Confederacy wins war

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

How do you make colores defy lines on your maps?

[Antonio the Sixth]

How do you make colores defy lines on your maps?

These maps are hand-made (with Paint) and then uploaded on the forum's gallery.

[Mr. Morden]

This TL is great.  Have you planned out how far in time you're going to take it yet?

[Antonio the Sixth]

This TL is great.  Have you planned out how far in time you're going to take it yet?

Well, I'm hoping to make it go until modern days (ie 2008 election or 2010 midterms), but I don't know how much time it will take me to reach this point.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

This TL is great.  Have you planned out how far in time you're going to take it yet?

Well, I'm hoping to make it go until modern days (ie 2008 election or 2010 midterms), but I don't know how much time it will take me to reach this point.

Well, given that you've covered from the Civil War to World War II in only six pages (some timelines take above ten pages, or into the thirties or forties), if you take the perspective of a historian more than focusing on each individual race, you could have this wrapped up by twelve pages.

[Antonio the Sixth]

This TL is great.  Have you planned out how far in time you're going to take it yet?

Well, I'm hoping to make it go until modern days (ie 2008 election or 2010 midterms), but I don't know how much time it will take me to reach this point.

Well, given that you've covered from the Civil War to World War II in only six pages (some timelines take above ten pages, or into the thirties or forties), if you take the perspective of a historian more than focusing on each individual race, you could have this wrapped up by twelve pages.

Well, when I started this TL I planned to make only a short one, but since I resumed it a couple of month ago I've made significantly more substantial updates, and they can only keep getting more so. Thus, I think we could easily reach 20 or 30 pages.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

Antonio, I have a  couple questions about you JFK Lives timeline, which, when that was going on, I wasn't on the forum to comment on, though it was interesting:

1) Why did you make Reagan win re-election but lose the popular vote?

2) Why, after sixteen years of Republicans, were they not more dominant after the Reagan era? The only Republican you had elected between 1988 and 2008 was Jeb Bush for one term.

3) How was Dean so popular as a President? From what I've heard, he was one of the most Liberal of all the Democrats running in 2004.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Well, consider that I was almost a newbie when I started this. I've learnt so much in past two years that looking back at what I've written back then is pretty funny.

I have some difficulties reminding my choices, but here could be some explanations :
- By 1980, the economy was in a very bad shape (pretty much like IRL), so despite Reagan's charisma, he got most of the blame for this situation. Eventually, he ran a campaign strong enough to get a narrow EV win, but Ted Kennedy's challenge was also stong enough to gain a pluraliy of vore.
- Precisely the fact that republicans had ruled the country for 16 years probly led to some fatigue that favored Democrats in the 1988-2008 period. Still, the democrats have never kept the White House for 3 terms since 1972, contrary to republicans.
- Well, popularity isn't always correlated to moderation, look at FDR, LBJ or Reagan (or Obama as a reverse example). And remember that 9/11 occurred during his 1st term, so he benefitted from the "rally around the flag" and managed to exploit it better than Bush did.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

About Dean: This is just a nitpick, but people generally credit Reagan with re-aligning America to the right. In this, however, it's more of Reagn's secodn term and Bush's first term. I'm just wondering if those two terms would have the same affect on America from 1988-on, and apparently not because Dean got elected in 2000. That's all that I'm saying.

[Antonio the Sixth]

About Dean: This is just a nitpick, but people generally credit Reagan with re-aligning America to the right. In this, however, it's more of Reagn's secodn term and Bush's first term. I'm just wondering if those two terms would have the same affect on America from 1988-on, and apparently not because Dean got elected in 2000. That's all that I'm saying.

Well, it's not like Dean was unelectable even in RL. I think he was initially favored to win the 2004 Dem primary, and had he won it I think he would have stood a fair chance of defeating Bush. While he's generally seen as a liberal, he's not a Kucinich-type fail candidate.

[Mr. Morden]

Dean's liberal image sprang mostly from his anti-war stance.  In contrast to Kerry, Gephardt, Edwards, and Lieberman, he was against the Iraq War from the beginning.  Aside from Iraq, there wasn't really much difference between him and Kerry on the issues.

[GeorgiaSenator]

If Confederacy wins war who would be the candidates for President after Jefferson Davis?

[Antonio the Sixth]

If Confederacy wins war who would be the candidates for President after Jefferson Davis?

Read the TL and you'll know it.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

Will this continue? I liked it and I want to see politics develop after an Allied Victory in World War II.

I like how the Left-Right alignment of the parties that we know today comes about much earlier because the Democrats collapse without the South. This, apparently, results in the rise of the Progressives (Liberal/Left), thus polarizing the Republicans at the other end of the spectrum (Conservative/Right). In real life, within the last eighty or so years, the alignment of the parties only became permanent sometime between the New Deal and the 1980's. Even then, Conservative Democrats and Liberal Republicans still had a chance until around 1976/1980.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

After re-reading the "JFK Lives" part, I have a couple more questions:

It appears that Powell is Vice-President twice, and Secretary of Defense at least once. What is the history of Colin Powell in office? Is he national security adviser for George Bush, does he work for Gore as Secretary of State?

How does Dean win with Nader eating up 8% of the vote? And how does Nader joepardize Republicans? Why does Nader gain so much traction when Dean's running?

I also like the idea that the Republicans nominate Buchanan as a sacrifice candidate in 1992. I once had a timeline in my head that diverged in 1972, and resulted in Buchanan winning the nomination in 2000 and losing to Lieberman in the general.

I also just noticed that it says in 1972 that RFK runs as an Indepenent, however, he's not mentioned at all in the election results. Did you write that then forget it?

[LastVoter]

bump, you should update this, me and Mecha were having an argument over successful confederacy on IRC.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

Don't forget to mention the guy that link you to it, **Ahem**.

[H.E. VOLODYMYR ZELENKSYY]

I just read through the entire thing.

UPDATE!!!!!!!!!!

[Simfan34]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks the CSA would have degenerated into a cesspool of juntas and coups and authoritarian regimes.

[Dereich]

You know, I would have assumed it was the Republicans who would collapse with a Confederate victory. After all, it would mean the Democratic copperheads were justified in wanting to negotiate a peace and the Republicans would be tainted with losing the south.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

You know, I would have assumed it was the Republicans who would collapse with a Confederate victory. After all, it would mean the Democratic copperheads were justified in wanting to negotiate a peace and the Republicans would be tainted with losing the south.

That's sort of a debate for me. On the one hand, the Democrats lose their most reliable region. On the other, Republicans are the ones to blame for losing the war and being seen as too radical. Although I would hazard to guess that post-Civil War industrial expansion would have played into Republicans' favor.