Lara Trump promises legal ballot harvesting to be part of new RNC strategy

[OSR stands with Israel]

Ballot Harvesting should be banned

[Fuzzy Bear]

Ballot Harvesting should be banned

I agree.  But Republicans need to learn it, because it seems to be part of the game.

[Skill and Chance]

Political parties always help their voters vote. How is picking up and dropping off someone’s ballot functionally any different from picking them up and driving them to the polls?

In the latter case, election workers can know with certainty whether the driver/helper is pressuring them, watching how they vote, trying to vote for them or trying to spoil a ballot being cast for the candidate they oppose. and put a stop to it.  In the former case, they can't know for sure if any of that nefarious stuff happened.  In the worst case scenario, poorly educated people and/or people with low English proficiency in a demographic group believed to be unfavorable to the harvester's party are manipulated into handing over their ballots to be destroyed instead of delivered. 

[Ferguson97]

Ballot Harvesting should be banned

There's no good reason to ban it, only right-wing conspiracies.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Ballot Harvesting should be banned

There's no good reason to ban it, only right-wing conspiracies.

Only the individual voter should be allowed to drop off their ballot .

[Ferguson97]

Ballot Harvesting should be banned

There's no good reason to ban it, only right-wing conspiracies.

Only the individual voter should be allowed to drop off their ballot .

Rephrasing your position is not an argument.

[Skill and Chance]

Ballot Harvesting should be banned

There's no good reason to ban it, only right-wing conspiracies.

Only the individual voter should be allowed to drop off their ballot .

Rephrasing your position is not an argument.

How do you know the person you hand off your ballot to will actually drop it off and not throw it away?

That's the fundamental issue here.  There are secure ways to do mail-in voting. This isn't it.

[OSR stands with Israel]

Ballot Harvesting should be banned

There's no good reason to ban it, only right-wing conspiracies.

Only the individual voter should be allowed to drop off their ballot .

Rephrasing your position is not an argument.

How do you know the person you hand off your ballot to will actually drop it off and not throw it away?

That's the fundamental issue here.  There are secure ways to do mail-in voting. This isn't it.

Mail in voting also undermines the secret ballot as well . One of the key parts of a proper voting system is the fact that nobody but yourself can know who you truly voted for .

[Ferguson97]

How do you know the person you hand off your ballot to will actually drop it off and not throw it away?

If you're worried about that, then... just don't give it to them? You're acting like people are having their ballots torn out of their hands and harvested against their will.

Mail in voting also undermines the secret ballot as well . One of the key parts of a proper voting system is the fact that nobody but yourself can know who you truly voted for .

Mail-in voting is secure. Just because you can imagine a scenario where people are opening them up to see who you voted for, doesn't mean it's actually happening.

I didn't expect you of all people to engage in right-wing election denying rhetoric.

[Skill and Chance]

How do you know the person you hand off your ballot to will actually drop it off and not throw it away?

If you're worried about that, then... just don't give it to them? You're acting like people are having their ballots torn out of their hands and harvested against their will.

Mail in voting also undermines the secret ballot as well . One of the key parts of a proper voting system is the fact that nobody but yourself can know who you truly voted for .

Mail-in voting is secure. Just because you can imagine a scenario where people are opening them up to see who you voted for, doesn't mean it's actually happening.

I didn't expect you of all people to engage in right-wing election denying rhetoric.

There is some legitimate reason for concern here.  With regard to people who live together in the same household, you will never know for sure.

[7,052,770]

Ballot Harvesting should be banned

There's no good reason to ban it, only right-wing conspiracies.

Only the individual voter should be allowed to drop off their ballot .

Rephrasing your position is not an argument.

How do you know the person you hand off your ballot to will actually drop it off and not throw it away?

That's the fundamental issue here.  There are secure ways to do mail-in voting. This isn't it.

Mail in voting also undermines the secret ballot as well . One of the key parts of a proper voting system is the fact that nobody but yourself can know who you truly voted for .

Like I've posted before, when I vote (in person only), people can easily look over and see my votes at the voting table (there are a couple of flimsy cardboard dividers that don't really block anything) and then again when submitting the ballot, a big screen shows every vote so we can make sure we voted like we intended to, and that's all in full view of the next person in line as well as the old white man handing out the "I voted" stickers. I feel like I've gotten some scowls for voting Democratic, but to be fair, he probably scowls at everyone.

I say this to just point out that any system, even an entirely in-person one, is going to have examples of when it's not as "secret" as it's supposed to be. What we can ensure is that turnout is as high as possible by giving people lots of different options.

[OSR stands with Israel]

How do you know the person you hand off your ballot to will actually drop it off and not throw it away?

If you're worried about that, then... just don't give it to them? You're acting like people are having their ballots torn out of their hands and harvested against their will.

