Separately elected Vice President
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
May 27, 2024, 01:42:44 PM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion
  Election What-ifs? (Moderator: Dereich)
  Separately elected Vice President		 « previous next »
Pages: [1] 2
Author Topic: Separately elected Vice President  (Read 5886 times)
Hash
Hashemite
Moderators
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 32,410
Colombia


WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« on: January 30, 2010, 04:21:24 PM »
Between 1945 and 1964, Brazil's Vice President, who carried the same powers as the US VP, was elected in an election separate from that for President. Usually, the presidential candidate usually had a running-mate but it was unofficial since nothing held a voter to vote for the presidential candidate AND his chosen running-mate, some presidential candidates didn't have running mates and some VP candidates had no presidential candidate attached to the.

So, what if the US Vice President was elected in an election totally separate from President, but on the same day.

What would recent elections look like, assuming the OTL running mates do run in this new setup.
Logged
hcallega
Jr. Member
***
Posts: 1,523
United States


Political Matrix
E: -1.10, S: -3.90

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2010, 04:27:40 PM »
2008: Joe Biden
2004: John Edwards
2000: Joe Lieberman
1996: Jack Kemp
1992: Al Gore
1988: Llloyd Bentsen
1984: George Bush
1980: George Bush
1976: Walter Mondale
1972: Spiro Agnew
1968: Ed Muskie
1964: Hubert Humphrey
1960: Lyndon Johnson
1956: Richard Nixon
1952: Richard Nixon
1948: Earl Warren
1944: Harry Truman
1940: Charles McNary
1936: John Garner
1932: John Garner


The only problem is that many VEEPs were chosen specifically to help the whole ticket.
Logged
MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2010, 04:32:46 PM »
Quote from: hcallega on January 30, 2010, 04:27:40 PM
2008: Joe Biden
2004: John Edwards
2000: Joe Lieberman
1996: Jack Kemp
1992: Al Gore
1988: Llloyd Bentsen
1984: George Bush
1980: George Bush
1976: Walter Mondale
1972: Spiro Agnew
1968: Ed Muskie
1964: Hubert Humphrey
1960: Lyndon Johnson
1956: Richard Nixon
1952: Richard Nixon
1948: Earl Warren
1944: Harry Truman
1940: Charles McNary
1936: John Garner
1932: John Garner


The only problem is that many VEEPs were chosen specifically to help the whole ticket.

I think Wallace may be elected narrowly on FDR coattails.

Kemp defeating Gore? No way.
Logged
CPT MikeyMike
mikeymike
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 3,513
United States


Political Matrix
E: 6.58, S: -3.30

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2010, 04:33:23 PM »
Good question to ponder....

With the assumption that there is no change to the presidential election.

1960: Lodge - by a very small margin
1964: Humphrey - slightly smaller margin than LBJ
1968: Muskie - by a decent margin
1972: Agnew - probably slightly less than Nixon
1976: Mondale - probably same margin as Carter
1980: Bush - probably slightly less than Reagan
1984: Bush - probably slightly less than Reagan
1988: Bentsen - by a decent margin
1992: Gore - probably same margin as Clinton
1996: Gore - probably same margin as Clinton
2000: Cheney - by a slightly larger margin than Bush
2004: Cheney - probably same margin as Bush
2008: Biden - probably slightly less than Obama

Thus since 1960, three differently elected VPs - IMO
Logged
Bo
Rochambeau
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 13,986
Israel


Political Matrix
E: -5.23, S: -2.52

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2010, 04:41:50 PM »
1932:John Nance Garner (D)
1936:John Nance Garner (D)
1940:Charles McNary (R)
1944:Harry Truman (D)
1948:Alben Barkley (D)
1952:Richard Nixon (R)
1956:Richard Nixon (R)
1960:Lyndon Johnson (D)
1964:Hubert Humphrey (D)
1968:Edmund Muskie (D)
1972:Spiro Agnew (R)
1976:Walter Mondale (D)
1980:George H. W. Bush (R)
1984:George H. W. Bush (R)
1988:Lloyd Bensten (D)
1992:Al Gore (D)
1996:Al Gore (D)
2000:Joe Lieberman (D)
2004:John Edwards (D)
2008:Joe Biden (D)
Logged
Bo
Rochambeau
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 13,986
Israel


Political Matrix
E: -5.23, S: -2.52

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2010, 04:48:56 PM »
Quote from: hcallega on January 30, 2010, 04:27:40 PM
2008: Joe Biden
2004: John Edwards
2000: Joe Lieberman
1996: Jack Kemp
1992: Al Gore
1988: Llloyd Bentsen
1984: George Bush
1980: George Bush
1976: Walter Mondale
1972: Spiro Agnew
1968: Ed Muskie
1964: Hubert Humphrey
1960: Lyndon Johnson
1956: Richard Nixon
1952: Richard Nixon
1948: Earl Warren
1944: Harry Truman
1940: Charles McNary
1936: John Garner
1932: John Garner


The only problem is that many VEEPs were chosen specifically to help the whole ticket.

