NBC: Biden to discuss future of campaign with family tomorrow

[TheTide]

The Machiavellian in me is thinking two further things:

1. Biden has been told, gently or otherwise, by aides and perhaps senior Democrats that he should step down. The family meeting arrangement makes it look less bad and more like a heartfelt decision, rather than one that has been forced upon him.  

2. Obama's statement declaring confidence in him (possibly more notable for what it didn't say than what it said) is his own way of not appearing to have any blood on his hands. Being seen as someone who ended the Presidency of his own Vice President probably isn't something that he wants the history books to note about him.  

[John Dule]

To be very clear, Harris is the nominee if Biden steps aside. Yes, the Democrats could get rid of her and suffer no consequences hypothetically, but it won't happen. It's ugly and horrible, but the one thing she has going for her is that all the age issues vanish immediately once she's the nominee. And any of her weird problems or gaffes will not hit the same as Biden's. Every time Biden appears to talk about Ted Kennedy as though he's still alive or forgets that Bob Kerrey hasn't been a Senator for 25 years is going to get an intense amount of media coverage. No amount of California issues or drunken rambling about coconut trees could do even a fraction of the damage to her campaign that any individual Biden senior moment will do if he tries to stay in.

The problem with this, and the reason I continue to think sticking with Biden is the better strategy (maybe 51 to 49 at this point), is that in the meantime Biden will still be president. Harris can hold however many events or rallies she likes, but so long as Biden continues to run the country in the meantime, a substantial amount of attention will be paid to the fact that the current president is non-functional. I think removing Biden from the ticket but not the presidency is a weak half-measure that combines the absolute worst of both worlds, and it will backfire. The only strategy worth discussing is this:

1. Biden voluntarily resigns and says he had a stroke five seconds before walking onstage.

2. Harris assumes the presidency and says she won’t run for reelection because she needs to focus on the job at hand.

3. They nominate some combination of Whitmer/Shapiro/Beshear at the convention and consolidate as fast as possible.

Trying to go halfway on this will not work— mark my words.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Manchin already retired

[Almost Anyone But Biden Or Trump (ABBoT but not Greg Abbott)]

Ultimately, I think the DNC is going to give him one final chance but they are going to take his campaign away from him. His campaign staff is going to be fired and replaced by party operatives and he is going to be managed by the insiders.

The DNC has no control over his campaign.  The DNC is a fundraising entity.

I don't mean specifically the DNC per se, but rather the "Dem party" and all its various factions and insiders.

The Dem Party and the Biden campaign are effectively the same thing. That's how parties work in Presidential campaigns.

[DaleCooper]

To be very clear, Harris is the nominee if Biden steps aside. Yes, the Democrats could get rid of her and suffer no consequences hypothetically, but it won't happen. It's ugly and horrible, but the one thing she has going for her is that all the age issues vanish immediately once she's the nominee. And any of her weird problems or gaffes will not hit the same as Biden's. Every time Biden appears to talk about Ted Kennedy as though he's still alive or forgets that Bob Kerrey hasn't been a Senator for 25 years is going to get an intense amount of media coverage. No amount of California issues or drunken rambling about coconut trees could do even a fraction of the damage to her campaign that any individual Biden senior moment will do if he tries to stay in.

The problem with this, and the reason I continue to think sticking with Biden is the better strategy (maybe 51 to 49 at this point), is that in the meantime Biden will still be president. Harris can hold however many events or rallies she likes, but so long as Biden continues to run the country in the meantime, a substantial amount of attention will be paid to the fact that the current president is non-functional. I think removing Biden from the ticket but not the presidency is a weak half-measure that combines the absolute worst of both worlds, and it will backfire. The only strategy worth discussing is this:

1. Biden voluntarily resigns and says he had a stroke five seconds before walking onstage.

2. Harris assumes the presidency and says she won’t run for reelection because she needs to focus on the job at hand.

3. They nominate some combination of Whitmer/Shapiro/Beshear at the convention and consolidate as fast as possible.

Trying to go halfway on this will not work— mark my words.

