Papal Conclave - 2007 Info Center

[J. J.]

Make it ten, if you can handle the next Wolsey.

Seriously, I've quoted both the Convocation of the Clergy of the Provence of Canterbury and Apostolic Constitution Universi Dominici Gregis in scholarly papers.

[J. J.]

I'll go with being a scholar.

[J. J.]

Personal Profiles

Name:  Probably something Italian, German, or Eastern European.  May have a "von" in it.

1) Are you a member of the Roman Curia, or a pastoral bishop.

[X] The Curia:  Members of the Curia are well known, and will start out with
                       an early advantage.  They will also be more platable to other
                       members of the Curia, at least at first.  They might have a
                       hard time winning over Cardinals who are from outside of
                       Rome, however.
[ ] Pastoral Bishop:  Many will be lesser known, and not quite as well
                       connected, but they could pick up significant support as
                       the conclave proceeds.

2) Do you come from a wealthy or poor country.

[X] Wealthy:   Chances are you will start out in higher standing, but will be
                      unlikely to garner support from those who orginate in the 3rd
                      World.

[ ] Poor:         You will arive with a lower profile, but have the potential to
                      win over considerable support, due to your background.

Note:  Members of the Curia may also be from the poorer regions of the world.  Also, some countries with significant regional income differences might be divided into seperate classes (such as Nothern and Southern Italy).

3) Are you European or non-European? (no explanation required)

[X] European

[ ] non-European

Note:  For the Purpose of the game, Americans, Canadians, Australians, etc, are not classified as Europeans.  This group is for people who are strictly European.

4) Are you a Scholar or a "Man-of-the-people"?

[X] Scholar:      Some groups and individuals prefer a more scholarly Pope

[ ] Man-of-the-People:  Where as some prefer one who is easier for the
                       average person to relate to.

5) Older or Younger?

[X] Older

[ ] Younger

6) What's your ego like?

[ X] Humble and Quiet: People will preceive you as being more spiritual and
                        nurturing

[] Bombastic and Outspoke: People will precieve you as being more of a
                        "champion" and strong-willed

Theological

1) The clearest path to Salvation is through

[X] The Sacraments

[ ] Good works

[ ] Simple faith, like that of a child

[ ] Having a complex and  intimate understanding of one's faith

2) Marian Devotion and the Saints

[ ] Mary should be seen in the role of "co-redemptrix".  Not equal to Christ,
    but still playing an essential role in salvation.

[X] Mary should be adored as the Mother of God and a powerful advocate
    for sinners, but lets not get carried away.

[ ] Catholics aren't supposed to "worship" Mary and the saints, but there
    are plenty who don't seem to know that.  We should place less
    emphasis on them, less people get confused and begin to pray someone
    other than God.

[ ] In the modern age it is fitting for us to stress a more personal relationship with God.
    Mary should be adored and the saints should be praised and looked up to, but people
    should be more willing to simply “take their problems” directly to God.

3) The mass

[ ] The mass should adhere to a strict protocol.  Things are done a certain way for a reason.
     We should go back to a Latin format.  (Note:  If this line were were not in here, I would check this box)

[X] Keep the mass as is.

[ ] The mass should be less formal.  More a celebration than a ritual.

4) The Modern Church has a responsibility to
[ ] Ensure social and economic justice.

[X] Ensure the spiritual well being of its members.

5) The Church should work harder to reinforce the faith of

[ ] The community

[X] The individual

6) Christian Reconciliation

[ ] All non-Catholics are heretics, to be damned in the eternal fires of Hell.  Why should we care
    about reconciliation?

[ ] Reconciliation with other Christian groups, particularly Orthodox groups, is desirable.
    As the one true faith, it should be on our terms, however.

[ ] The Church needs to breath with two lungs again.  We should work out our differences with
     the Orthodox faiths, and also seek to reincorporate the Church of England into the fold.

[X] We should not actively seek reconciliation, as it is not necessary.  All Christians are brothers of
     one faith, even if we don’t agree on all the specifics.

Political

1) Which should be a higher priority for the Church?

[ ] To promote a message that emphasizes protecting life and condemning modern societies trend
     towards devaluing it.

[ ] To promote a sense of economic justice and basic equality for people all over the world,
     condemning those who exploit the labor of others.

[X] I prefer an approach that balances the two.

2) View of globalization

[X] Globalization is an important force for promoting basic rights and economic opportunity for all
     people.

[ ] Globalization exploits the weaker and poorer to the benefit of the stronger and wealthier.

3) What is your view on separation of Church and State

[ ] It is the duty of any good Catholic, whether a member of the clergy or a layperson, to make
    sure that the laws of their country uphold at least the most basic moral standards.  The Vatican
    should be vigorously involved in promoting moral standards for governments all over the world

[X] Morality is a matter of individual choice.  The clergy should work to instill high moral
    standards in their parishioners, but the Church should not be involved in controlling the laws of
    world governments.

4) The “West” and the “Rest”

[ ] The West is the home of Christianity and is still the base of the Christian world.  The
     deterioration of Christian devotion in Europe is very worrisome.  How can Christianity
     continue to spread if the area that fostered it is no longer Christian?  We must focus on
     revitalizing Christianity in the West, especially in Europe.

[X] Catholicism is blossoming in many countries that are not traditionally Christian.  While we
     Should not place the majority of attention on Africa and Asia, we should change are thinking
     to a moral global mind set.

[ ] The West must learn to be more responsible with its power, especially the United States.  All
     to often, Third World countries, where many poor Christians live, are exploited by these
    Westerners who have clearly lost their way to greed and materialism.  Maybe we should send      missionaries from the rest of the World to remind the West of what they have become.  Either
    way, the Church’s focus should be on the Developing World.

5)Are other faiths "valid"?

