Desantis: Queer Theory is not apart of black history

[justfollowingtheelections]

Sorry but this is Rick Santorum territory, not something a serious candidate should be spending time on. 

I would argue that most Democratic voters are skeptical of the "woke" agenda, whatever that means, and yet we still vote for the Democrats.  DeSantis isn't going to win any swing voters if this is what he focuses on.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Sorry but this is Rick Santorum territory, not something a serious candidate should be spending time on. 

I would argue that most Democratic voters are skeptical of the "woke" agenda, whatever that means, and yet we still vote for the Democrats.  DeSantis isn't going to win any swing voters if this is what he focuses on.

Ok then how should he answer when media asks him about it . Should he just refuse to answer the question .

[Hindsight was 2020]

Sorry but this is Rick Santorum territory, not something a serious candidate should be spending time on. 

I would argue that most Democratic voters are skeptical of the "woke" agenda, whatever that means, and yet we still vote for the Democrats.  DeSantis isn't going to win any swing voters if this is what he focuses on.

Ok then how should he answer when media asks him about it . Should he just refuse to answer the question .

OSR straight up do you think gay history has any role in black history

[OSR stands with Israel]

Sorry but this is Rick Santorum territory, not something a serious candidate should be spending time on. 

I would argue that most Democratic voters are skeptical of the "woke" agenda, whatever that means, and yet we still vote for the Democrats.  DeSantis isn't going to win any swing voters if this is what he focuses on.

Ok then how should he answer when media asks him about it . Should he just refuse to answer the question .

OSR straight up do you think gay history has any role in black history

Queer theory isn’t about LGBT individuals but about this :

Fundamentally, queer theory does not construct or defend any particular identity, but instead, grounded in post-structuralism and deconstruction, it works to actively critique heteronormativity, exposing and breaking down traditional assumptions that sexual and gender identities are presumed to be heterosexual or cisgender.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer_theory#Lens_for_power

[Hindsight was 2020]

Sorry but this is Rick Santorum territory, not something a serious candidate should be spending time on. 

I would argue that most Democratic voters are skeptical of the "woke" agenda, whatever that means, and yet we still vote for the Democrats.  DeSantis isn't going to win any swing voters if this is what he focuses on.

Ok then how should he answer when media asks him about it . Should he just refuse to answer the question .

OSR straight up do you think gay history has any role in black history

Queer theory isn’t about LGBT individuals but about this :

Fundamentally, queer theory does not construct or defend any particular identity, but instead, grounded in post-structuralism and deconstruction, it works to actively critique heteronormativity, exposing and breaking down traditional assumptions that sexual and gender identities are presumed to be heterosexual or cisgender.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer_theory#Lens_for_power

So queer theory is an argument gay people have always existed and being straight isn’t a default normal? My god so scandalous 😱

[OSR stands with Israel]

Sorry but this is Rick Santorum territory, not something a serious candidate should be spending time on. 

I would argue that most Democratic voters are skeptical of the "woke" agenda, whatever that means, and yet we still vote for the Democrats.  DeSantis isn't going to win any swing voters if this is what he focuses on.

Ok then how should he answer when media asks him about it . Should he just refuse to answer the question .

OSR straight up do you think gay history has any role in black history

Queer theory isn’t about LGBT individuals but about this :

Fundamentally, queer theory does not construct or defend any particular identity, but instead, grounded in post-structuralism and deconstruction, it works to actively critique heteronormativity, exposing and breaking down traditional assumptions that sexual and gender identities are presumed to be heterosexual or cisgender.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer_theory#Lens_for_power

So queer theory is an argument gay people have always existed and being straight isn’t a default normal? My god so scandalous 😱

It wants to deconstruct gender identity too so yah this definitely shouldnt be ther

[Alben Barkley]

Sorry but this is Rick Santorum territory, not something a serious candidate should be spending time on. 

I would argue that most Democratic voters are skeptical of the "woke" agenda, whatever that means, and yet we still vote for the Democrats.  DeSantis isn't going to win any swing voters if this is what he focuses on.

Ok then how should he answer when media asks him about it . Should he just refuse to answer the question .