I don't think Warren would win in 1948. I know he was moderate, but so was Dewey, and that didn't stop Truman from tying him to the unpopular and extremely conservative Republican Congress. Thus I think Warren would lose for the same reason Dewey did.
Logged
big bad fab
filliatre
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 13,344
Ukraine


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2010, 04:48:28 AM »
2008: Joe Biden
2004: John Edwards (but I'm not so sure: Oct. 04 was a bit special, you know...)
2000: Joe Lieberman
1996: Al Gore
1992: Al Gore
1988: Lloyd Bentsen
1984: George Bush
1980: George Bush
1976: Walter Mondale (Rockefeller would have been Carter's VP IF....)
1972: Spiro Agnew
1968: Ed Muskie
1964: Hubert Humphrey
1960: Lyndon Johnson
1956: Richard Nixon
1952: Richard Nixon
1948: Earl Warren
1944: Harry Truman

Err... I guess my post doesn't add anything, in fact...
It's quite clear, eventually, even though 2004 would have been closer than one might imagine now with this deep hate of Darth Cheney.
Logged
MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2010, 07:12:49 AM »
Quote from: big bad fab on February 01, 2010, 04:48:28 AM
2008: Joe Biden
2004: John Edwards (but I'm not so sure: Oct. 04 was a bit special, you know...)
2000: Joe Lieberman
1996: Al Gore
1992: Al Gore
1988: Lloyd Bentsen
1984: George Bush
1980: George Bush
1976: Walter Mondale (Rockefeller would have been Carter's VP IF....)
1972: Spiro Agnew
1968: Ed Muskie
1964: Hubert Humphrey
1960: Lyndon Johnson
1956: Richard Nixon
1952: Richard Nixon
1948: Earl Warren
1944: Harry Truman

Err... I guess my post doesn't add anything, in fact...
It's quite clear, eventually, even though 2004 would have been closer than one might imagine now with this deep hate of Darth Cheney.

I think Cheney would defeat Lieberman in 2000.
Logged
big bad fab
filliatre
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 13,344
Ukraine


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2010, 11:09:59 AM »
Quote from: Cigarette-smoking Man on February 01, 2010, 07:12:49 AM
Quote from: big bad fab on February 01, 2010, 04:48:28 AM
2008: Joe Biden
2004: John Edwards (but I'm not so sure: Oct. 04 was a bit special, you know...)
2000: Joe Lieberman
1996: Al Gore
1992: Al Gore
1988: Lloyd Bentsen
1984: George Bush
1980: George Bush
1976: Walter Mondale (Rockefeller would have been Carter's VP IF....)
1972: Spiro Agnew
1968: Ed Muskie
1964: Hubert Humphrey
1960: Lyndon Johnson
1956: Richard Nixon
1952: Richard Nixon
1948: Earl Warren
1944: Harry Truman

Err... I guess my post doesn't add anything, in fact...
It's quite clear, eventually, even though 2004 would have been closer than one might imagine now with this deep hate of Darth Cheney.

I think Cheney would defeat Lieberman in 2000.

Mmmm... It was FL at stake: Lieberman would have been able to campaign more efficiently there than Cheney, even if Cheney might have grasped Iowa.
But you're right in the sense that it would have been close.
Logged
MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #9 on: February 01, 2010, 01:07:00 PM »
Quote from: big bad fab on February 01, 2010, 11:09:59 AM
Quote from: Cigarette-smoking Man on February 01, 2010, 07:12:49 AM
Quote from: big bad fab on February 01, 2010, 04:48:28 AM
2008: Joe Biden
2004: John Edwards (but I'm not so sure: Oct. 04 was a bit special, you know...)
2000: Joe Lieberman
1996: Al Gore
1992: Al Gore
1988: Lloyd Bentsen
1984: George Bush
1980: George Bush
1976: Walter Mondale (Rockefeller would have been Carter's VP IF....)
1972: Spiro Agnew
1968: Ed Muskie
1964: Hubert Humphrey
1960: Lyndon Johnson
1956: Richard Nixon
1952: Richard Nixon
1948: Earl Warren
1944: Harry Truman

Err... I guess my post doesn't add anything, in fact...
It's quite clear, eventually, even though 2004 would have been closer than one might imagine now with this deep hate of Darth Cheney.

