Did Susan Collins just announced her retirement?

[Very Legal & Very Cool]

We've entered an era where Spineless Susan, Flaky Flake, and Murky Murkowski are considered moderates. Voters are going to call BS on Republicans. What happened to the days of Wyden-Bennett or McCain-Feingold?

I'll tell you what happened. After the 2000 election, we had 30 senators from states that didn't vote for their party. After the 2016 election, we had 13 senators from states that didn't vote for their party. I'm counting VT for Republicans and Alabama for Republicans, respectively since those were post election changes.

Four of those 2016 senators came from MI, WI and PA, decided by less than 100,000 votes between the three. Partisanship has reached critical mass. We are almost at the point of no return.

Of course, what gets lost in the shuffle is that about 25 states are safe GOP. The fact that they can barely win despite this shows their ineptitude and the unpopularity of their agenda.

[Very Legal & Very Cool]

I can't believe I'm saying this but IceSpear has the most reasonable takes in this thread....

Uh, excuse me...when are my takes ever not reasonable?

I'm old enough to remember when Dems vowed to make Chuck Grassley pay for obstructing Garland...then within a week Trump did/said something stupid and distracted them with shiny objects, they all forgot, Grassley was a "reasonable sane moderate" again worthy of tons of crossover support, and then they got unceremoniously BTFO. And this was a mere 8 months before the election rather than 2 years! I fully expect something similar this time. In a month people will probably forget Kavanaugh's name and be focusing on Trump calling brown kids monkeys or something, and they'll love Susan Collins again because she had the "courage and bravery" to be a "maverick" and release a strongly worded statement condemning him for his tone.

Do you believe Collins will win reelection in 2020, if she runs again? Your overall pessimism about America and the American electorate seems to be relatively well justified at this point.

She has a better chance now because her biggest threat was a primary. Maine loves to nominate weak Dems but even morons like Paul LePage have won there so Susan should be fine. She was in a tough spot but probably made her best choice as much as I disagree with it.

[Very Legal & Very Cool]

Comparing Collins to Grassley is a bit disingenuous IMO. Grassley may have gotten some crossover support, but he has never built himself up as an honorable, consensus builder like Collins.

Normally, I agree with you, Icespear, about certain events/votes being overblown. But I don't think that is the case with Collins. It doesn't mean she will lose in 2020, but I don't think things will go back to normal for her after her vote yesterday.

Grassley always got tons of crossover support, even in 2016 despite all the Dems' impotent threats. Why? Because he was a "reasonable sane moderate" next to Great Satan Trump. The only thing Collins has to do is wait until the voters forget who Brett Kavanaugh is (won't take long) and do more faux posturing against Trump, and suddenly all the dullards will eat it up and love her again. People here need to keep in mind that we're all in the top 1% of political awareness. We're all in our own little bubble here. Most American voters are dumb, uninformed, and only start really paying attention like a month before the election.

Grassley won big because he was an incumbent in a swing state that faced weak opposition. Collins won because of a personal brand in a lean Dem state. Both are cunning politicians but their situations have always been different.

[Very Legal & Very Cool]

I can't believe I'm saying this but IceSpear has the most reasonable takes in this thread....

Uh, excuse me...when are my takes ever not reasonable?

I'm old enough to remember when Dems vowed to make Chuck Grassley pay for obstructing Garland...then within a week Trump did/said something stupid and distracted them with shiny objects, they all forgot, Grassley was a "reasonable sane moderate" again worthy of tons of crossover support, and then they got unceremoniously BTFO. And this was a mere 8 months before the election rather than 2 years! I fully expect something similar this time. In a month people will probably forget Kavanaugh's name and be focusing on Trump calling brown kids monkeys or something, and they'll love Susan Collins again because she had the "courage and bravery" to be a "maverick" and release a strongly worded statement condemning him for his tone.

Do you believe Collins will win reelection in 2020, if she runs again? Your overall pessimism about America and the American electorate seems to be relatively well justified at this point.

She could retire or lose the primary. If she runs and wins the primary then yeah, I think she wins. Maybe not by the gaudy margins she usually gets, but Maine will probably be within single digits again, so I don't see her having much of a problem getting the needed crossover votes for victory. Especially once she releases strongly worded statements condemning Trump for using the N word on Twitter in October 2020.

Probably so. I'm seriously starting to wonder at this point if America will remain this polarized and this partisan for the remainder of the century. Over time, the consequences for our political system will be disastrous.

See my above post about Senate composition. It's worrying.

[Very Legal & Very Cool]

I can't believe I'm saying this but IceSpear has the most reasonable takes in this thread....

Uh, excuse me...when are my takes ever not reasonable?

I'm old enough to remember when Dems vowed to make Chuck Grassley pay for obstructing Garland...then within a week Trump did/said something stupid and distracted them with shiny objects, they all forgot, Grassley was a "reasonable sane moderate" again worthy of tons of crossover support, and then they got unceremoniously BTFO. And this was a mere 8 months before the election rather than 2 years! I fully expect something similar this time. In a month people will probably forget Kavanaugh's name and be focusing on Trump calling brown kids monkeys or something, and they'll love Susan Collins again because she had the "courage and bravery" to be a "maverick" and release a strongly worded statement condemning him for his tone.

Do you believe Collins will win reelection in 2020, if she runs again? Your overall pessimism about America and the American electorate seems to be relatively well justified at this point.

She could retire or lose the primary. If she runs and wins the primary then yeah, I think she wins. Maybe not by the gaudy margins she usually gets, but Maine will probably be within single digits again, so I don't see her having much of a problem getting the needed crossover votes for victory. Especially once she releases strongly worded statements condemning Trump for using the N word on Twitter in October 2020.

Probably so. I'm seriously starting to wonder at this point if America will remain this polarized and this partisan for the remainder of the century. Over time, the consequences for our political system will be disastrous.

See my above post about Senate composition. It's worrying.

I did read your post, and I agree with its conclusions. The solidification of this country into blue and red states has done much to further this process of polarization along.

It's actually worse if you look at the pre-2000 composition. Republicans lost Michigan, Delaware, Washington, Minnesota while picking up Virginia and Florida. Before 2000, we weren't nearly as divided. Funny what 500 votes and a 5-4 supreme Court decision can do to a nation.