OSR straight up do you think gay history has any role in black history

Queer theory isn’t about LGBT individuals but about this :

Fundamentally, queer theory does not construct or defend any particular identity, but instead, grounded in post-structuralism and deconstruction, it works to actively critique heteronormativity, exposing and breaking down traditional assumptions that sexual and gender identities are presumed to be heterosexual or cisgender.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer_theory#Lens_for_power

OK but do you have any evidence this type of "queer theory" is actually being taught at the high school level, in the African-American Studies curriculum or otherwise, beyond DeSantis's vague and unsubstantiated claims? Because it sounds to me more like there was maybe one lesson that tied queer history in with black history. Now maybe you can debate if this is necessary, but nonetheless it does not sound like the class was some kind of Trojan horse for more extreme "queer theory" classes the way DeSantis is making it out to be.

When are you going to accept that the false hero you are so desperately clinging to in order to lie to yourself and pretend like there is even a thread of sanity left in your party is as much of a bigoted hack as the worst of them? I think it will happen eventually, because I don't think you're a bad guy at the end of the day. But watching your defenses of this clown, from the Martha's Vineyard disaster to now, just get more and more desperate is simply pathetic.

[Alben Barkley]

Sorry but this is Rick Santorum territory, not something a serious candidate should be spending time on. 

I would argue that most Democratic voters are skeptical of the "woke" agenda, whatever that means, and yet we still vote for the Democrats.  DeSantis isn't going to win any swing voters if this is what he focuses on.

Ok then how should he answer when media asks him about it . Should he just refuse to answer the question .

OSR straight up do you think gay history has any role in black history

Queer theory isn’t about LGBT individuals but about this :

Fundamentally, queer theory does not construct or defend any particular identity, but instead, grounded in post-structuralism and deconstruction, it works to actively critique heteronormativity, exposing and breaking down traditional assumptions that sexual and gender identities are presumed to be heterosexual or cisgender.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer_theory#Lens_for_power

So queer theory is an argument gay people have always existed and being straight isn’t a default normal? My god so scandalous 😱

Being straight IS the default normal; the vast majority of people are heterosexual so by definition hetero IS the norm. So I do kind of roll my eyes at talk of "heteronormativity" and such. However, what needs to be distinguished and understood is that just because something is more common or "normal" does not automatically mean it is "better." A minority sexuality is not inferior simply because it is less common and by definition not the "norm." There is nothing wrong with acknowledging that homosexuality is both not "normal" and completely fine. I mean literally the word "queer" itself means "not normal," so arguing against "heteronormativity" while at the same time embracing the word "queer" seems like a paradox to me.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Sorry but this is Rick Santorum territory, not something a serious candidate should be spending time on. 

I would argue that most Democratic voters are skeptical of the "woke" agenda, whatever that means, and yet we still vote for the Democrats.  DeSantis isn't going to win any swing voters if this is what he focuses on.

Ok then how should he answer when media asks him about it . Should he just refuse to answer the question .

OSR straight up do you think gay history has any role in black history

Queer theory isn’t about LGBT individuals but about this :

Fundamentally, queer theory does not construct or defend any particular identity, but instead, grounded in post-structuralism and deconstruction, it works to actively critique heteronormativity, exposing and breaking down traditional assumptions that sexual and gender identities are presumed to be heterosexual or cisgender.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer_theory#Lens_for_power

OK but do you have any evidence this type of "queer theory" is actually being taught at the high school level, in the African-American Studies curriculum or otherwise, beyond DeSantis's vague and unsubstantiated claims? Because it sounds to me more like there was maybe one lesson that tied queer history in with black history. Now maybe you can debate if this is necessary, but nonetheless it does not sound like the class was some kind of Trojan horse for more extreme "queer theory" classes the way DeSantis is making it out to be.

When are you going to accept that the false hero you are so desperately clinging to in order to lie to yourself and pretend like there is even a thread of sanity left in your party is as much of a bigoted hack as the worst of them? I think it will happen eventually, because I don't think you're a bad guy at the end of the day. But watching your defenses of this clown, from the Martha's Vineyard disaster to now, just get more and more desperate is simply pathetic.

Mitt Romney defended his Matha's vineyard thing too. Anyway this post had the full curriculum :

https://talkelections.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=536513.msg8950331#msg8950331

here's another source

https://www.advocate.com/news/ron-desantis-queer-theory-ap

The curriculum, obtained by The Advocate, includes an eight weeks unit on movements and debates important to the Black experience in America.

The 19th lesson, or section 4.19, describes the segment on Black Queer Studies.

