opinion of Barack Obama

[exopolitician]

overall positive.

he seems like a decent fellow and im sure he has good intentions.

however, i am not 'inspired' by him...nor do i think a president has to be or even should be 'inspiring'.  that is fantasy land type stuff.

my problem isnt with obama it is with his supporters and the media.  their obsession with him has gotten out of hand.  i fear it will be a hard fall from grace for obama when everyone suddenly realizes he is....human.

Last week you were railing against him for (shock horror) taking a day off from the campaign.

On Valentines Day of all days....how scandalous!

[Duke 🇺🇸]

Great thread. I don't think he's a freedom fighter, but I don't view him as a horrible person. He's just too much of a liberal idealist to be a good President. I know no one here will understand that, as most view him as the second coming. However, I don't think he can win a general election against a moderate McCain. He's just too left wing. I don't think people want the government forcing them to do community service.

[Duke 🇺🇸]

For the record, I would classify his cult following as mostly horrible people.

[Bacon King]

I don't think people want the government forcing them to do community service.

You're horribly misconstruing his position.

He says he'd offer extra scholarship money to students who do community service; how is this in any way at all forced?

[TheGlobalizer]

patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings.

tell me honestly, WHY should one be PROUD to be an American?  And what exactly does it even mean?

does it mean that we as people are BETTER than people from other countries?

does it mean that we want the best for the country?

does it mean we love our country more than we love our family?

does it mean we love our country more than we feel affinity for our religion?

does it mean we will blindly support our leaders regardless of what they do?

honestly, i want to know.

I'm proud to be an American because I believe in the Constitution and what this country has, historically, stood for (land of opportunity, personal liberty and freedoms, all that).

Bush's fake-ass patriotism (arrogance, security/military focus) makes it hard to be particularly vocal about it, though.

[Boris]

Hard to say, really. He's obviously far more tolerable than his competitors, but some of his supporters irk me. Though not as bad as Hillary supporters (some of the comments on her blog are laughably retarded. The same is true about the Obama and McCain blogs, but not to the extent of Hillary's.). In terms of supporters, I have to say that I like McCain's the best. They seem to be the least annoying and slightly more realistic about their candidate's chances.

Overall leaning to FF, but he better not become another Jimmy Carter or George W. Bush upon inauguration. I don't really care if he moves to the 'right' or to the 'left' (as he'll inevitably do, depending upon the electoral climate) throughout his Presidency, but hopefully he'll be semi-competent at his job.

[Math]

He bored me, with his flimsy speeches.
I'm French, and last year we have had a presidential election. Obama remind me of socialist candidate Ségolène Royal : she delivered only vague and conventional speeches, no innovative ideas...

And 47%, it doesn't suffice to be elected, as well in the US as in France.

[Michael Z]

These are obviously ridiculous labels.

But Obama, other than lacking experience and -- how do I put this without Democrats jumping on me? I probably can't -- not being a patriotic person, just rubs me the wrong way. Having just listened to about an hour of the audiobook Audacity of Hope, he feels like a sardonic elitist who takes life as a cosmic joke. No, thank you.

Not being a patriotic person? How?

Am I a patriotic person?

So here are my thoughts on this.

Obama gratuitously bashed wearing a flag lapel.

Obama's wife is proud of her country for the first time in her adult life.

Obama was raised abroad. I know people who have grown up in multiple countries. Quite often, they lack firm national identities and become what one book I read calls "TCK's", Third Culture Kids.

Obama gives off a vibe that he's a "citizen of the world" and that he'll give the benefit of the doubt to other cultures'/nationalities' interpretation of the U.S. and other things. Not quite a blame-America-firster (I hope, though the Mrs. may be), but still extremely disturbing.

I'm sorry. The American president needs to be a proud American. With JFK, that was never in doubt. I'm not sold on this guy.

So a patriot is only someone who fits your own narrow, personal definition of a patriot. Got it.

[Aizen]

That patriotic comment was dumb

I voted freedom fighter. He's the candidate I've been supporting since February but some of his supporters are really griding my gears. They are reflecting poorly upon him by making him seem like some cult leader.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Obama's wife is proud of her country for the first time in her adult life.

The right-wing propaganda outfits, also known as the media, edited out the word "really".

[Erc]

Obama was raised abroad. I know people who have grown up in multiple countries. Quite often, they lack firm national identities and become what one book I read calls "TCK's", Third Culture Kids.

To rebut your anecdote with one of my own...

I was raised in multiple countries overseas myself...first in Britain and then in Singapore.  Some of the most "patriotic" people are ex-pats.  They've lived in places where America and the things she stands for can't be taken for granted, and that makes them more appreciative of them--far more 'patriotic,' at least in my sense of the term.

