Does Corzine deserve to get re-elected?

[Conan]

I agree: ownership of a $800,000 to 1,000,000 house, regardless of location in New Jersey, puts you firmly in the upper class.  Once you dip down closer to $500,000 or $600,000, you're now talking middle class—often upper middle class—because a lot of families just got to that point through decades of appreciation.

If a family got to $1,000,000 through decades of appreciation, well—they were rich to get that house in the first place.

How much you're house has become worth has nothing to do with how much a family makes. How much your house is worth doesnt determine your class either. There are tons of homes in NJ that you'd be surprised such a piece of crap was worth so much money. Your last point doesnt make sense either.  My cousin, who lives in an upperclass neighborhood in northern Bergen county in the Saddle River area, not saying which town for privacy reasons, paid a little over $100,000 for their home in the late 80s. Today the home is worth 1.25 million.They were not rich to begin with. However if someone bought a home where I live for $100,000 in 1989 or whatever, that house would probably be worth around $300,000.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

I agree: ownership of a $800,000 to 1,000,000 house, regardless of location in New Jersey, puts you firmly in the upper class.  Once you dip down closer to $500,000 or $600,000, you're now talking middle class—often upper middle class—because a lot of families just got to that point through decades of appreciation.

If a family got to $1,000,000 through decades of appreciation, well—they were rich to get that house in the first place.

How much you're house has become worth has nothing to do with how much a family makes. How much your house is worth doesnt determine your class either. There are tons of homes in NJ that you'd be surprised such a piece of crap was worth so much money. Your last point doesnt make sense either.  My cousin, who lives in an upperclass neighborhood in northern Bergen county in the Saddle River area, not saying which town for privacy reasons, paid a little over $100,000 for their home in the late 80s. Today the home is worth 1.25 million.They were not rich to begin with. However if someone bought a home where I live for $100,000 in 1989 or whatever, that house would probably be worth around $300,000.

I will grant that there are exceptions to every rule.  Regardless, for the vast majority of cases, my point holds true.

[Conan]

I agree: ownership of a $800,000 to 1,000,000 house, regardless of location in New Jersey, puts you firmly in the upper class.  Once you dip down closer to $500,000 or $600,000, you're now talking middle class—often upper middle class—because a lot of families just got to that point through decades of appreciation.

If a family got to $1,000,000 through decades of appreciation, well—they were rich to get that house in the first place.

How much you're house has become worth has nothing to do with how much a family makes. How much your house is worth doesnt determine your class either. There are tons of homes in NJ that you'd be surprised such a piece of crap was worth so much money. Your last point doesnt make sense either.  My cousin, who lives in an upperclass neighborhood in northern Bergen county in the Saddle River area, not saying which town for privacy reasons, paid a little over $100,000 for their home in the late 80s. Today the home is worth 1.25 million.They were not rich to begin with. However if someone bought a home where I live for $100,000 in 1989 or whatever, that house would probably be worth around $300,000.

I will grant that there are exceptions to every rule.  Regardless, for the vast majority of cases, my point holds true.

In most cases you are correct. Most people would sell there homes to make the money and be more financially stable at another house.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

I agree: ownership of a $800,000 to 1,000,000 house, regardless of location in New Jersey, puts you firmly in the upper class.  Once you dip down closer to $500,000 or $600,000, you're now talking middle class—often upper middle class—because a lot of families just got to that point through decades of appreciation.

If a family got to $1,000,000 through decades of appreciation, well—they were rich to get that house in the first place.

How much you're house has become worth has nothing to do with how much a family makes. How much your house is worth doesnt determine your class either. There are tons of homes in NJ that you'd be surprised such a piece of crap was worth so much money. Your last point doesnt make sense either.  My cousin, who lives in an upperclass neighborhood in northern Bergen county in the Saddle River area, not saying which town for privacy reasons, paid a little over $100,000 for their home in the late 80s. Today the home is worth 1.25 million.They were not rich to begin with. However if someone bought a home where I live for $100,000 in 1989 or whatever, that house would probably be worth around $300,000.

I will grant that there are exceptions to every rule.  Regardless, for the vast majority of cases, my point holds true.

In most cases you are correct. Most people would sell there homes to make the money and be more financially stable at another house.

Again, I strongly disagree with you.  Most people get very attached to their hometowns.  Especially if they've been living there for 30+ years, which would almost have to be the case to have a million dollar home.

There isn't exactly a huge trend towards downsizing, except among retirees, and downsizing is a tradition there, anyway.

[Conan]

I agree: ownership of a $800,000 to 1,000,000 house, regardless of location in New Jersey, puts you firmly in the upper class.  Once you dip down closer to $500,000 or $600,000, you're now talking middle class—often upper middle class—because a lot of families just got to that point through decades of appreciation.

If a family got to $1,000,000 through decades of appreciation, well—they were rich to get that house in the first place.

