Re: Office of PSOL—Beginning of the Institute of Atlasian Progression

[Former President tack50]

I have wanted to write on this thread for a while, but due to several things getting in the way I have not been able to. I guess this time is as good as any. My 2 cents on the several points that have been made:

WM would not have won without Labor support. This is a fact. WM running in a 3 way race would have been destroyed by Muaddib and whichever replacement Labor ran. He would be lucky if he even got 5 votes. If running as the candidate of the right maybe he would have won, but I doubt he would have been nominated in the first place. He may still be nominated in April, but he is also the incumbent now.

I can easily point out to my own personal experience. I ran a campaign without Labor support once (January 2019 CoD). I got demolished and only got my own vote. You can't get anywhere without party support. Just look at the recent Lincoln governor race for another example.

West Midlander has betrayed his own voters. He was elected because he was the Labor Party candidate, pure and simple. In my opinion, a recall would be in order to try to see if voters want to remove him from office, though given the extremely high thresholds to meet I do not think it should be pursued.

I do not support any efforts to extralegally remove WM. I mean, I do support them in meme fashion (who does not like a good coup! ). But if it was really something serious I would oppose them.

In terms of views, either WM is not a good fit for the Federalist Party, or he is having changes faster than anyone we have seen before. Sorry but that is just a fact. You do not go from being "to the left of Adam Griffin" to moderate hero in just 2 months.

He might argue that it is the "Labor Party culture" or whatever, but let's be real, no one was pushing WM outside the party. You can easily be a Laborite and a moderate. You do not need to toe the party line 100% of the time in order to be a Laborite. I myself have defected on plenty of votes in Congress and the Lincoln Council and I have voted once for the right presidentially. Yet here I am.

[Former President tack50]

Also, the votes that Fhtagn gets from Feds, are Feds that are her personal vote. They were not "sent" to her. She had them before she left and she has "kept" them by and large as a personal non-ACP vote.

Yes, "the right" is just incompetent with respect to standing up to or asserting control over select individuals within its ranks. Literally half of the instances in which the right has lost the House post-reset has been because fhtagn hoards first preferences like a fatty hoards carbs in their belly. Truly shameful, disorganized and weak-willed behavior is largely to blame for your current congressional predicament. Everybody on the left has a good laugh in every election when she gets like 20 first preferences while every other candidate has like 4 or 5.

The ironic thing is, for a long time, TNF was a target for admiration even among some center-left types. Libertarians also liked him because like MB today, he was a devout social libertarian.

He was also pro-gun and VERY pro explosives:

By a vote of 6-3 this amendment has passed and is sent to the regions for ratification:

Aye: Bore, Polnut, JCL, Windjammer, Bacon King, Cranberry

Nay: Yankee, TNF, Deus

Are you really going to point out that vote: the one where jambles tricked JCL into voting for it when he really wanted to vote against it?

Ok bgwah. He used to throw that around.

You guys have won pv for House consistently most Everytime we lost house. Distribution is meaningless when you lose the pv, you ain't winning a majority. 

I have told you a million times they don't want to be controlled like that. Conservatives aren't liberals or leftists they will tell you to f off and leave.

To be fair that is very weird and interesting. There is a saying in real life that "liberals fall in love, conservatives fall in line".  What is stopping conservative zombies from falling in line for whatever Federalist candidate needs votes, just like irl they would presumably vote for whichever Republican candidate is in the ballot?

[Former President tack50]

The race for General Secretary is still ongoing, and we still have a shot to change things up. For something radically new and accountable to the lefts’ voters, vote for me for General Secretary.

While tack50 would in no doubt be an honorable and efficient General Secretary, he would differ very little in what has been the standard. I would be more accountable to the voters of the party, and allow for more choice in finding our slate, than he would be. I have gotten voters like Bagel23 to vote for our slate before, and my work cutting through partisanship has gotten progressive platforms through. I point to the Tiered progressive gas taxes; which was passed by a majority of independents, Laborites, Paxists, and even Federalist voters. I have the ability to excite people to get the votes needed to pass progressive legislation.

My work far surpasses such early parts of my career, as testament to me always being the attack dog against secessionists and do nothing GMs. In fact, these values did allow for the complete turnaround of the A.C.L.O. into the largest and most active non-electoral organization in Atlasia.

For accountability and quality you can trust, vote for PSOL for General Secretary of this grand Labor Party.

Well, I will not deny I am more of the "status quo" candidate, but when the Labor Party and the Atlasian left in general has won all elections since June 2019 it is not a bad thing at all to keep the current electoral status quo for years to come

I will fight back against the claim that you would be more flexible in finding (presumably) our House and regional slates. For the regions quite simply given the lack of talent and general uncontested elections, anyone who wants it (within limits) will end up in the slate.

Federally it is harder to decide who gets promoted and who doesn't, but there are several key factors. Some are more easy to measure like activity and experience, but others are harder like popularity.

