Canada General Discussion (2019-)

[Open Source Intelligence]

Any guesses at seats?

[Flyersfan232]

More generally though I wonder if the broad centre-left in the western world will start moderating on immigration rates because it's proving to be a real vote-loser. Sweden basically used to never have right-wing governments, for most of its postwar history it was governed by Social Democrats. At most you'd have a coalition led by a standard CDU-type conservative party, with its more conservative impulses moderated by centrist partners. This used to be a testament to the supposedly inherent progressivism of Swedes. But right now, Sweden is governed by a distinctly right-wing coalition that includes basically their PPC, which also happens to be the second largest party in parliament. And their rise was almost entirely to do with Sweden's high immigration rates.

Sweden is just one example, but you can take basically any European country and the same pattern emerges. In the states, I would argue that immigration is the #1 vote-winner for Trump, and should he win this November that will be why. Biden's hands are tied, even using the word "illegal" in his SOTU speech pissed off a lot of the Democrats' base. In the UK, of course, immigration was the main reason behind a Brexit vote that has objectively had awful outcomes for Britain. And in Canada, although Poilievre is significantly less anti-immigration compared to European right-wingers or Trump (it really isn't even a part of his pitch), there's no doubt that Liberal immigration policy has turned off a lot of former LPC voters.

So at some point, progressives will get the message, right? This is not a hill worth dying on. You don't have to go racist or full on close the borders like some right-wingers do, it's not one or the other. But why exactly must "high immigration" be such a key part of the modern left, when clearly all it does is give easy wins to the right?

dont compare the swedish democrats to the ppc they swedish democrats arent grifters

[Flyersfan232]

Justin Trudeau needs to resign. Over many things, but especially the student visa/immigration issue. This is unacceptable. It's time for some accountability.

yeah but do the liberals really want their version of liz truss to run the party?

[Benjamin Frank 2.0]

Justin Trudeau needs to resign. Over many things, but especially the student visa/immigration issue. This is unacceptable. It's time for some accountability.

Who would take over? Every Liberal M.P is ultimately complicit. If the Liberals are going to lose over this (or whatever else) it should be with the guy who in charge the whole time.

Literally anyone who is competent enough to fix the immigration system.



Or we should have an election to elect a new government.

Either way this cannot go on any longer.

I was thinking of what high profile person who is associated with the Liberal Party and likely still a member but quit so has a profile independent from the Justin Trudeau Liberal Party (I'm pretty sure Jody Wilson Raybould is no longer a Liberal and is 'hated' by many in the party and Jane Philpott has a great current job and isn't really all that high profile.) And, this person also seems to be being promoted by the national media, at least a little and given the benefit of some positive revisionist history: Bill Morneau.

For instance (this is not from the CBC but from BNNBloomberg -which is Canadian)
https://twitter.com/cbcwatcher/status/1780652321292144740

[Hatman 🍁]

Once respected journalist Rex Murphy has died. The last decade of his life saw him go off the deep end with his ramblings.

[CumbrianLefty]

Which brand of conspiracy theory in particular?

[Independents for Nihilism]

Which brand of conspiracy theory in particular?

I've heard him called a climate change denier, and while it's true that he's appeared on Jordan Peterson's podcast, at worst I'd call him an oil industry stooge. Not so much a conspiracist as somebody able to colourfully spin the truth. That said, I also believe he was pro-convoy, though I'm not sure under what justification, and if he was rambling about Great Replacement or something, then I would not mind being corrected.

[The Right Honourable Martin Brian Mulroney PC CC GOQ]

Any guesses at seats?

I mean the next election isn't scheduled for another 17 months, so guessing seat counts right now is pointless.

[The Right Honourable Martin Brian Mulroney PC CC GOQ]

It's that time of year again: ‘Summer of discontent’ coming over public service in-office order: unions

I was sympathetic to last year's PSAC strikes (not that PSAC should even exist, but hey), because the Treasury Board put off discussions for two years only to give them a meager raise. If I were a public servant, I'd be pissed too. But this year, the discontent is entirely over the government's order for public servants to return to the office for 3 days a week.

I'm not sure what leverage they think they have. This was Singh's response:

Aylward and other union leaders sent a letter to the New Democrats urging the party to reconsider its “stance” over the NDP’s agreement with the Liberals.

The New Democrats are propping up the federal government through a supply and confidence deal. NDP Leader Jagmeet Singh would not answer whether he’s prepared to back out of the agreement, which would effectively trigger an election.

“We have lots of tools [at] our disposal with the agreement we have, which allows us to put a lot of pressure on the Liberals. We’re going to use that pressure. We’re going to use those tools to stand up for working people,” said Singh.

Yeah, based on that I'd say the likelihood of NDP revoking confidence over this is basically 0%. The threat of a non-confidence vote is the only real leverage the NDP has over Liberals, and it would be stupid to waste that power on this. I also doubt the public will be on their side. Whatever the merits of their argument, or the potentially misguided reasons behind this back-to-work order, there won't be much public sympathy if they strike. From a layman's perspective, this is a generally underworked and overpaid class of people crying foul at the horror of...having to go to the office...three days a week. Lmao.