Stronach crosses floor to join Liberals

[Hatman 🍁]

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2005/05/17/stronach-liberals050517.html

This is truly amazing! The tories can kiss ever winning a majority in the future with this moderate gone. My only beef is,  her vote will be in favour of the budget (i.e. non confidence vote) and the chances of us going to the polls this summer decreases. This is certainly surprising that someone would *join* the Liberals when they're down in the polls.

[Hatman 🍁]

That was rather unexpected.

I wonder if her sweetheart MacKay will follow suit?

Not likely. I am betting this would effect their relationship though
Peter MacKay, while moderate- is not as moderate as Belinda (he voted against Same-sex marriage) so I think he will stay.

[Hatman 🍁]

I'm sorta torn on my opinion of this.  On one hand, I'm happy to have her in the party, but on another hand, this basically means that she has no chance whatsoever of ever being leader of the Conservative Party now, which is really too bad.

My sentiments exactly. Plus, we may not be going to the polls now.

[Hatman 🍁]

Not all that suprising. Interesting there's rumours that one or two Liberal M.P's might go the other way.

There were. David Kilgour became an independent, and the other guy had a press conference saying he was sticking around. Now I am hearing rumours that Loyola Hearn, a Stronach supporter may join Belinda, but I doubt it.

[Hatman 🍁]

Stephen Harper is indicative of Canadian Conservative Party, and is experienced and a relatively good politician. Belinda Stronach is holding her first political office... ever...

Siege

Brian Mulroney was elected leader with no experience. Ms. Stronach is exactly what this country needs. I think you're just afraid of a woman being Prime Minister.

[Hatman 🍁]

Indeed, women are the real problem, I don't know why we even let them vote.

Even if Stronach has no experience, knowledge of the political system, or public experience, she deserves to be PM!

Siege

Just because she is a woman doesn't mean she doesnt have any knowledge of the political system. Of that she has tons. She may not have much experience, but she now has an infinite more experience than Mulroney had when he became Prime Minister.  Her moderate views would have saved the Conservatives, and her breath of fresh air is what will save the Liberals in the long term.

[Hatman 🍁]

Indeed, women are the real problem, I don't know why we even let them vote.

Even if Stronach has no experience, knowledge of the political system, or public experience, she deserves to be PM!

Siege

Just because she is a woman doesn't mean she doesnt have any knowledge of the political system. Of that she has tons. She may not have much experience, but she now has an infinite more experience than Mulroney had when he became Prime Minister.  Her moderate views would have saved the Conservatives, and her breath of fresh air is what will save the Liberals in the long term.

I wish I could remember the specific event, but Stronach at one time did not know a basic procedural motion of the House. It had something to do with a vote I believe.

Holding up Brian Mulroney isn't really great either, I don't like Brian Mulroney, and it isn't a good defense since I dislike his Prime Ministership and he was also inexperienced. Experience matters even on some local or provincial level. Some is always better than none at all.

Siege

Obviously, Liberals don't like Mulroney, and I am in that boat. But it wasn't his lack of experience that made him a bad Prime Minister. Belinda knows the ropes now, and I hope she's our Prime Minister one day.

[Hatman 🍁]

I was rather hoping that the liberals would lose the no confidence vote while the Queen was in-country

I heard somewhere that the Queen can't be in the country during an election campaign.

[Hatman 🍁]

I hope she "pulls a Churchill".  She flirts with the liberals, comes back to the CPC, becomes its leader, and becomes the greatest prime minister ever

Indeed, women are the real problem, I don't know why we even let them vote.

Even if Stronach has no experience, knowledge of the political system, or public experience, she deserves to be PM!

Siege

Just because she is a woman doesn't mean she doesnt have any knowledge of the political system. Of that she has tons. She may not have much experience, but she now has an infinite more experience than Mulroney had when he became Prime Minister.  Her moderate views would have saved the Conservatives, and her breath of fresh air is what will save the Liberals in the long term.

I wish I could remember the specific event, but Stronach at one time did not know a basic procedural motion of the House. It had something to do with a vote I believe.

Holding up Brian Mulroney isn't really great either, I don't like Brian Mulroney, and it isn't a good defense since I dislike his Prime Ministership and he was also inexperienced. Experience matters even on some local or provincial level. Some is always better than none at all.

Siege

Obviously, Liberals don't like Mulroney, and I am in that boat. But it wasn't his lack of experience that made him a bad Prime Minister. Belinda knows the ropes now, and I hope she's our Prime Minister one day.