At the end of the day, promotions to the federal level work simply on a principle of "Being there on the right place at the right time"; as my very own career shows.

If we are talking about policy, I do recognize your efforts but it's not like I've been sitting around doing nothing I have passed just as many progressive policies, also as well though bipartisanship. But this is irrelevant to the job of general secretary anyways which is actually a more electorally focused job.

In any case, good luck with the race!

[Former President tack50]

I wish Westy was the sort of Machiavellian schemer who wanted to take full advantage to all of the fools in Labor's camp!

All I did was merely point out how his ideological views would be much more welcome within the Feds and that we need a strong active voice who would have a much more valued place in our party rather than continue to compete with the likes of you, S019, Wulfric, and PSOL for attention while having to obey Labor leadership in making governing decisions as now he clearly has room to govern how he believes is right.

So, you lied to West Midlander?

Also, WM got further than any of Suburban, Wulfric or PSOL; and WM certainly had plenty of margin to govern as he pleased. Labor has had plenty of pro-life and/or pro-gun politicians, and it still does.

I myself have voted against my Labour colleages on several Senate votes. And yet I have absolutely 0 intent of leaving the Labor party. Labor is an big tent party, despite the arguments to the contrary.

[Former President tack50]

I was about to say something along the lines of "inb4 Yankee's history lesson" but I see I am already late for that

In any case I will say I fully oppose a centralized state; regardless of politics. While you can argue on the purpose of the regions based on gameplay outcomes and what not, or what exact powers they should have, I fully support the existance of the regions on principle and should be kept around as long as we have enough people to run them, which we certainly do now.

[Former President tack50]

I was about to say something along the lines of "inb4 Yankee's history lesson" but I see I am already late for that

In any case I will say I fully oppose a centralized state; regardless of politics. While you can argue on the purpose of the regions based on gameplay outcomes and what not, or what exact powers they should have, I fully support the existance of the regions on principle and should be kept around as long as we have enough people to run them, which we certainly do now.

Then you are being a bystander to what is a very unfortunate reality in this game in my view.

What unfortunate reality? If Feds win in one region they have the right to implement their policies. The solution to that is not centralism, it is to win elections.

[Former President tack50]

Oh no, are you seriously, unironically arguing for rationing? I suppose that is a good idea if you want to truly throw the economy down the drain for no reason

Also, as much as I am a proud member of the Labor party, I am certainly against rationing, which has been proven to be a failed policy I believe?

[Former President tack50]

I obviously cannot speak on behalf of the Feds, but why would they even take you?

[Former President tack50]

That leads us to MB. Governor MB, obviously, will be the next Labor President. He’s the most senior member outside of HSTruman and the only one with presidential ambitions. Given the fact that MB is a smooth political operative...

MB/Muad'dib Ticket Confirmed!

Had MB kept the meme confederates, I am sure that would have been an eventual ticket

[Former President tack50]

Unrelated but I will say that despite disagreeing a lot with PSOL's analysis (and honestly his analysis hurting his standing in a way) I still love reading it.

[Former President tack50]

While I personally thought it wasn't a good idea to run for Fremont FM, i still endorse you. If we hold Truman to low 50's, the election will be a success.

Pericles, February 2018 "If I hold fhtagn to low 50s, the election will be a success and PUP will survive." Didn't work out that way, because the only actual win is a win-not a moral victory.

In fairmess what killed PUP was not Feb 18, but rather  Jun 18 and later Aug 18 being the end

[Former President tack50]

Reading that huge post, this is really all I can think of

[Former President tack50]

Just precisely what do you think would have happened if you had done this scheming? Permanent opposition?

Would like an answer to this.

It would cause the government to

A) be absolvent for us to grow in the chaos like the PVDA
B) get the DA+L to create a terrible coalition of chaos
C) get the VP to break the tie and put in an “illegitimate” government

Um, not sure if you realize this or not, but WE ARE NOT A PARLIAMENTARY SYSTEM!!!

None of that would work out as you envisioned. The Speaker is a paper pusher, who merely advances the bills expeditiously and their competence is the only relevant factor. Who actually controls it is irrelevant to the functioning of the system as long as they do their job.

Despite Atlasia being made up of like 90% RL Americans I always find it hilarious that so many think of Atlasia as a parliamentary system with a "proper" government and opposition when it clearly isn't.

Like you say the Speaker is in most ways a paper pusher, especially in the federal Congress (the reigonal speakers are slightly more powerful as they often are the ones who get to be "acting governor" if the previous one resigns). The Speaker and PPT are much less powerful than say, McConnell irl (who I think essencially can block any bills from being debated?); let alone any Prime Minister in a parliamentary system

It was and is trivially easy to get a party that is completely independently ran from all others. You do not need to do backroom deals with anyone if that is not what you want.