I'm not saying it will work, I'm just saying it's what will happen if Biden doesn't run for reelection and that the one advantage Harris has over Biden is more important than any advantage Biden has over Harris at this point.

[Fuzzy Bear]

To be very clear, Harris is the nominee if Biden steps aside. Yes, the Democrats could get rid of her and suffer no consequences hypothetically, but it won't happen. It's ugly and horrible, but the one thing she has going for her is that all the age issues vanish immediately once she's the nominee. And any of her weird problems or gaffes will not hit the same as Biden's. Every time Biden appears to talk about Ted Kennedy as though he's still alive or forgets that Bob Kerrey hasn't been a Senator for 25 years is going to get an intense amount of media coverage. No amount of California issues or drunken rambling about coconut trees could do even a fraction of the damage to her campaign that any individual Biden senior moment will do if he tries to stay in.

The problem with this, and the reason I continue to think sticking with Biden is the better strategy (maybe 51 to 49 at this point), is that in the meantime Biden will still be president. Harris can hold however many events or rallies she likes, but so long as Biden continues to run the country in the meantime, a substantial amount of attention will be paid to the fact that the current president is non-functional. I think removing Biden from the ticket but not the presidency is a weak half-measure that combines the absolute worst of both worlds, and it will backfire. The only strategy worth discussing is this:

1. Biden voluntarily resigns and says he had a stroke five seconds before walking onstage.

2. Harris assumes the presidency and says she won’t run for reelection because she needs to focus on the job at hand.

3. They nominate some combination of Whitmer/Shapiro/Beshear at the convention and consolidate as fast as possible.

Trying to go halfway on this will not work— mark my words.

I've actually thought of this exact plan myself.  Not the "stroke" part, but certainly Biden resigning, and Harris taking the job while not being the candidate for re-election.

Harris taking this "caretaker" road would accomplish rehabilitate her image which is not the image of as airhead who rose to the top by means other than merit (to put it kindly).  Harris is burdened with that very image, but accepting this "Caretaker" role while the nation is in crisis offers her the chance to be both SERIOUS.  Her refusal to run for election to her temporary position would allow her to appear UNSELFISH, especially if she works as a party leader to help someone else win.  The BEST thing that would happen for Kamala Harris would be for her to be seen as HELPING the Democratic ticket to where it loses by a hair (after being significantly behind) while doing well in downballot races, in that under THOSE circumstances she'd have serious IOUs for 2028 when she'd still be only 64.  And she would be, forevermore, the first Madam President and the first Female President of Color in history; she would never be forgotten on that basis alone.

I don't consider Kamala Harris to be "wise".  Indeed, she seems totally devoid of wisdom, and I don't think I'm alone in seeing her this way.  But this scenario could change this image.  A "New Harris" for 2028 would be as dramatic as a "New Nixon" in 1968.  Opportunity is knocking on her door, but not in the guise she wishes it were.  If she were to follow this course of action, it would be evidence that she had a teeny bit of wisdom after all.

[MillennialModerate]

It's not that I'm opposed to Biden dropping out, it's the irrational hate and childish mocking I have an issue with. The mean girl syndrome on here is real. Biden wasn't even my first choice in 2020, but I've never hated him like most people on this board do.

I don't think hatred of him is the general vibe.  I think most of us want to win and see that that won't happen with Biden, and a lot of people are also concerned about his fitness, political considerations aside.

We all knew the guy was old and rationalized that it just caused him to take a moment to gather his thoughts sometimes, but for Biden to show blatant signs of dementia on a night that the country frankly needed him to be alert is just next level. Everyone saw it with their own eyes. There's no going back from that.

It also says so much about Trump that millions of Biden voters saw the risk with his age deterioration for themselves and will still vote for him anyways.

I was pretty staunchly in the "he's fine" camp prior to the debate.  No longer.

This. That debate night did a 180 for me.

I’ve always loved Biden. He was my choice over Obama and Hillary in 08. I was pleading he would run in 16. And I was thrilled he won the nomination in 2020. But now it’s time….


My question is how does the party pull this off? Give me a Whitmer/Shapiro ticket.