Well, there's no question that whatever party she's the leader of- she will be the best PM ever (except for maybe Trudeau)

[Hatman 🍁]

Wow. Well, after her dad ruined Austrian football forevermore, I guess she tried and failed to do the same to the Conservatives, and will now try it on the Liberals.

What do you have against the lovely Ms. Stronach?

[Hatman 🍁]

What did he do?

[Hatman 🍁]

What did he do?

He apparently "ruined Austrian football forevermore".

I don't get it. I wasn't aware the Stronach's were involved in Austrian soccer of all things.

[Hatman 🍁]

What's wrong with that? I would think you Europeans would love us Canadians. I mean, we did liberate Holland.

[Hatman 🍁]

I can't believe people want Belinda Stronach to be the Prime Minister... God have mercy on us all if she did...

Siege

Why is that?  Why do you hate her so much?

[Hatman 🍁]

I can't believe people want Belinda Stronach to be the Prime Minister... God have mercy on us all if she did...

Siege

Why is that?  Why do you hate her so much?

Earl you assume a lot of my opinions from my posts. I don't hate Belinda Stronach, I just think she's a lousy politician and would make an extremely poor choice for Member of Parliament, let alone Prime Minister of this country.

The woman betrayed her constituents, engaged in petty party politics with Harper, and changed party not because any act of conscience, but for political ambition. While I recognize most politicians have ambitions and may be devious to attain them she has epidimized this.

I might as well add, before you call me a sexist, or imply it again, that I find the insults being thrown at her based on her physical appearance or sex are disgraceful and those in the media and in politics should be ashamed of themselves.

Siege

Ms. Stronach did not betray her constituents. She will get re-elected, even if the election is this spring, you can bet on it. If she didn't run in the last election, the Liberals would have won the riding. It was so close, that personal popularity carried it for her. The same will happen again. Just look at Scott Brison.

Now I admit, her move may have been triggered by ambition, but only a small bit. I doesn't take an idiot to realize she was in the wrong party, as many of her positions conflicted with the Conservative Party. You just have to watch the Conservative convention this year to realize this. The poor woman was booed many times.

The problem we have in this country is that all our great female leaders are criticized so much that it makes it difficult for them ever to become Prime Minister. You may not be "sexist", but you have to try supporting women- moderate female politicians instead of labelling with false attributes. There is no reason why she would not make a great Prime Minister.

[Hatman 🍁]

The Red Tories collectively have now become the Liberal Party, so yes, it made sense for Belinda to shift parties, but she should of never ran if it wasn't the right party for her.

And Belind may be a fine politician, I have yet to see proof of this, but I think there are far better women and men in parliament that could do her job. For example my MP Colleen Baumier has sat in parliament for over 10 years and has not come close getting a Cabinet position, she's done notable work in many committees especially those dealing with foreign issues.

Is my MP more or less qualified for the Cabinet than Ms. Stronach. I was hoping that Ms. Baumier would get a seat in the Cabinet, but I guess spots are reserved for Conservative turncoats. I really don't care the sex of any politicians, it matters more to me their experience, their record, and their positions.

Siege

Belinda could be considered more qualified. She played a huge role in making the Conservative Party, and her disappointment with the way it turned out was one of the factors that led her to move.  Ms. Stronach was also named as one of the most powerful women in the world by Forbes magazine. Sure, she was handed her job by her father, but it takes good work, to make it to the top. This is experience. We will also note that Paul Martin himself was a powerful businessman before getting into politics.  Perhaps what Ms. Beaumier is lacking is having a similar ideology as Paul Martin. As you can tell by his actions last year, it helps.

[Hatman 🍁]

anyway, how can one defection stop the collapse of the government? Was there onoly a liikely one-vote margin?

We will find out tommorow. Two independents are both undecided, and if they both vote against the government, it will fail. Before Belinda crossed, only one had to vote against I believe.

[Hatman 🍁]

Cadman will probably do what his constituents want him to do.

His constituents want him to vote for the Budget. Looks like Kilgour may vote against. That will give us a tie, with the speaker breaking the vote. Boourns! We will find out in about 2 hours.

[Hatman 🍁]

Do you know of any places I can get up to date information on the vote?

If you get CBC or CBC Newsworld, that might help.

[Hatman 🍁]

Your mom! ... is a flip flopper. Mean while, my position on Belinda remains the same. Gotta love her... somehow. She used to be a tory, and I dont like the tories... now she's a Liberal, and I dont like them either. She also caused this election I was hoping for to not happen. But somehow, I still don't hate her