Intercessory Prayer (user search)
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Author Topic: Intercessory Prayer  (Read 4387 times)
Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.
jmfcst
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« on: July 13, 2008, 05:41:03 PM »

Well, I'll let the non-Catholics start the discussion, and, as is my custom, I will job in and counter their thoughts.  So... discuss.

there are too many examples of person x praying to God for person y in the bible for me to reference in one post. 

James 5:16 "Pray one for another"

what's there to counter?
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Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.
jmfcst
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Posts: 18,212
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« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2008, 06:50:56 PM »

Many Protestants believe that there is no 'mediator' between man and God (and I think there is something in Timothy about that)

i have never met a protestant who believes there is no mediator between man and God.

1Tim 2:5 "For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus"
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Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.
jmfcst
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Posts: 18,212
United States


« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2008, 11:18:28 AM »
« Edited: July 14, 2008, 01:55:47 PM by jmfcst »

Many Protestants believe that there is no 'mediator' between man and God (and I think there is something in Timothy about that)

i have never met a protestant who believes there is no mediator between man and God.

1Tim 2:5 "For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus"

Fair point. But I was referring to the trinitarian notion of God.

not sure I understand what you are trying to say.  But...viewing Jesus as God in the flesh may lead some to think there is no mediator between God and man, but the fact remains that Jesus is still a mediator.

Example:  Normally, a mediator represents both sides, but is NOT a party to either side.  The mediator is independent.

But, since Jesus is literally God in the flesh, his position of mediator is different than a normal mediator, for He is party to both God (since he is God) and man (having been begotten in the flesh).  So, instead of being a separate entity mediating between two separate entities, he is a fusion of both sides (God and man).

Therefore, we do not have a go-between (mediator) in the sense that Moses was to the Israelites- the Israelites didn't have a personal relationship with God, but only had a relationship to God through their relationship with Moses.  Rather we have a personal relationship to God because we have a relationship with Jesus, who, even though he is in the role of mediator, is not a separate entity from the two entities he is representing, but rather is party to both entities since his is actually God in the flesh.

That was the reason Paul stuck in the contradiction "but God is one" when he spoke of Jesus as mediator:

Gal 3:20 "A mediator, however, does not represent just one party; but God is one."

Paul's use of a contradictory conjunction when speaking of Jesus as a mediator means that he is an abnormal mediator.

In short:  though we have a mediator "separating" us from God, we are not really separated from God at all because:
1) we still have a personal relationship to God by having a personal relationship to Jesus, since Jesus is God.
2) and...God still has a personal relationship to man by through Jesus, since Jesus is man.

Therefore, since Jesus is the only mediator that is both God and man, there is no way to have a direct relationship to God except through Jesus Christ!

As it is written:  "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."  (John 14:5)
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