“This topic explores the concept of the queer of color critique, grounded in Black feminism and intersectionality, as a Black studies lens that shifts sexuality studies toward racial analysis,” the description reads.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

Sorry but this is Rick Santorum territory, not something a serious candidate should be spending time on.  

I would argue that most Democratic voters are skeptical of the "woke" agenda, whatever that means, and yet we still vote for the Democrats.  DeSantis isn't going to win any swing voters if this is what he focuses on.

Ok then how should he answer when media asks him about it . Should he just refuse to answer the question .

OSR straight up do you think gay history has any role in black history

Queer theory isn’t about LGBT individuals but about this :

Fundamentally, queer theory does not construct or defend any particular identity, but instead, grounded in post-structuralism and deconstruction, it works to actively critique heteronormativity, exposing and breaking down traditional assumptions that sexual and gender identities are presumed to be heterosexual or cisgender.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer_theory#Lens_for_power

So queer theory is an argument gay people have always existed and being straight isn’t a default normal? My god so scandalous 😱

Being straight IS the default normal; the vast majority of people are heterosexual so by definition hetero IS the norm. So I do kind of roll my eyes at talk of "heteronormativity" and such. However, what needs to be distinguished and understood is that just because something is more common or "normal" does not automatically mean it is "better." A minority sexuality is not inferior simply because it is less common and by definition not the "norm." There is nothing wrong with acknowledging that homosexuality is both not "normal" and completely fine. I mean literally the word "queer" itself means "not normal," so arguing against "heteronormativity" while at the same time embracing the word "queer" seems like a paradox to me.

A lot of people have trouble comprehending the full consequences of the fact that what might be reality for a sub-10% of the population can be completely at odds with the experiences of a vast majority of society.
"Normal must mean good" what is this conformist garbage idea that activists of all people are encouraging?

[KaiserDave]

DeSantis is an uncharismatic vindictive weirdo who spends his time wailing about high school curriculums. He is an odd combination of Jeb Bush and Rick Santorum and will not be the nominee (would lose if he was).

[Saint Milei]

It actually is, insofar as many POC are also Queer and their history and accomplishments are part of the historical canon and should be celebrated just like anyone else. So what Desantis is actually saying here is that we should erase Queer people from history which was an opinion I had hoped we were leaving behind to the Lavender scare and worst of the moral panics of the 50's and before... but apparently not.

Having black queers does not mean queer theory is a part of black history lmao.

Again James Baldwin existed whether you like it or not

Wow, a black dude that discussed queer theory. Totally means queer theory is a part of black history.


Is conservative theory a part of black history since there were black people who "identified" as conservative? How far should we go with this? Should we learn about Bumpy Johnson and Frank Lucas?

Reducing a man who wrote what’s considered two of the best works of literature in this country’s history as “a black dude that discussed queer theory” and on some moral level as two drug kingpins is something

I didn't bring up morality. You did. You didn't answer the question.

Oh please like anyone here doesn’t now that form of questioning isn’t meant to imply they are some level to each other and to answer your unserious question no teaching about famous black gay people and their contribution to black history doesn’t mean you have to teach them about black gangsters 🙄

100% you can't answer the question. Shocker.

[Saint Milei]

For the record, I'm sure more black kids enjoy learning about black gangsters than they do some weirdo dude nobody knows about.


No, this isn't racist. Please shut up

[Hindsight was 2020]

It actually is, insofar as many POC are also Queer and their history and accomplishments are part of the historical canon and should be celebrated just like anyone else. So what Desantis is actually saying here is that we should erase Queer people from history which was an opinion I had hoped we were leaving behind to the Lavender scare and worst of the moral panics of the 50's and before... but apparently not.

Having black queers does not mean queer theory is a part of black history lmao.

Again James Baldwin existed whether you like it or not

Wow, a black dude that discussed queer theory. Totally means queer theory is a part of black history.


Is conservative theory a part of black history since there were black people who "identified" as conservative? How far should we go with this? Should we learn about Bumpy Johnson and Frank Lucas?

Reducing a man who wrote what’s considered two of the best works of literature in this country’s history as “a black dude that discussed queer theory” and on some moral level as two drug kingpins is something

I didn't bring up morality. You did. You didn't answer the question.

Oh please like anyone here doesn’t now that form of questioning isn’t meant to imply they are some level to each other and to answer your unserious question no teaching about famous black gay people and their contribution to black history doesn’t mean you have to teach them about black gangsters 🙄

100% you can't answer the question. Shocker.

