When should abortion/pregnancy termination become illegal?

[GMantis]

When the fetus becomes viable in abortion on demand cases. The problem is determining when that is.

[Torie]

After the first trimester, or when brain waves start, is the point at which there should begin to be restrictions.

[Person Man]

That being said, if you are raped, the law proscribing abortion's objective to preserve chastity and responsibility is greatly lessened if you had no power over whether or not you conceived.

I reject the idea that abortion should be proscribed in order to preserve chastity and responsibility.  Do we criminalize fornication anymore?  Do we still send debtors to jail for failing to repay their debts?  The only reason I see as being valid for proscribing abortion is that in doing so one is protecting a human life.  When human life begins is a subjective question that is best left to legislatures to determine the answer a society will use. (Which may lead to objective standards for determining if a human life has begun according to that subjective answer.)

So, why are there so few, or any "pro-life" regimes that punish the killing of an unborn person in a different way than killing a born person?

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Women's right to choose > baby's right to life

Seeing this explicitly laid out this way is more than a little disturbing even to (normal) people who support legal abortion, you know.

Maybe but I find it a good summary of my position that explains why I disagree with people who support legal abortion only in the first trimester.

You're still explicitly stating that you believe that a certain class of people has the right to absolute power of life and death over another class of people, so that makes me not like you very much, even though I can respect the same position arrived at on different grounds.

Many "pro-choicers" don't consider embryos and fetuses to be people, Nathan. And basically greenforest's statement is typical "pro-choice" logic--"pro-choicers" believe that the rights of women are superior to the rights of their prenatal offspring, at least until some stage of pregnancy.

I know that; it was his initial glib use of the world 'baby' there that disturbed me, since that could also imply a justification of infanticide (although we clarified that he didn't intend to imply that).

[Ogre Mage]

Viability, which is generally considered sometime between the 20th and 24th week of pregnancy.  After that, only allowed if a medical professional says the mother's life or health are at serious risk.

[ZuWo]

Obviously at the very moment when life begins; and that's the moment of conception.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

That being said, if you are raped, the law proscribing abortion's objective to preserve chastity and responsibility is greatly lessened if you had no power over whether or not you conceived.

I reject the idea that abortion should be proscribed in order to preserve chastity and responsibility.  Do we criminalize fornication anymore?  Do we still send debtors to jail for failing to repay their debts?  The only reason I see as being valid for proscribing abortion is that in doing so one is protecting a human life.  When human life begins is a subjective question that is best left to legislatures to determine the answer a society will use. (Which may lead to objective standards for determining if a human life has begun according to that subjective answer.)

So, why are there so few, or any "pro-life" regimes that punish the killing of an unborn person in a different way than killing a born person?

Criminal penalties aren't just about the harm done. They are also about the intent and circumstances, and what society at large will allow.