I think Cheney would defeat Lieberman in 2000.

Mmmm... It was FL at stake: Lieberman would have been able to campaign more efficiently there than Cheney, even if Cheney might have grasped Iowa.
But you're right in the sense that it would have been close.

See, back in 2000 Cheney was not quite unpopular and hated veep. Actually, he was viewed as an respected statesmen.
Logged
Dancing with Myself
tb75
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 4,941
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #10 on: February 01, 2010, 01:34:07 PM »
I agree with all of this except for Agnes in 1972. Nixon would have chose John Conally or someone else to be his VP.
Logged
Bo
Rochambeau
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 13,986
Israel


Political Matrix
E: -5.23, S: -2.52

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2010, 01:36:33 PM »

What makes you think Warren would win in 1948?
Logged
Bo
Rochambeau
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 13,986
Israel


Political Matrix
E: -5.23, S: -2.52

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #12 on: February 01, 2010, 01:37:15 PM »
Quote from: tb75 on February 01, 2010, 01:34:07 PM
I agree with all of this except for Agnes in 1972. Nixon would have chose John Conally or someone else to be his VP.

You mean Agnew. And this is irrelevant, since the thread said that the competition will be between all the VP candidates in RL.
Logged
Хahar 🤔
Xahar
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 41,708
Bangladesh


Political Matrix
E: -6.77, S: 0.61

WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2010, 02:28:03 AM »
He is elected separately, though.
Logged
minionofmidas
Lewis Trondheim
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 58,206
India


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2010, 04:48:53 AM »
What Xahar said. The question as posed makes no sense, really, given that the US President is not popularly elected. Unless we're assuming the election of separate slates of presidential electors and vice presidential electors, as fab appears to have done.
Logged
MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2010, 08:18:44 AM »

Technically, yes, but still ticket run togehter.
Logged
Хahar 🤔
Xahar
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 41,708
Bangladesh


Political Matrix
E: -6.77, S: 0.61

WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #16 on: February 05, 2010, 03:41:12 AM »
Quote from: Rep. Kalwejt (SDP-RI) on February 03, 2010, 08:18:44 AM

Technically, yes, but still ticket run togehter.

Of course. There's no way to make it otherwise, really.
Logged
Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 58,314
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #17 on: February 05, 2010, 10:21:46 AM »
1932 : Garner (by a smaller margin than Roosevelt)
1936 : Garner (smaller margin)
1940 : Wallace (smaller margin)
1944 : Truman (similar margin)
1948 : Warren
1952 : Nixon (smaller margin)
1956 : Nixon (smaller margin)
1960 : Johnson (higher margin)
1964 : Humphrey (smaller margin)
1968 : Muskie
1972 : Agnew (smaller margin)
1976 : Mondale (smaller margin -and the election map would be extremely different than for Presidential election)
1980 : Bush (smaller margin)
1984 : Bush (higher margin)
1988 : Bentsen
1992 : Gore (higher margin)
1996 : Gore (similar margin)
2000 : Lieberman
2004 : Edwards
2008 : Biden (higher margin)

I'll do maps later if I have the time.
Logged
Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 58,314
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #18 on: February 05, 2010, 11:47:02 AM »
Here is for 1932 :



Garner : 53%
Curtis : 44%

Garner does better in the South and worse everywhaere else.
Logged
Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 58,314
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #19 on: February 05, 2010, 11:57:11 AM »
1948 :



Warren : 49%
Barkley : 46%
Thurmond : 2%
Logged
MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #20 on: February 05, 2010, 12:00:38 PM »

Thurmond was a Dixiecrat nominee for President. Governor Fielding Wright of Mississippi was nominated for veep.
Logged
Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 58,314
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #21 on: February 05, 2010, 12:05:23 PM »
1952 :



Nixon : 52%
Sparkman : 46%

Kal : sorry, I was just inattentive. Tongue
Logged
Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 58,314
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #22 on: February 05, 2010, 02:02:30 PM »
1960 :



Johnson : 53%
Lodge : 47%

I realized just after finishing the map that it looked incredibly like the 1976 one, though it was totally causal... Tongue
Logged
Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 58,314
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #23 on: February 05, 2010, 02:10:27 PM »
1964 :



Humphrey : 56%
Miller : 43%
Logged
Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 58,314
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #24 on: February 06, 2010, 09:51:59 AM »
« Edited: February 06, 2010, 10:02:47 AM by Northeast Representative Antonio V »
1968 :



Muskie : 46%
Agnew : 42%
LeMay : 11%

There's no electoral majority, so the vote goes to the Senate were Muskie wins.
Logged
Pages: [1] 2  
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.058 seconds with 9 queries.