I did so…. 🤷‍♂️

For the record, I'm sure more black kids enjoy learning about black gangsters than they do some weirdo dude nobody knows about.


No, this isn't racist. Please shut up

1) Yeah that is kinda racist and 2) Baldwin is very well known just because you don’t doesn’t mean most people don’t know who he is

[Roronoa D. Law]

For the record, I'm sure more black kids enjoy learning about black gangsters than they do some weirdo dude nobody knows about.


No, this isn't racist. Please shut up

It is racist, cause you wouldn't bring "black kids to care more about black gangsters" into the conversation in any other way shape, or form but to dehumanize and stereotype black individuals. Most kids don't care about anything before they are born so what exactly proposing? I'm sure there nothing Republicans would like more than is a growing miseducated American electorate, Cause you know when Republicans do well? When nobody knows what they voting for. 

[Ferguson97]

Btw DeSantis approach of handling culture wars has been pretty smart . He unlike Trump does not go out and yell about it , but rather waits for the other side to throw the first punch and then he responds.

He also knows the details of policy so he can actually answer questions

How's this going to work out for him on a debate stage when he actually has to answer direct questions from the moderators? He can't hide behind his surrogates forever.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Btw DeSantis approach of handling culture wars has been pretty smart . He unlike Trump does not go out and yell about it , but rather waits for the other side to throw the first punch and then he responds.

He also knows the details of policy so he can actually answer questions

How's this going to work out for him on a debate stage when he actually has to answer direct questions from the moderators? He can't hide behind his surrogates forever.

I mean he clearly someone who does his homework so he probably will be prepared for certain questions and have his answers prepared for potential too . Against Trump or Biden this can work as Trump has lost his touch , Biden is very gaffe prone and neither Biden or Trump are good at  debating details .

Now of course this can also go badly as DeSantis can also come off as any Calculated Ivy League style  politician who tries to use individual details and technicalities to debate while not really being able to articulate the bigger picture which Trump and Biden clearly do better .

So it probably will come down to can DeSantis dish out one liners like Trump or Biden

[OSR stands with Israel]

DeSantis is an uncharismatic vindictive weirdo who spends his time wailing about high school curriculums. He is an odd combination of Jeb Bush and Rick Santorum and will not be the nominee (would lose if he was).

You could argue that he basically is the American Pierre Poilievre in many ways(though more calculating)

[Ferguson97]

Btw DeSantis approach of handling culture wars has been pretty smart . He unlike Trump does not go out and yell about it , but rather waits for the other side to throw the first punch and then he responds.

He also knows the details of policy so he can actually answer questions

How's this going to work out for him on a debate stage when he actually has to answer direct questions from the moderators? He can't hide behind his surrogates forever.

I mean he clearly someone who does his homework so he probably will be prepared for certain questions and have his answers prepared for potential too . Against Trump or Biden this can work as Trump has lost his touch , Biden is very gaffe prone and neither Biden or Trump are good at  debating details .

Now of course this can also go badly as DeSantis can also come off as any Calculated Ivy League style  politician who tries to use individual details and technicalities to debate while not really being able to articulate the bigger picture which Trump and Biden clearly do better .

So it probably will come down to can DeSantis dish out one liners like Trump or Biden

The entire appeal of DeSantis is that he's obsessed with culture war issues and owning the libs. Not sure how he's going to simultaneously play the part of "serious, agenda-driven governor who gets results" and "TPUSA spokesman". He has to pick one or the other.

He only has support because some Republicans think Trump would lose a general election. 95% of DeSantis > Trump supporters would still vote for Trump in the general, or would switch back to Trump if there was no longer a perception that DeSantis would be a stronger candidate.

The problem is he's going to turn off independents if he continues talking like a lunatic. That stuff might work in Florida, but it's not going to work elsewhere.

[It’s so Joever]

Btw DeSantis approach of handling culture wars has been pretty smart . He unlike Trump does not go out and yell about it , but rather waits for the other side to throw the first punch and then he responds.

He also knows the details of policy so he can actually answer questions

How's this going to work out for him on a debate stage when he actually has to answer direct questions from the moderators? He can't hide behind his surrogates forever.

I mean he clearly someone who does his homework so he probably will be prepared for certain questions and have his answers prepared for potential too . Against Trump or Biden this can work as Trump has lost his touch , Biden is very gaffe prone and neither Biden or Trump are good at  debating details .