[ ] No.  Catholicism is the only valid faith.  Salvation can only be found
    through the sacraments.

[X] Validation comes through belief in Christ.  All Christian faiths are valid.

[ ] Christianity, Islam and Judaism are valid, as they all believe in the one
    God variously called Yahweh, Allah or simply "Lord".

[ ] Any faith that holds true to the spirit of love and brotherhood expressed
    by Jesus Christ is valid.  All good people will know Christ is death, if not in
    life.

Structure

1) Which most closely matches your view?

[ ] Many of the changes made by Vatican II seem to have robbed the Church of much of its moral
    authority.  The striping of power away from the hands of the clergy and into the hands of lay      people has been, on the whole, bad for the theological and structural cohesion of the Church.       It is hard for the Church to say anything without being challenged, and people have only
    become more bold with their challenges.  In the mean time, it hasn’t done much for Church
    attendance, as many people have started to think that if “it isn’t that important, then why
    bother”.  Clergy, bishops and the Pope need to take back the moral authority to tell people how
    it is.  People need discipline and direction in faith.

[X] Vatican II was a good step towards further devolution of the Church.  Faith can’t be a “one-      size-fits-all” matter.  People are different.  Would we rather have more people feel included, or      turn more people away.  Lay organizations such as Parish councils also give people more stake in their parish community and helps them feel more involved in their parish and their own faith.  I don’t want a Church with no authority, just one that isn’t so strictly institutionalized, one that feels less like an organization and more like a faith community.

[J. J.]

As you can see I'm basically creating the dark-horse liberation theology loving economic justice supporting Latin American candidate.

Yeah, I was going to make a comment to that regard.  Well, the conclave certainly needs one.  We also need a dyed in the wool conservative who thinks Pius X was the last truely great Pope.  No takers yet, though.

The scary thing is that I look like the most conservative one.  States will have to weigh in.

[J. J.]

My name:  Eugen Cardinal von Frick, President of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity.

(If I wasn't a cardinal, I'd be Eugen Freiherr von Frick)

[J. J.]

My name:  Eugen Cardinal von Frick, President of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity.

(If I wasn't a cardinal, I'd be Eugen Freiherr von Frick)

LOL... I can't believe it.  That's the post I have you in.

Trying to be a Walter Kasper, knock off? 

Not quite.  I wanted someone who was exposed to Kung, but not necessarily a supporter.  I wanted someone with an aristocratic and scholarly background; Kasper doesn't have the former.  I looked at Curia posts and found that one likely.

[J. J.]

My name:  Eugen Cardinal von Frick, President of the Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity.

(If I wasn't a cardinal, I'd be Eugen Freiherr von Frick)

LOL... I can't believe it.  That's the post I have you in.

Trying to be a Walter Kasper, knock off? 

Not quite.  I wanted someone who was exposed to Kung, but not necessarily a supporter.  I wanted someone with an aristocratic and scholarly background; Kasper doesn't have the former.  I looked at Curia posts and found that one likely.

So you were going for a kind of Kasper/Schonborn hybrid?

I'd heard of Schonborn, but I didn't really think of him.  I think that you could classify me as someone not opposed to change, but does not want change for change sake.   I agree with mass in the vernacular, for example, though I feel that the Latin Mass can be used optionally.

I'm also, in this conclave, probably closer to Kaspar's age, mid seventies.

[J. J.]

I'm doing something this weekend, so my participation will be limited.

[J. J.]

Sorry for the delay everyone, I have had some personal stuff to deal with for the past couple days, but I promise I will get this all out soon.  I hope no one is losing interest... either way, thanks. 

Losing interest?  I'm waiting with bated breath for this to begin.   It sounds very interesting.

So am I.

[J. J.]

I will hope that the Holy Spirit would be doing the influencing.

I am interested in the views of my brothers on the Sacraments, which is how the Holy Spirit has moved me.

How does the Church serve as a vehicle for these?

[J. J.]

I may try to influence more if the Cardinals would be more forthcoming.

[J. J.]

I may try to influence more if the Cardinals would be more forthcoming.

They will step forward more in the later rounds, unless you are refering to the player Cardinals, or course, then I can't speak for them not answering your question.

You guys can make speeches you know?

I am referring to the player Cardinals.

[J. J.]

I would point out that abstentions are possible in papal elections.

[J. J.]

could you make that a majority instead of 50% +1?

[J. J.]

could you make that a majority instead of 50% +1?

Do you mean a plurality?  Cause a majority is 50% + 1

No, 59% + 1 is not necessarily a majority.

If there an odd number of votes, 33 for example, a majority 17 in whole numbers (majority means more than half).  Exactly 50% of 33 is 16.5.    50% + 1 of 33 is 17.5 (or 18 in whole numbers).  You'd end up needing a bit more than a majority with 50% + 1.

You might want to check Wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majority

[J. J.]

could you make that a majority instead of 50% +1?

Do you mean a plurality?  Cause a majority is 50% + 1

No, 59% + 1 is not necessarily a majority.

If there an odd number of votes, 33 for example, a majority 17 in whole numbers (majority means more than half).  Exactly 50% of 33 is 16.5.    50% + 1 of 33 is 17.5 (or 18 in whole numbers).  You'd end up needing a bit more than a majority with 50% + 1.

You might want to check Wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majority

Well, in this case, we are playing with an even number... but okay... a majority.

Some might not vote, however.

[J. J.]

In response to JJ's question, it seems to me that much of the enthusiasm for this has died out.  If I am wrong, please, let me know.  I am certainly interested in carrying it to its conclusion, and even if not, I would like to seek to revive it someday.

Let's finish this.

Agreed.

[J. J.]

You do realize that this election has gone on longer than the last three papal elections, possibly combined?