MN-05: Not a topic about Israel, thank you very much

[America Needs R'hllor]

2. You can shout as much as you want, but the cold, hard facts are that Israel is nothing like SA. There was an Arab Supreme Court Justice, the Arabic party is the third-biggest in the parliament, there's a Druze minister.

America is not racist because Clarence Thomas

America is, indeed, not an appartheid state. Is there racism in America? Sure. Is there racism in Israel? Sure. Do we have a lot of work to do to improve the situation of minorities in both? Of course. This doesn't make this old claim any less a lie, usually meant to delegitimize the Jewish State.

You sound so much like an ultra-nationalist right now. The UN found it was similar to an apartheid state, and thats the facts. Thats not opinion, thats fact.

 
You clearly don't know anything about the situation here. Give me a break- my hometown is a *mixed* Jewish-Arabic city and I currently live in Jerusalem, I know what's going on here. The UN is the organization that has Saudi Arabia on its Human Rights Council and which decided that "zionism is racism" (which is blatant antisemitism- saying Jewish self-determination is illegitimate). Its foundings aren't facts.
Arabic Israelis have FULL legal equal rights and representation in government. Meanwhile, by the way, all the surrounding Arabic countries drove off their Jews.

Anyway, I shall stay true to my words and stop debating this with you. I'd say "you should know better if you go to law school", but considering my ex is a law student, my anti-bias would be too strong to say this

[America Needs R'hllor]

Anyway, if you dont want to continue, thats fine.

I mean, you just completely ignored or twisted every argument I made (1 is besides the point, 2 completely ignores the fact that what I was talking about was a *UN decision* that called Zionism racism, 3 is false and all the arguments about the cold, hard facts on the ground were ignored), so it's kinda pointless, isn't it?

[America Needs R'hllor]

Well I might as well say my piece here at the risk of throwing more lighter fluid on this quite acrimonious and nasty exchange that has been going on in places above.

Given my assumptions, and  that millions of Jews actually live in Israel, surrounded by people who don't want them there at all, I find the path to be at once anti Zionist while not being anti Jewish, to be a very thin one indeed. My assumptions are that if the Jewish state is ended, Jews will soon become a minority there, with their lives becoming intolerable, and most will have to flee/leave attended by violence and death. Given such horrific prospects for the Jews living there, to wish the end of Jewish state is to wish very bad things to happen to millions of Jews. I suppose one can argue that is not anti-Semitism, because one thinks the Jews elsewhere are just fine, but that point of view does not do much for me, and I doubt it is very appealing to most Jews.

Granted, the path would be wider if one rejects my assumptions, and rather assumes that the end of the Jewish state would, perhaps after a rough patch, result in a pluralistic  secular  democracy like the US, in which basic individual  rights are protected by laws and independent courts attended by a culture that puts a very high premium on protecting such rights, where few really want horrible things to happen to a substantial number of its citizens, and differences are resolved peacefully. I don't see any evidence to support such an assumption, but others may just characterize me as blind, and that I need to see an ophthalmologist.  

Yeah this is an overlooked point. Omar may be fine with subdued Jews in her community, but by essentially calling the Arabs to "wake up" and end the Jewish state, she calls for thousands of Jews to be murdered. There's no escaping that.

For example, the Iranian Ayatollahs like their pet Jews. Does anyone doubt that the people who called for Israel to be "wiped off the map", which means a genocide of 7 million Jews, is an antisemite?

As for the calls to end this with "a happy note" and rejoice that MN-05 will be blue- no. I refuse. If the Democratic Party keeps electing people like Omar, it will be come the enemy of the Jewish people, just like the Republicans would become the enemy if they keep electing people like Corey Stewart. No escaping that. Healthcare, immigration and abortion are all important issues, but if the Democrats proclaim themselves against my very existence, I'll never support them. At this point, I'd probably not even support Dayton for a hypothetical reelection, considering his endorsement of Omar.

Ignoring the tweets and all that (not that they're not an issue), I haven't heard an argument as to why Omar, a one term State Rep with no real accomplishments is preferable to Torres Ray, or even Margaret Anderson Kelliher, who are much more accomplished and also running on abolishing ICE and Medicare for all. Torres Ray was even the LG candidate for the most progressive Gubernatorial candidate in 2010 (and a single payer advocate before Sanders.) She's even an immigrant too if you care about that box checking.

Maybe the Democrats want to signal their tolerance and liberalism, which is all fine as good, but they're doing it at the expense of Jews. Not that I'm surprised- we were always everyone's favourite punching bag. What's not to like for the far-right about a boogeyman that has strange traditions and looks like you but doesn't act like you, and yet seems annoyingly successful? What's not to like for far-leftists about a boogeyman with many wealthy and influential figures, that looks like you and thus can be punched without accusations of racism?

