Mideast Assembly Thread

[Badger]

Since the Mideast is also creating a budget process, I invite citizens of this fine region to explore some of the cool US federal budget sims I posted in a thread on the Economics board.
https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=122358.0

Try your hand at creating an ideal budget and share your results. I believe these sims can give us an idea of what works and what doesn't in making Atlasian (federal and regional) budgets workable and a fun source of debate over taxes, spending and deficits.

Give it a shot--its actually fun for political addicts like us!

[California8429]

Since the Mideast is also creating a budget process, I invite citizens of this fine region to explore some of the cool US federal budget sims I posted in a thread on the Economics board.
https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=122358.0

Try your hand at creating an ideal budget and share your results. I believe these sims can give us an idea of what works and what doesn't in making Atlasian (federal and regional) budgets workable and a fun source of debate over taxes, spending and deficits.

Give it a shot--its actually fun for political addicts like us!

I tried them out. Thank you for putting everything together into one piece

[tmthforu94]

Since the Mideast is also creating a budget process, I invite citizens of this fine region to explore some of the cool US federal budget sims I posted in a thread on the Economics board.
https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=122358.0

Try your hand at creating an ideal budget and share your results. I believe these sims can give us an idea of what works and what doesn't in making Atlasian (federal and regional) budgets workable and a fun source of debate over taxes, spending and deficits.

Give it a shot--its actually fun for political addicts like us!

Thanks for posting this, Badger. I have a feeling I'll be spending a lot of time today playing with this now.

[California8429]

Does this silence mean you all are okay with the Infrastructure part? If so, moving on.

[tmthforu94]

I'm pretty good with the Infrastructure portion. A-Bob, if I may ask, how did you come up with these numbers?

[California8429]

I'm pretty good with the Infrastructure portion. A-Bob, if I may ask, how did you come up with these numbers?

Virginia. And then considered how many more states we had. It's pretty hard since we are neither a state nor federal government to look off of either budget

[tmthforu94]

I'm pretty good with the Infrastructure portion. A-Bob, if I may ask, how did you come up with these numbers?

Virginia. And then considered how many more states we had. It's pretty hard since we are neither a state nor federal government to look off of either budget

If possible, do you think you could provide me with a link to where you got Virginia's budget? Or possibly just the numbers there? Thank you.

[California8429]

I'm pretty good with the Infrastructure portion. A-Bob, if I may ask, how did you come up with these numbers?

Virginia. And then considered how many more states we had. It's pretty hard since we are neither a state nor federal government to look off of either budget

If possible, do you think you could provide me with a link to where you got Virginia's budget? Or possibly just the numbers there? Thank you.

http://dpb.virginia.gov/budget/budget.cfm

[Barnes]

The infrastructure section seems fine to me.

[California8429]

The infrastructure section seems fine to me.

Since education has always been a big priority with this Assembly, shall we do this next?

[Barnes]

The infrastructure section seems fine to me.

Since education has always been a big priority with this Assembly, shall we do this next?

Certainly.

[California8429]

Well I don't have anything planned, but let's start throwing out ideas.

Starting teacher salary $40,000? Are we going to base salaries merit-based, by experience or or both?
"Small" classes (K-12) let's aim for 20-25
How much would up to date books and technology cost?

[Barnes]

Well I don't have anything planned, but let's start throwing out ideas.

Starting teacher salary $40,000?

Fine with me.

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I'm interested in a combined system.

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Also fine with me. However, we should aim for something like 15-19 for K-2, perhaps.

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I'm not sure. I guess it depends on how much you want to buy? Everything new?

[California8429]

$40,000 seems like a good start. And if someone, perhaps you Barnes can make up some system where we reward merit, experience and college education while making sure those in urban settings with tough conditions don't lose tenure just because they have bad kids. I think that's fair if we can draw it up. $40,000-$60,000.

K-12 15-20 sounds good.

Maybe we can completly replace everything over two budgets so we'll buy half things new this time around, half next time and then have a dramatic decrease in education for a while.

Anything else we should cover?

[Barnes]

How about, 25% of pay is based on experience, 35% is based on degree of education, and 40% is based on merit?

I'm not great with numbers, so you can draw up the specifics, A-Bob.

I'd also suggest replacing all school equipment in districts that are close to, or below, the poverty line first.

[tmthforu94]

My suggestion: 40% based on experience, 35% based on degree of education, and 25% based on merit. Basically, the opposite of yours, Barnes. If we make salaries based more on how their students perform and less on experience or degree, teachers are going to flee currently failing schools because if they stay there, their salary would drop.

I'm going to try and look up some information on how much money states within the Mideast spend each year on education.

Something I just thought of: We're passing a budget basically every four months. Are we considering every four months to be a year or four years? I'm a bit lost on that, so some clarification would be greatly appreciated.

[Barnes]

My suggestion: 40% based on experience, 35% based on degree of education, and 25% based on merit. Basically, the opposite of yours, Barnes. If we make salaries based more on how their students perform and less on experience or degree, teachers are going to flee currently failing schools because if they stay there, their salary would drop.

