1972: With a Twist
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  Talk Elections
  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion
  Election What-ifs?
  Past Election What-ifs (US) (Moderator: Dereich)
  1972: With a Twist
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Author Topic: 1972: With a Twist  (Read 911 times)
Robespierre's Jaw
Senator Conor Flynn
Junior Chimp
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Posts: 8,129
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« on: August 06, 2008, 05:31:58 AM »

Highly Unlikely. However I wanted to see how you would interpret this 1972 Scenario.

In November 1969, President Richard Nixon dismisses claims that Operation Duck Hook will fail upon it's launch in early 1970. With the President's decision to launch Duck Hook in November 1969. Upon the President's decision to go ahead of Duck Hook, both Secretary of State Rogers and Secretary of Defence Laird resign their positions in late November 1969 due to their disagreements with the President.

In March 1970, Operation Duck Hook is launched when the United States begin bombarding Hanoi and surrounding areas in North Vietnam vital to both North Vietnam economically and militarily. Despite early signs of the Operation working on the ground, public opinion about President Nixon's handling of the War drastically turns against him and his Administration in mid 1970, thus leading to increased antiwar protests across the United States and condemnation from the Democratic controlled Congress.

With the signs of failure ever present throughout early 1971 and no sign of victory on the American side, President Nixon decides to drop an atomic bomb on Hanoi to conclude the Vietnam War (The use of Nuclear Weapons in Operation Duck Hook was actually considered by President Nixon and the NSC). Shortly after the atomic bombing of Hanoi in mid 1971, North Vietnamese President Ton Duc Thang finally gives into the Administration's demands for Peace. The Peace, which heavily favours South Vietnam and their President Nguyễn Văn Thiệu. The President's move to drop the bomb, plummets significantly.

Come the 1972 Presidential Election, President Nixon is challenged for the 1972 Republican Nomination by liberal Congressman Pete McCloskey of California. Although McCloskey performs better than in RL, McCloskey's liberal candidate is not enough to prevent President Nixon from winning the Nomination. At the Convention, President Nixon and Vice President Agnew are nominated unanimously.

On the Democratic side, South Dakota Senator George McGovern is nominated on the first ballot after running on a liberal campaign denouncing President Nixon's actions in 1971. At the Convention, Senator McGovern is nominated on the first ballot and Missouri Senator Thomas Eagleton is selected as his running mate.

How does the 1972 Presidential Election change? Does McGovern win in 1972?

Discuss with maps.
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Robespierre's Jaw
Senator Conor Flynn
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,129
Political Matrix
E: -4.90, S: -8.35

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« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2008, 04:42:51 PM »

BUMP

Wow! Am I surprised at the amount of maps posted in this thread thus far.

I'll post an Electoral College map of my own probably tomorrow, as now, before school is the only time I'll be able to use the internet today. You can thank my Dad's 43rd Birthday for that Smiley.
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PBrunsel
Junior Chimp
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« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2008, 05:00:15 PM »

This scenario bodes for far more then the 1972 Election, Rockefeller Republican, the ramifications of allowing Operation Duck Hook could have led to World War III. The usage of mines in Haiphong Harbor, the expansion of the war into the North and the usage of an atomic bomb without a major North Vietnamese offensive would destroy America’s “moral standing” in the war, if it ever had any to begin with.

The man in charge of arranging Operation Duck Hook, Captain Rembrandt C. Robinson, had warned the Joint Chiefs of Staff in January 1969 that an operation like “Duck Hook” would destroy the image of the U.S. as peaceful liberators of South Vietnam, and more like belligerent destroyers of the North. However, had Duck Hook been embraced by Nixon-Kissinger, then the whole character of the war would change dramatically. The mining of Haiphong Harbor would have happened before the massive North Vietnamese Easter Offensive in 1972 when the war was seen as a battle for South Vietnam and not against the North Vietnamese. Nixon’s statement, “The greatest title history can bestow is the title of ‘peace maker’,” would have been seen as a joke by the world community, and thus Kissinger’s “Shuttle Diplomacy” and “Ping-Pong Diplomacy” and what have you diplomacy with China would never have happened.

Secondly, Captain Robinson warned that the “nuclear option” could spark off a war with the Soviets. While we can never be sure if Nixon wanted to use the atomic bomb on Hanoi, in your scenario he does. You can be sure Brezhnev would not have taken this sitting down. After all, Hanoi was filled with Soviet “military advisors” and weapons, a destruction of these people and supplies could be seen as an act of war. Especially after an “unprovoked” mining of Haiphong Harbor, where Soviet ships were harbored, an attack on Hanoi could have provoked World War III. “We’re walking on atomic eggshells,” was one comment Nixon had told Melvin Laird in 1969, and he was right. While an atomic bomb may have ended the Vietnam War, it very well could have begun the Third World War.

As for the 1972 Election, Nixon would not be as dead of a duck as he may seem. After all, blue collar America would still be with him. “Nixon got the Commies” is what the Archie Bunkers would be saying, and these New Deal Democrats were who Nixon had to win to beat the New Leftist George McGovern. Without Nixon in China, McGovern would have been able to paint him as a flip-flopper on peace in Vietnam, but in the end it was Nixon who brought the Vietnam War to a close, even if it meant dropping an atomic bomb. In short, a Scoop Jackson, Hubert Humphrey, Reuben Askew, Vance Hartke, Terry Sanford, Wilbur Mills or even George Wallace nomination could have won the White House for the Democrats, but McGovern just isn’t presidential timber. Nixon’s win is underwhelming and unimpressive, as the Democrats gain more than 65-seats in the Senate and come close to a 2/3rds majority in the House:

 


Richard Nixon/Spiro Agnew (R): 337 EV; 53.6% of the PV
George McGovern/Thomas Eagleton (D): 201 EV;  43.4% of the PV     
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Robespierre's Jaw
Senator Conor Flynn
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,129
Political Matrix
E: -4.90, S: -8.35

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« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2008, 05:03:16 PM »

Thanks for your feedback PBrunsel Smiley

I know that President Nixon launching Operation Duck Hook in 1971 to end the Vietnam War would be highly unplausible but I wanted to see how my fellow forumites would interpret such an "out there" scenario. Once again thanks PBrunsel.
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