How much you're house has become worth has nothing to do with how much a family makes. How much your house is worth doesnt determine your class either. There are tons of homes in NJ that you'd be surprised such a piece of crap was worth so much money. Your last point doesnt make sense either.  My cousin, who lives in an upperclass neighborhood in northern Bergen county in the Saddle River area, not saying which town for privacy reasons, paid a little over $100,000 for their home in the late 80s. Today the home is worth 1.25 million.They were not rich to begin with. However if someone bought a home where I live for $100,000 in 1989 or whatever, that house would probably be worth around $300,000.

I will grant that there are exceptions to every rule.  Regardless, for the vast majority of cases, my point holds true.

In most cases you are correct. Most people would sell there homes to make the money and be more financially stable at another house.

Again, I strongly disagree with you.  Most people get very attached to their hometowns.  Especially if they've been living there for 30+ years, which would almost have to be the case to have a million dollar home.

There isn't exactly a huge trend towards downsizing, except among retirees, and downsizing is a tradition there, anyway.

So then you agree that people will have a home that can be worth over a million and yet they can still be lower middle class? Because you just made the case.

[Verily]

I agree: ownership of a $800,000 to 1,000,000 house, regardless of location in New Jersey, puts you firmly in the upper class.  Once you dip down closer to $500,000 or $600,000, you're now talking middle class—often upper middle class—because a lot of families just got to that point through decades of appreciation.

If a family got to $1,000,000 through decades of appreciation, well—they were rich to get that house in the first place.

How much you're house has become worth has nothing to do with how much a family makes. How much your house is worth doesnt determine your class either. There are tons of homes in NJ that you'd be surprised such a piece of crap was worth so much money. Your last point doesnt make sense either.  My cousin, who lives in an upperclass neighborhood in northern Bergen county in the Saddle River area, not saying which town for privacy reasons, paid a little over $100,000 for their home in the late 80s. Today the home is worth 1.25 million.They were not rich to begin with. However if someone bought a home where I live for $100,000 in 1989 or whatever, that house would probably be worth around $300,000.

I will grant that there are exceptions to every rule.  Regardless, for the vast majority of cases, my point holds true.

In most cases you are correct. Most people would sell there homes to make the money and be more financially stable at another house.

Again, I strongly disagree with you.  Most people get very attached to their hometowns.  Especially if they've been living there for 30+ years, which would almost have to be the case to have a million dollar home.

There isn't exactly a huge trend towards downsizing, except among retirees, and downsizing is a tradition there, anyway.

So then you agree that people will have a home that can be worth over a million and yet they can still be lower middle class? Because you just made the case.

Sorry, but it's not possible to live in the Saddle River area and be lower middle class. Maybe they aren't upper class, but a home worth $1,000,000, even in the extraordinarily overvalued Saddle River itself, is a larger-than-average one.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

Again, I strongly disagree with you.  Most people get very attached to their hometowns.  Especially if they've been living there for 30+ years, which would almost have to be the case to have a million dollar home.

There isn't exactly a huge trend towards downsizing, except among retirees, and downsizing is a tradition there, anyway.

So then you agree that people will have a home that can be worth over a million and yet they can still be lower middle class? Because you just made the case.

No, I really think you're reading a lot more into that than is actually there.

Here's the problem with "lower middle class" families living in a $1,000,000 home: the numbers really don't work out.

First, lower middle class is roughly defined as having a yearly income between $32,500–60,000, with a heavy emphasis on the lower end of the range.  For the purposes of this demonstration, I'll set the income level at $40,000/year.

First, payroll taxes.  Federal/state taxes will be at a minimum thanks to a healthy property tax deduction, but they'll still cost the hypothetical family $2,300/year ($40k income|$15k deduction for property tax|2 withholding allowances).  You can't avoid the flat Social Security/Medicare/NJ Unemployment taxes, and they add up to an additional $3,430/year.

If they're living in a million dollar home, they've had to have been there for at least thirty years, so they probably won't have a mortgage payment at this point.  We'll assume the cost of that is zero.  (Which is good, becuase they wouldn't be able to afford one, as you'll soon see.)

First, property taxes on a place like that would probably be close to $15,000/year.  I'm not going to take into account any NJ Saver Rebates or the like, because they're unreliable to say the least.

Next, you'll need homeowners insurance, and coverage on a $1,000,000 home is pricey.  $4,000/year is not an unreasonable estimate (~0.033% monthly).

Second, maintenance will be a huge factor.  If they've been around the home for 30+ years, it will be in a near constant need for repairs (unless it was recently completely renovated, in which case there'd be a significant recurring loan payment).  In general, the estimate is that you'll spend 1% of the purchase price on repairs/maintenance every year.  That's probably exaggerated here, but still, an aging house will need a new roof, a new furnace, electrical work, painting/siding, etc.  You don't see too many million dollar homes in disrepair.  Let's budget a fourth of the recommended amount for this, $2,500/year.