[America Needs R'hllor]

Ms. Omar will, tbh, fit quite well in the same chamber with Rep. Steve King. Still, Paul Nehlen (a much more vicious antisemite, no doubt) winning 11% of the Republican votes in his district and Ilhan Omar becoming a congresswoman show why a Jewish state is crucial.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Ms. Omar will, tbh, fit quite well in the same chamber with Rep. Steve King. Still, Paul Nehlen (a much more vicious antisemite, no doubt) winning 11% of the Republican votes in his district and Ilhan Omar becoming a congresswoman show why a Jewish state is crucial.

Try and chill dude lol, it'll be ok, she's not going to nuke Israel or anything lol.

I have a country to protect me from the current worrying trends in the West, so I am chill

[America Needs R'hllor]

Ms. Omar will, tbh, fit quite well in the same chamber with Rep. Steve King. Still, Paul Nehlen (a much more vicious antisemite, no doubt) winning 11% of the Republican votes in his district and Ilhan Omar becoming a congresswoman show why a Jewish state is crucial.

Try and chill dude lol, it'll be ok, she's not going to nuke Israel or anything lol.

I have a country to protect me from the current worrying trends in the West, so I am chill

Netanyahu is doing far more damage to Israel than the couple percent of the US congress who don't vote to give Israel military aid.

If you quantify the damage, I completely agree. Omar is a worrying trend, is all (and not because of her votes on military aid).

[America Needs R'hllor]

Haaretz just published a glowing article about her lmao

https://www.haaretz.com/amp/us-news/first-somali-american-legislator-wins-minnesota-primary-for-congress-1.6383381

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HAHA LOLWUT

Yeah, Israeli media is sorely uninformed on American politics, so I'm willing to bet they didn't hear about this tweet (or the fact that she never apologized for it, rather attacking those who called her out).

[America Needs R'hllor]

Ms. Omar will, tbh, fit quite well in the same chamber with Rep. Steve King. Still, Paul Nehlen (a much more vicious antisemite, no doubt) winning 11% of the Republican votes in his district and Ilhan Omar becoming a congresswoman show why a Jewish state is crucial.

Try and chill dude lol, it'll be ok, she's not going to nuke Israel or anything lol.

Um, that's like saying it's OK to have David Duke in the House because he isn't going to personally lynch any blacks.

Two tweets critical of Israel is definitely the same as being the Grand Wizard of the Klan

If I compared her to Steve King, would it be more appropriate?

Right now, I consider her better than King, who made much more repeated and numerous racist statements. However, she never apologized and only reinforced her antisemitic tweet, and the fact that progressives refuse to call her out for this is sad.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Once again those tweets were NOT AN ISSUE. the only outlets reporting on them were Breitbart-esque right wing blogs that obviously your typical MN-05 voter doesn't pay attention to.

If Minneapolis was full of voters with a burning raging desire to throw all Jews into the sea then I'd wager they probably wouldn't have elected a Jewish mayor last year.

Yeah, like I said, that's probably why Haaretz didn't even mention it. It's just not widely-known, which to me is sad because it shows the media is too absorbed in identity politics (of both sides) to raise serious issues and make politicians face them.

[America Needs R'hllor]

Israelis are told from birth that the entire world is out to get them and always will be. Hence the extreme paranoia we see from them. Israel should not legalize cannabis.

My parents are Russian immigrants, I was taught from birth to like borstch and Verka Serduchka.
And nice gall to accuse a member of a group that was, throughout the entire history, repeatedly persecuted, tortured and genocided of paranoia.

I'll make this simple- her tweet made heavy use of lies peddled against Jews throughout history. This sort of blood libel was the fuel of countless pogroms. Sorry for caring.

[America Needs R'hllor]

I believe that commenting on this thread is proving to be, and will be, completely unproductive, and will join most forum Jews in ignoring it henceforth. Arguing with people who'd defend anyone in their ideological sphere, or just outright racists, is never productive (as we can see in arguments with frevent Trumpists) I'll just say this- the Jewish people will never again be tormented and persecuted without any escape. All those who call us thin-skinned or prescribe us cannabis after previously posting racist statements about Jews, and just a little bit after a comment mocking our countless tragedies, because we dare being worried about our fates a few decades after a genocide- we don't care. You keep calling us what you want, we should just keep fighting to protect ourselves and combat the worldwide trends in both the left and right.
Cheers