Just because a teacher has been teaching a long time doesn't mean they're a good teacher...

[tmthforu94]

My suggestion: 40% based on experience, 35% based on degree of education, and 25% based on merit. Basically, the opposite of yours, Barnes. If we make salaries based more on how their students perform and less on experience or degree, teachers are going to flee currently failing schools because if they stay there, their salary would drop.

Just because a teacher has been teaching a long time doesn't mean they're a good teacher...

I know that. But I also don't think we should be punishing a teacher just because s/he is in a failing school.

[Barnes]

My suggestion: 40% based on experience, 35% based on degree of education, and 25% based on merit. Basically, the opposite of yours, Barnes. If we make salaries based more on how their students perform and less on experience or degree, teachers are going to flee currently failing schools because if they stay there, their salary would drop.

Just because a teacher has been teaching a long time doesn't mean they're a good teacher...

I know that. But I also don't think we should be punishing a teacher just because s/he is in a failing school.

Well, first off, I believe they're pay should be calculated based on the success of their students, not the school at large. Further more, 40%, while a large portion, is somewhat outweighed by experience and education combined.

[tmthforu94]

My suggestion: 40% based on experience, 35% based on degree of education, and 25% based on merit. Basically, the opposite of yours, Barnes. If we make salaries based more on how their students perform and less on experience or degree, teachers are going to flee currently failing schools because if they stay there, their salary would drop.

Just because a teacher has been teaching a long time doesn't mean they're a good teacher...

I know that. But I also don't think we should be punishing a teacher just because s/he is in a failing school.

Well, first off, I believe they're pay should be calculated based on the success of their students, not the school at large. Further more, 40%, while a large portion, is somewhat outweighed by experience and education combined.

Rewarding teachers based on the grades their students get will cause many teachers giving their students higher grades than they deserve just so they can get a better salary. They won't try and challenge their students, because if they do, their grades may drops which would result in a salary drop. Teachers would be handing out A's left and right.

[Barnes]

My suggestion: 40% based on experience, 35% based on degree of education, and 25% based on merit. Basically, the opposite of yours, Barnes. If we make salaries based more on how their students perform and less on experience or degree, teachers are going to flee currently failing schools because if they stay there, their salary would drop.

Just because a teacher has been teaching a long time doesn't mean they're a good teacher...

I know that. But I also don't think we should be punishing a teacher just because s/he is in a failing school.

Well, first off, I believe they're pay should be calculated based on the success of their students, not the school at large. Further more, 40%, while a large portion, is somewhat outweighed by experience and education combined.

Rewarding teachers based on the grades their students get will cause many teachers giving their students higher grades than they deserve just so they can get a better salary. They won't try and challenge their students, because if they do, their grades may drops which would result in a salary drop. Teachers would be handing out A's left and right.

Please, while that possibility does exist, I doubt it would ever lead to the extreme you think it would. Also, the teacher or teachers doing that would swiftly be fired. And, if you don't think that the punishment would be implemented, we could easily put it in as a provision in the budget.

[tmthforu94]

Please, while that possibility does exist, I doubt it would ever lead to the extreme you think it would. Also, the teacher or teachers doing that would swiftly be fired. And, if you don't think that the punishment would be implemented, we could easily put it in as a provision in the budget.

I actually just had a conversation with my mother over this. Why not get advice from a teacher?

"Mom, if a law was implemented where your salary was based on student performance don't you think many teachers would boost their students grades and not challenge them because they won't want to risk having a salary cut?"
"Of course teachers would. Teachers would stop challenging their students to succeed and wouldn't grade as hard as they normally would."

I know this isn't a perfect example, but I'm just trying to show you that it would exist. I'd have a very hard time agreeing with this portion of the budget with the percentages you suggested, to be honest.

Another issue: Sometimes teachers get stuck with a bad class. Last year, 6 of the 12 students in my Mom's class had IEP's. Why should she be slapped with a salary cut for that?

[California8429]

Please, while that possibility does exist, I doubt it would ever lead to the extreme you think it would. Also, the teacher or teachers doing that would swiftly be fired. And, if you don't think that the punishment would be implemented, we could easily put it in as a provision in the budget.

I actually just had a conversation with my mother over this. Why not get advice from a teacher?

"Mom, if a law was implemented where your salary was based on student performance don't you think many teachers would boost their students grades and not challenge them because they won't want to risk having a salary cut?"
"Of course teachers would. Teachers would stop challenging their students to succeed and wouldn't grade as hard as they normally would."

I know this isn't a perfect example, but I'm just trying to show you that it would exist. I'd have a very hard time agreeing with this portion of the budget with the percentages you suggested, to be honest.

Another issue: Sometimes teachers get stuck with a bad class. Last year, 6 of the 12 students in my Mom's class had IEP's. Why should she be slapped with a salary cut for that?

exactly my thinking. I think there shoul be SOME portion of a salary based on merit, but I like the Governor's numbers better.

[Barnes]

Well, then perhaps we should make merit pay the middle percentage?

[California8429]

How about 38% based on experience, 32% based on degree of education, and 30% based on merit for compromise?