Do I still have a special affinity for Britain?  Sure.  Does that make me any less of an American?  Absolutely not.

And in Obama's case, I somehow doubt he's exactly pining for Indonesia.

[Duke 🇺🇸]

These are obviously ridiculous labels.

But Obama, other than lacking experience and -- how do I put this without Democrats jumping on me? I probably can't -- not being a patriotic person, just rubs me the wrong way. Having just listened to about an hour of the audiobook Audacity of Hope, he feels like a sardonic elitist who takes life as a cosmic joke. No, thank you.

Not being a patriotic person? How?

Am I a patriotic person?

So here are my thoughts on this.

Obama gratuitously bashed wearing a flag lapel.

Obama's wife is proud of her country for the first time in her adult life.

Obama was raised abroad. I know people who have grown up in multiple countries. Quite often, they lack firm national identities and become what one book I read calls "TCK's", Third Culture Kids.

Obama gives off a vibe that he's a "citizen of the world" and that he'll give the benefit of the doubt to other cultures'/nationalities' interpretation of the U.S. and other things. Not quite a blame-America-firster (I hope, though the Mrs. may be), but still extremely disturbing.

I'm sorry. The American president needs to be a proud American. With JFK, that was never in doubt. I'm not sold on this guy.

So a patriot is only someone who fits your own narrow, personal definition of a patriot. Got it.

Then what is patriot to you? Back up statements with some substance. I know Obama supporters aren't used to hearing or doing that.

That comment did piss me off yesterday. No doubt JFK loved his country, as does McCain. He was tortured in Vietnam for his country. Obama didn't live here much of his life and now his wife tells us she is only proud of it today for the first time in her adult like because we are embracing her and her husband. He doesn't wear the flag pin because of some ideological disagreement.

And yes, most people I have met who lived abroad were not as loving of the United States as people who lived here are. I'm sorry our definitions of patriotism do not match. Someone who refuses to wear the flag pin out of protest is sort of a little b**ch move, in my opinion..

[Bacon King]

Then what is patriot to you? Back up statements with some substance. I know Obama supporters aren't used to hearing or doing that.

Look, I'm sorry for being rude, but why don't you back your allegations with some sort of substance? You can't say Obama is unpatriotic just because he spent first grade in another country, because he doesn't wear a certain piece of jewelery, or because of something his wife was misquoted as saying. Such reasoning is just shallow and pointless.

Considering that the man's beliefs are entirely based in doing what he thinks is best for America, only some sort of hack would assume he doesn't love his country. The burden of proof is on you to somehow show he's unpatriotic, which you haven't really done at all.

[Duke 🇺🇸]

Then what is patriot to you? Back up statements with some substance. I know Obama supporters aren't used to hearing or doing that.

Look, I'm sorry for being rude, but why don't you back your allegations with some sort of substance? You can't say Obama is unpatriotic just because he spent first grade in another country, because he doesn't wear a certain piece of jewelery, or because of something his wife was misquoted as saying. Such reasoning is just shallow and pointless.

Considering that the man's beliefs are entirely based in doing what he thinks is best for America, only some sort of hack would assume he doesn't love his country. The burden of proof is on you to somehow show he's unpatriotic, which you haven't really done at all.

Wife was misquoted? She was shown on TV saying it. How is that being misquoted?

[Хahar 🤔]

Then what is patriot to you? Back up statements with some substance. I know Obama supporters aren't used to hearing or doing that.

Look, I'm sorry for being rude, but why don't you back your allegations with some sort of substance? You can't say Obama is unpatriotic just because he spent first grade in another country, because he doesn't wear a certain piece of jewelery, or because of something his wife was misquoted as saying. Such reasoning is just shallow and pointless.

Considering that the man's beliefs are entirely based in doing what he thinks is best for America, only some sort of hack would assume he doesn't love his country. The burden of proof is on you to somehow show he's unpatriotic, which you haven't really done at all.

Wife was misquoted? She was shown on TV saying it. How is that being misquoted?

Can somebody tell me what "it" is?

[J. J.]

Neither. 

Has a lot of good qualities, intelligent, sincere, eloquent.

The question is both experience and how fast can he learn and react.  One thing I found that is troubling is that he has two clear chances to put Clinton away, NH and Super Tuesday, and he failed.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

FF, no doubt about it.

[Michael Z]

These are obviously ridiculous labels.

But Obama, other than lacking experience and -- how do I put this without Democrats jumping on me? I probably can't -- not being a patriotic person, just rubs me the wrong way. Having just listened to about an hour of the audiobook Audacity of Hope, he feels like a sardonic elitist who takes life as a cosmic joke. No, thank you.

