A few thoughts from your PO; AMENDMENTS AT VOTE

[Marokai Backbeat]

Similar to your Constitutional Revampification Amendment? Please, not that thing again.

[Marokai Backbeat]

What "massive" reform do I advocate now? Because if a CoG and all nationally-elected Senate seats is too "massive" for people, then we might as well shut down the ConCon right now.

Agreed. Seriously the stuff being proposed, if one takes even a slight glance, will clearly help the game. Regional Senate seats are crap. Governors are crap. But by creating a separate chamber, a CoG, and removing regional senators, we can make newly competitive, activity-inducing positions for the game.

I'm supportive of a Council of Governors, but if we eliminate regional senate seats while adding the Governors to the legislature, aren't we basically just eliminating overall offices and giving a new name to regional Senators? I mean, it's essentially just shuffling things around a bit.

Edit: All the while reducing overall participation.

[Marokai Backbeat]

I'm not voting for a bicameral legislature. Not unless it's Max/Lief's idea of 10 national senators and a five-seat CoG. Not now, not ever.

[Marokai Backbeat]

Substantive? What more can be said about a proposal you've been trying to tinker with to get passed for weeks?

I'm not voting for this because it's unnecessary horseshit. That's why. We can't will regional activity and creating a bicameral legislature just for the sake of it is not helpful or at all needed. I've been almost completely ignoring this "discussion" because I think it's all complete garbage and looking for some way to push through change just for the sake or it, or to find some way to get Purple's previously-failed proposals tinkered with enough to get Ayes.

I think it's nice that you've taken up spurring regional activity as your little pet-cause, but it can't be done, it's all unsustainable and unnecessary. The Mideast Assembly started marvelously, and then crashed. Two seats went vacant, you have idiots or no-bodies working on irrelevent legislation, and it's generally just sort of a propped up cancer patient at the moment. The Pacific legislature includes votes from all Pacificans, and it's a corpse, and I don't see many people thrilled at the idea of a Northeast legislature even when given the opportunity. You keep pointing to regional legislatures or the Mideast Assembly in particular as great examples of regional excellence, and I don't see it.

Max/Lief's idea of 10 national Senate seats and the 5-seat Council of Governors as an Upper House is a perfectly reasonable idea that keeps within the current framework, spurs competition for Governor and Lt. Governor (which will now be much more important positions), and generally makes things a bit more exciting and competitive.

But despite what I just said, I don't think there's any way you can somehow stimulate more activity in any long-term way. Activity comes and goes, people come and go. At the end of the day we either abolish regions and go all out with the reform some people here have wanted since day one, or we stick with what we have and tinker a bit. Creating some retarded bastard child proposal like this is not going to do anything but change the system just for the hell of it.

I will never understand your obsession with complicating literally everything and trying to mold and twist every reasonable idea into something unrecognizable. I remember criticizing you for the same thing when we started this "game reform" crusade, and here we are, arguing over the same unnecessary BS as day one.

[Marokai Backbeat]

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I'm not arguing against regional legislatures, if people want to create them that's all well and good, my point is that they usually end up as just a collection of bench warmers hogging up offices. As you say, people aren't bumbling idiots, they can figure these things out by reading, or participating in legislatures of the Pacific's style.

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What in the hell is the point of changing these things then? More than half my problem with this proposal is because it's change for change's sake. If you're creating a 9-seat House elected through some means by the regions, why not just stick to the 5-Seat CoG idea which would spur, in theory, competition for Governor and Lt. Governor from the five regions (10 seats total) without changing any offices for some funky reason? You're just shuffling around offices for no reason. Why can't you just settle for a solution that's been hovering out there for awhile now? It's baffling.

Just let regions create legislatures or assemblies however they want, or not at all, who cares. All they end up as is a bunch of bench warmers passing pointless legislation anyhow. People can still orient themselves to the game without creating an unnecessary second house.

[Marokai Backbeat]

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What in the hell is the point of changing these things then? More than half my problem with this proposal is because it's change for change's sake. If you're creating a 9-seat House elected through some means by the regions, why not just stick to the 5-Seat CoG idea which would spur, in theory, competition for Governor and Lt. Governor from the five regions (10 seats total) without changing any offices for some funky reason? You're just shuffling around offices for no reason. Why can't you just settle for a solution that's been hovering out there for awhile now? It's baffling.

Just let regions create legislatures or assemblies however they want, or not at all, who cares. All they end up as is a bunch of bench warmers passing pointless legislation anyhow. People can still orient themselves to the game without creating an unnecessary second house.

The reason I have gone towards this body and away from a CoG is because of the taboo associated with the CoG, making this proposal more viable. This also forces the regions to reform, which a CoG fails to do.

So basically you just want your proposal passed instead? Also, as I said, I think forcing the regions to do anything is a bad idea and I'd rather abolish regional government entirely than start dictating how everything is going to be laid out.

[Marokai Backbeat]

I do not support a senseless House of Representatives in any shape or form. Nay on that one.

As for 10 national senators, that I do support. Aye.

[Marokai Backbeat]

Regardless of whether people care about this Convention anymore, I will let those who appear to vote run the show from here on out. Both amendments pass.

Wow, I should try to get you removed as Presiding Officer for that.

[Marokai Backbeat]

Regardless of whether people care about this Convention anymore, I will let those who appear to vote run the show from here on out. Both amendments pass.

Wow, I should try to get you removed as Presiding Officer for that.

For letting those who care enough to vote be heard and disregarding those who do not show up? I thought that is the way democracy works.

Three. Votes.

[Marokai Backbeat]

It's still three freaking votes, there's a reason I haven't paid attention to this convention, and it's because of stuff like that. (And the people who vote on them. The no-regions folk are overrepresented here, and you're not bringing up alternative ideas for discussion. There's a ton of opposition to these ideas, and it's gotten to the point no one even acknowledges what in the hell goes on outside this ConCon.)

I've never seen something so completely absurd in my life. This isn't a constitutional convention anymore, this is the "Purple State Has A Grand Idea!" show, Come one! Come all!, and we're just here to tinker with your previously failed proposals.

[Marokai Backbeat]

I don't think we should be debating proposals in depth until the ConCon and when we get there we should do it very slowly and patiently to get it right.

I look forward to your perfect plan.

I thank the disgraced former attorney general and convicted criminal for his opinions on my irrelevant past comments.

[Marokai Backbeat]

I'm not bringing up a damn thing in this sham of a "Convention" so long as you preside over it. You already know where I stand.

I brought up a proposal that played a part in sparking this glorious grand-standing of yours. Ignored. I tried to alter one of the proposals on the floor like what was done to Presidential Universalism. Ignored. I said I supported a previously ignored idea that Max and Lief supported. I too, was ignored. You have demonstrated no interest in listening to anything that doesn't fit your preconceived notions on what constitutes reform, and remain stubbornly in support of ideas the Senate loudly rejected just weeks ago.

And now you're ignoring your own rules and allowing amendments to pass with just two votes in favor of it. You ought to be thrown out of this place.