenow]

Yikes, looks like that Free Beacon poll may be true if they’re bringing in the big guns like this!
https://twitter.com/daveweigel/status/1415731970672365579?s=21

Great news for the Shontel Brown campaign- Having someone as toxic as AOC go and campaign for Turner will only increase Shontel's chances of winning.

I had said earlier that it was laughable that anyone believed that Hillary’s endorsement of Brown would help Turner. This take is equally laughable.