Not being a patriotic person? How?

Am I a patriotic person?

So here are my thoughts on this.

Obama gratuitously bashed wearing a flag lapel.

Obama's wife is proud of her country for the first time in her adult life.

Obama was raised abroad. I know people who have grown up in multiple countries. Quite often, they lack firm national identities and become what one book I read calls "TCK's", Third Culture Kids.

Obama gives off a vibe that he's a "citizen of the world" and that he'll give the benefit of the doubt to other cultures'/nationalities' interpretation of the U.S. and other things. Not quite a blame-America-firster (I hope, though the Mrs. may be), but still extremely disturbing.

I'm sorry. The American president needs to be a proud American. With JFK, that was never in doubt. I'm not sold on this guy.

So a patriot is only someone who fits your own narrow, personal definition of a patriot. Got it.

Then what is patriot to you? Back up statements with some substance.

Why should I? I'm taking objection with M making hyperbolic statements and using his own personal definition for purposes of spin.

But just to indulge you, a patriot is someone who loves his country, as per the dictionary. Granted, what constitutes an act of love for your country is subjective, but I'm not gonna sit here and argue and bicker and pedantically nitpick a few things he's done or made whether or not he's patriotic, especially when the reasons as to why Obama should be seen as "unpatriotic" are really quite pathetically trivial, not to mention M seemingly getting "patriot" and "nationalist" mixed up.

[MODU]

Neither.  He's a great speaker with a populist message that, even though he is much more liberal than many of his followers know, he will be more willing to follow popularity polls rather than be tied to the far-left platform of the failed Congress.

[JSojourner]

Great thread. I don't think he's a freedom fighter, but I don't view him as a horrible person. He's just too much of a liberal idealist to be a good President. I know no one here will understand that, as most view him as the second coming. However, I don't think he can win a general election against a moderate McCain. He's just too left wing. I don't think people want the government forcing them to do community service.

I really appreciate that assessment.  I want a liberal President, so we would disagree.  But your response to Obama is measured, intelligent and kind -- while still maintaining your convictions.  This is the kind of rhetoric I aspire to.

I admit, however, I lose all semblance of objectivity when it comes to George W. Bush.

But McCain?  I love the guy.  I admire the guy.  I won't vote for him -- but I sure as hell respect and honor him.

Thanks for yet another solid, thought-provoking post.

[Bacon King]

Then what is patriot to you? Back up statements with some substance. I know Obama supporters aren't used to hearing or doing that.

Look, I'm sorry for being rude, but why don't you back your allegations with some sort of substance? You can't say Obama is unpatriotic just because he spent first grade in another country, because he doesn't wear a certain piece of jewelery, or because of something his wife was misquoted as saying. Such reasoning is just shallow and pointless.

Considering that the man's beliefs are entirely based in doing what he thinks is best for America, only some sort of hack would assume he doesn't love his country. The burden of proof is on you to somehow show he's unpatriotic, which you haven't really done at all.

Wife was misquoted? She was shown on TV saying it. How is that being misquoted?

First off, could you please respond to all of what I said rather than simply ignoring what you can't easily rebut? I'd like to at least understand where you're coming from here.

However, the exact quote by Michelle Obama:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Emphasis is my own. This isn't the first time she's proud of America, it's the first time she's really proud of it. For all you or I know, she may very well have been proud of the USA for her entire life, just not "really" proud of it up to this point. This really just boils down to semantics, and it's kind of silly to make an issue here that her husband isn't patriotic because of it.

[MasterJedi]

He seems like Jimmy Carter, a nice guy who meant well who really doesn't know what to do. He doesn't have experience (am predicting a bunch of "he has experience" here but 8 years as state senator =/= experience) and doesn't talk about concrete things that he will do very often, and when he does he just talks about it, not how he will do it.

[TheresNoMoney]

and doesn't talk about concrete things that he will do very often, and when he does he just talks about it, not how he will do it.

Does your man John McCain ever talk about concrete things he will do? I can't name any. The guy gets a total free pass when it comes to policy.

[Lief 🗽]

FF.

Also, oh noes at Obama being a worldly person! Clearly our next president needs to be a backwoods, ethnocentric redneck.

Obama's speech last night was very concrete, actually, more so than John "100 years in Iraq" McCain's speeches usually are.

[TheGlobalizer]

I don't see any problem with what Michelle Obama said, or with Barack's refusal to wear a flag pin.  Neither have anything to do with patriotism whatsoever, and if you think it does, you probably don't understand what patriotism is all about.