Mail in voting also undermines the secret ballot as well . One of the key parts of a proper voting system is the fact that nobody but yourself can know who you truly voted for .

Mail-in voting is secure. Just because you can imagine a scenario where people are opening them up to see who you voted for, doesn't mean it's actually happening.

I didn't expect you of all people to engage in right-wing election denying rhetoric.

- People in your household can see who you voted for .

- This isn’t election denialism as I don’t believe votes should be thrown out after an election has already taken place . I believe these types of voting rules should be challenged and changed before the election not after . So my position is basically Brian Kemp’s Postion   

[VBM]

How do you know the person you hand off your ballot to will actually drop it off and not throw it away?

If you're worried about that, then... just don't give it to them? You're acting like people are having their ballots torn out of their hands and harvested against their will.

Mail in voting also undermines the secret ballot as well . One of the key parts of a proper voting system is the fact that nobody but yourself can know who you truly voted for .

Mail-in voting is secure. Just because you can imagine a scenario where people are opening them up to see who you voted for, doesn't mean it's actually happening.

I didn't expect you of all people to engage in right-wing election denying rhetoric.

Unfortunately it’s pretty clear that Conservacord has been gradually rotting OSR’s brain ever since the 2020 election

[OSR stands with Israel]

How do you know the person you hand off your ballot to will actually drop it off and not throw it away?

If you're worried about that, then... just don't give it to them? You're acting like people are having their ballots torn out of their hands and harvested against their will.

Mail in voting also undermines the secret ballot as well . One of the key parts of a proper voting system is the fact that nobody but yourself can know who you truly voted for .

Mail-in voting is secure. Just because you can imagine a scenario where people are opening them up to see who you voted for, doesn't mean it's actually happening.

I didn't expect you of all people to engage in right-wing election denying rhetoric.

Unfortunately it’s pretty clear that Conservacord has been gradually rotting OSR’s brain ever since the 2020 election

https://talkelections.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=395039.msg7584952#msg7584952

I was using the same rhetoric prior to the 2020 election

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

It's not the harvesting of ballots it's the provisions ballots that come in late that go overwhelmed D, they are younger voters that don't like Trump tax cuts

[Agafin]

If you're worried about that, then... just don't give it to them? You're acting like people are having their ballots torn out of their hands and harvested against their will.

...


Mail-in voting is secure. Just because you can imagine a scenario where people are opening them up to see who you voted for, doesn't mean it's actually happening.

I didn't expect you of all people to engage in right-wing election denying rhetoric.

None of those are imagined scenarios, they have happened. I even linked an article in this thread listing several examples of all those "imagined scenarios" happening and potentially swinging elections.

I could post a thousand links showing the contrary but this one should suffice:
7 Elections Reversed After Ballot Harvesting Scandals

You can check all of those examples, they are very real and are often what led to some states (like Florida) banning the practice.

What's interesting is that a lot of mainstream publications like the NYT actually did articles exposing these shortcomings of ballot harvesting back in the 2000s. But of course, no one wants to to talk about the very real issues with it now as that might give oxygen to Trump's broader election fraud narrative (which I think we all agree is bullcrap).

[John Dule]

Is it possible that the relative population density of Republican voters versus Democratic voters would make this much less effective than it is for the Dems?

[Badger]

Ballot Harvesting should be banned

I agree.  But Republicans need to learn it, because it seems to be part of the game.

Such moral consistency!

[John Dule]

Ballot Harvesting should be banned

I agree.  But Republicans need to learn it, because it seems to be part of the game.

Such moral consistency!

Don't Democrats literally make this exact same "unilateral disarmament" argument about gerrymandering?

[cg41386]

None of those are imagined scenarios, they have happened. I even linked an article in this thread listing several examples of all those "imagined scenarios" happening and potentially swinging elections.

Most of those are examples of small-scale local election fraud, and the people responsible were caught and held responsible.

[Del Tachi]

There's an abundance of Democratic, Republican, and 3rd Party votes out there "waiting to be got." In a perfect world, we would be like Australia and require 100% voter turnout and run our elections entirely based on persuasion, but in the meantime, each party should do everything it can to get all the votes they can possibly get.

There's an abundance of Democratic, Republican, and 3rd Party votes out there "waiting to be got." In a perfect world, we would be like Australia and require 100% voter turnout and run our elections entirely based on persuasion, but in the meantime, each party should do everything it can to get all the votes they can possibly get.

You're missing the point.  The #1 Democrat cope when they lose is that not enough people voted, as it is only through voter apathy or downright voter suppression that Republicans could ever win an election.  This is why Democrats favor selectively juicing turnout and mostly neglect playing to the median voter.

Mandatory voting, which would be unconstitutional is the U.S., is also a very bad idea.  Elections should be decided only by those voters motivated enough to learn about the issues/candidates, not a mass body voting under duress.