Now of course this can also go badly as DeSantis can also come off as any Calculated Ivy League style  politician who tries to use individual details and technicalities to debate while not really being able to articulate the bigger picture which Trump and Biden clearly do better .

So it probably will come down to can DeSantis dish out one liners like Trump or Biden

The entire appeal of DeSantis is that he's obsessed with culture war issues and owning the libs. Not sure how he's going to simultaneously play the part of "serious, agenda-driven governor who gets results" and "TPUSA spokesman". He has to pick one or the other.

He only has support because some Republicans think Trump would lose a general election. 95% of DeSantis > Trump supporters would still vote for Trump in the general, or would switch back to Trump if there was no longer a perception that DeSantis would be a stronger candidate.

The problem is he's going to turn off independents if he continues talking like a lunatic. That stuff might work in Florida, but it's not going to work elsewhere.

Voters are not rational actors. Not so they fit neatly into some ideological camp you camp just checklist if you support/emphasize policy xyz.
If Ron can distance himself from Trump but adopt many of the same rhetorical strategies albeit a bit fine tuned…he could be a formidable force as scary as it may be to acknowledge.

But then again given 2022 I still am probably not in a position to give lectures on voting predictions.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Btw DeSantis approach of handling culture wars has been pretty smart . He unlike Trump does not go out and yell about it , but rather waits for the other side to throw the first punch and then he responds.

He also knows the details of policy so he can actually answer questions

How's this going to work out for him on a debate stage when he actually has to answer direct questions from the moderators? He can't hide behind his surrogates forever.

I mean he clearly someone who does his homework so he probably will be prepared for certain questions and have his answers prepared for potential too . Against Trump or Biden this can work as Trump has lost his touch , Biden is very gaffe prone and neither Biden or Trump are good at  debating details .

Now of course this can also go badly as DeSantis can also come off as any Calculated Ivy League style  politician who tries to use individual details and technicalities to debate while not really being able to articulate the bigger picture which Trump and Biden clearly do better .

So it probably will come down to can DeSantis dish out one liners like Trump or Biden

The entire appeal of DeSantis is that he's obsessed with culture war issues and owning the libs. Not sure how he's going to simultaneously play the part of "serious, agenda-driven governor who gets results" and "TPUSA spokesman". He has to pick one or the other.

He only has support because some Republicans think Trump would lose a general election. 95% of DeSantis > Trump supporters would still vote for Trump in the general, or would switch back to Trump if there was no longer a perception that DeSantis would be a stronger candidate.

The problem is he's going to turn off independents if he continues talking like a lunatic. That stuff might work in Florida, but it's not going to work elsewhere.

Brian Kemp has governed to the right of DeSantis on both economic and social issues yet he did very well with CEW voters who voted for Warnock.

[No War, but the War on Christmas]

It actually is, insofar as many POC are also Queer and their history and accomplishments are part of the historical canon and should be celebrated just like anyone else. So what Desantis is actually saying here is that we should erase Queer people from history which was an opinion I had hoped we were leaving behind to the Lavender scare and worst of the moral panics of the 50's and before... but apparently not.

Having black queers does not mean queer theory is a part of black history lmao.

First of all, what even is 'Queer Theory' in your mind? I'm gay and I've honestly never heard of it. I looked up some definitions on google and got no substantive evidence that it was a major field of academic study anywhere besides some discourse against gender essentialism which may be part of some optional sociopolitical college courses maybe? But those courses aren't usually taught before then afaik. So I'm 99% this is just more made-up conspiracy nonsense as part of the new lavender scare.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

If "black gay people exist" is proof that queer theory is part of black history, then that means that "queer theory" fundamentally means nothing beyond "gay people exist", which is essentially this and thus pointless. So as I said, DeSantis isn't exactly wrong, but he's picking a really stupid and irrelevant fight that no one outside of extremely insufferable people on Twitter and in some academic areas cares or even really talks about, and stanning him like OSR or thinking any actual voters care about this sort of thing is beyond laughable.

[John Dule]

If queer theory was about correctly identifying and taxonomizing wild queers, it would actually be useful.

[Neo-Malthusian Misanthrope]

If queer theory was about correctly identifying and taxonomizing wild queers, it would actually be useful.

Gives new meaning to "Drunk King Philip Came Over For Gay Sex"