[GAinDC]

Guys, the campaign released a video shutting down all speculation about this trip. They said it was planned well before the debate and Biden has no intention of dropping out. Biden’s going to be the nominee.

[NHI]

Guys, the campaign released a video shutting down all speculation about this trip. They said it was planned well before the debate and Biden has no intention of dropping out. Biden’s going to be the nominee.

It's truly sad.

[LBJer]

Guys, the campaign released a video shutting down all speculation about this trip. They said it was planned well before the debate and Biden has no intention of dropping out. Biden’s going to be the nominee.

What else are they going to say?

[GAinDC]

Guys, the campaign released a video shutting down all speculation about this trip. They said it was planned well before the debate and Biden has no intention of dropping out. Biden’s going to be the nominee.

What else are they going to say?

if these reports were even slightly accurate then they wouldn’t say anything….

[LBJer]

Guys, the campaign released a video shutting down all speculation about this trip. They said it was planned well before the debate and Biden has no intention of dropping out. Biden’s going to be the nominee.

What else are they going to say?

if these reports were even slightly accurate then they wouldn’t say anything….

No--you'd expect them to deny it.

[Open Source Intelligence]

The Machiavellian in me is thinking two further things:

1. Biden has been told, gently or otherwise, by aides and perhaps senior Democrats that he should step down. The family meeting arrangement makes it look less bad and more like a heartfelt decision, rather than one that has been forced upon him.  

2. Obama's statement declaring confidence in him (possibly more notable for what it didn't say than what it said) is his own way of not appearing to have any blood on his hands. Being seen as someone who ended the Presidency of his own Vice President probably isn't something that he wants the history books to note about him.  

It's one thing horrible about this era of politics is no one has the balls to be honest in public. Dean Phillips said what everyone was saying in private, he was shown this week to be right, and his political career is over. Obama can say and do whatever he wants with no fear of repercussions from most Democrats. He instead has Ben Rhodes and David Axelrod be noticeably anti-Biden.

If Obama called for Biden to resign publicly, it's not even a decision at that point is it? Either Biden would remove himself or the Democratic National Convention would change the rules and do it for him.

[DrScholl]

Guys, the campaign released a video shutting down all speculation about this trip. They said it was planned well before the debate and Biden has no intention of dropping out. Biden’s going to be the nominee.

More or less that is just the campaign not letting a narrative be set before any decisions are actually made. I can see exiting the race being on the table because family meetings being leaked is a big deal.

[axiomsofdominion]

Guys, the campaign released a video shutting down all speculation about this trip. They said it was planned well before the debate and Biden has no intention of dropping out. Biden’s going to be the nominee.

More or less that is just the campaign not letting a narrative be set before any decisions are actually made. I can see exiting the race being on the table because family meetings being leaked is a big deal.

I think all the people who never liked Biden see this as their shot to get rid of him. Which to be fair the debate was pretty bad, but generally stuff like this is because of longstanding grudges. I think people are vastly overstating the chance that Biden is going to step down based on off the record mudslinging and leaking from long time critics.

Just like how the NYT is well known to hate Biden and did a goofy double endorsement of Warren and Klobuchar in the 2020 primary, of course they put out a call for him to step down.

So many people are suddenly acting like political operatives aren't shady backstabbing scum  as well as often liars because right now the liars are saying what they want to hear.

[jaichind]

Guys, the campaign released a video shutting down all speculation about this trip. They said it was planned well before the debate and Biden has no intention of dropping out. Biden’s going to be the nominee.

More or less that is just the campaign not letting a narrative be set before any decisions are actually made. I can see exiting the race being on the table because family meetings being leaked is a big deal.

I agree.  Although I suspect any analysis of the situation will show that an alternative to Biden along with a questionable process to produce such an alternative pretty much means Biden saying in the race is the best way to beat Trump even of those chances have fallen since the debate.

[Red Velvet]

r/neoliberal is discussing this article and they sound totally Blue MAGA in the comments. Saying no way Biden should withdraw because it would be “the ultimate expression of failure and weakness,” calling NBC “fake news” because of phony Chuck Todd and Kristen Welker… These people have gone insane. How can they not see the irony???

When r/neoliberal and Democrats crazy hyperpartisans are saner than Atlas it’s indeed a reason for concern for this forum.

Anyway, either these news are true and Biden is already dropping out OR the mainstream media is trying to create a climate of defeat and weakness that pressures Biden to drop out, it’s unbelievable the amount of trash they’re throwing on him for basically nothing. If he’s not a wimp, he’ll stay and not bow down to those hidden forces.

As for trashing NBC; CNN and establishment media… that’s something Trumpists were always correct about even if for the wrong reasons. Democrats joining the choir only when it turns against them is the same ridiculous thing, but they also aren’t really wrong.

[ClassicElectionEnthusiast]

I wonder if Marianne Williamson is wishing she hadn't suspended her campaign (again) after the fallout from the last few days.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

Users need to get a grip I have been reading these threads. Biden is gonna perform the same way in the 2nd debate.

Go back to his 20 debates and his S and VP debates he wasn't overly aggressive. If Users want a different nominee just wait til 28 we will have a contested primary, stop saying Whitmer, she has not made any steps to become Prez

[axiomsofdominion]

I wonder if Marianne Williamson is wishing she hadn't suspended her campaign (again) after the fallout from the last few days.

No, because people *still* respect Biden more than her. She was never a serious candidate.

[TheTide]

r/neoliberal is discussing this article and they sound totally Blue MAGA in the comments. Saying no way Biden should withdraw because it would be “the ultimate expression of failure and weakness,” calling NBC “fake news” because of phony Chuck Todd and Kristen Welker… These people have gone insane. How can they not see the irony???

When r/neoliberal and Democrats crazy hyperpartisans are saner than Atlas it’s indeed a reason for concern for this forum.

'Sane' (or any variation on the word) and any major political subreddit shouldn't be used in the same sentence under any circumstances.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

He's not dropping out

[Red Velvet]

r/neoliberal is discussing this article and they sound totally Blue MAGA in the comments. Saying no way Biden should withdraw because it would be “the ultimate expression of failure and weakness,” calling NBC “fake news” because of phony Chuck Todd and Kristen Welker… These people have gone insane. How can they not see the irony???

When r/neoliberal and Democrats crazy hyperpartisans are saner than Atlas it’s indeed a reason for concern for this forum.

'Sane' (or any variation on the word) and any major political subreddit shouldn't be used in the same sentence under any circumstances.

Depends, it can be acceptable but only when you’re talking in comparison with Atlas.

[Alben Barkley]

r/neoliberal is discussing this article and they sound totally Blue MAGA in the comments. Saying no way Biden should withdraw because it would be “the ultimate expression of failure and weakness,” calling NBC “fake news” because of phony Chuck Todd and Kristen Welker… These people have gone insane. How can they not see the irony???

When r/neoliberal and Democrats crazy hyperpartisans are saner than Atlas it’s indeed a reason for concern for this forum.

'Sane' (or any variation on the word) and any major political subreddit shouldn't be used in the same sentence under any circumstances.

Also gotta love the implication that 72% of Americans are insane, and not the 28% who still think Biden should run. They’re not only insane, they also need their eyes checked. Although deep down I don’t think any of them actually believe it if they’re being honest, they just lie to themselves and others. That kind of relentless denial of reality is a form of insanity though.

Also I think we know who the redditor was now.

[kia boyz '24]

I was pretty staunchly in the "he's fine" camp prior to the debate.  No longer.

With all due respect anyone who realized JUST THURSDAY NIGHT that Joe Biden might be too old to run for president is either gullible beyond belief or has the memory of a goldfish. Guy's 81 years old, had 2 brain aneurysms, and has always stuttered with gaffes. I voted for him in the primary (End of April, by that late in the game the best path forward to beat Trump was show confidence in the Democratic nominee) with the understanding he was liable to have a senior moment on national TV and a contingent response of "see if we can get people to think Trump is even more unfit to serve". That's the corner we are backed into and the time to avoid it was in January at the latest