Oh, and utilities.  Maybe $75/month on electricity; $50/month on cable; $40/month on phone; $2,000/year on gas (heat/hot water); another $400/year on sewer/water.  Hopefully, trash pickup is part of the property taxes for this poor family.  That's $4,380 per year total.

Already, we've eaten up $31,610 (79% of income) in taxes and home expenses alone.  We're not even talking commuting expenses (how many Bergen County residents can walk to work?), food, clothing, doctor's visits/prescription drugs (an increasingly large chunk of change for a family that's old enough to have stayed in one house for 30 years)...

...I'd say that a "lower middle class" family owning a $1,000,000 house is very very VERY rare indeed, even in New Jersey.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Solution? Don't buy a house. I'm not for a VERY VERY long time, if ever.

[Conan]

I agree: ownership of a $800,000 to 1,000,000 house, regardless of location in New Jersey, puts you firmly in the upper class.  Once you dip down closer to $500,000 or $600,000, you're now talking middle class—often upper middle class—because a lot of families just got to that point through decades of appreciation.

If a family got to $1,000,000 through decades of appreciation, well—they were rich to get that house in the first place.

How much you're house has become worth has nothing to do with how much a family makes. How much your house is worth doesnt determine your class either. There are tons of homes in NJ that you'd be surprised such a piece of crap was worth so much money. Your last point doesnt make sense either.  My cousin, who lives in an upperclass neighborhood in northern Bergen county in the Saddle River area, not saying which town for privacy reasons, paid a little over $100,000 for their home in the late 80s. Today the home is worth 1.25 million.They were not rich to begin with. However if someone bought a home where I live for $100,000 in 1989 or whatever, that house would probably be worth around $300,000.

I will grant that there are exceptions to every rule.  Regardless, for the vast majority of cases, my point holds true.

In most cases you are correct. Most people would sell there homes to make the money and be more financially stable at another house.

Again, I strongly disagree with you.  Most people get very attached to their hometowns.  Especially if they've been living there for 30+ years, which would almost have to be the case to have a million dollar home.

There isn't exactly a huge trend towards downsizing, except among retirees, and downsizing is a tradition there, anyway.

So then you agree that people will have a home that can be worth over a million and yet they can still be lower middle class? Because you just made the case.

Sorry, but it's not possible to live in the Saddle River area and be lower middle class. Maybe they aren't upper class, but a home worth $1,000,000, even in the extraordinarily overvalued Saddle River itself, is a larger-than-average one.

No, you obviously don't understand or know what you're talking about. It depends when the person bought the home. Just because the value of the home has changed, it doesnt mean your income has. It's extremely possible and there are hundreds of families living in homes they bought for 100-200,000 today whose homes are worth a million or more. Just because the value of the home has changed, doesnt mean their income has, nor their struggle to pay the bills on the original $100-200,000 mortgage. In any case they can just move and jump a few steps on the socio-economic ladder.

[Conan]

Again, I strongly disagree with you.  Most people get very attached to their hometowns.  Especially if they've been living there for 30+ years, which would almost have to be the case to have a million dollar home.

There isn't exactly a huge trend towards downsizing, except among retirees, and downsizing is a tradition there, anyway.

So then you agree that people will have a home that can be worth over a million and yet they can still be lower middle class? Because you just made the case.

No, I really think you're reading a lot more into that than is actually there.

Here's the problem with "lower middle class" families living in a $1,000,000 home: the numbers really don't work out.

First, lower middle class is roughly defined as having a yearly income between $32,500–60,000, with a heavy emphasis on the lower end of the range.  For the purposes of this demonstration, I'll set the income level at $40,000/year.

First, payroll taxes.  Federal/state taxes will be at a minimum thanks to a healthy property tax deduction, but they'll still cost the hypothetical family $2,300/year ($40k income|$15k deduction for property tax|2 withholding allowances).  You can't avoid the flat Social Security/Medicare/NJ Unemployment taxes, and they add up to an additional $3,430/year.

If they're living in a million dollar home, they've had to have been there for at least thirty years, so they probably won't have a mortgage payment at this point.  We'll assume the cost of that is zero.  (Which is good, becuase they wouldn't be able to afford one, as you'll soon see.)

First, property taxes on a place like that would probably be close to $15,000/year.  I'm not going to take into account any NJ Saver Rebates or the like, because they're unreliable to say the least.

Next, you'll need homeowners insurance, and coverage on a $1,000,000 home is pricey.  $4,000/year is not an unreasonable estimate (~0.033% monthly).

Second, maintenance will be a huge factor.  If they've been around the home for 30+ years, it will be in a near constant need for repairs (unless it was recently completely renovated, in which case there'd be a significant recurring loan payment).  In general, the estimate is that you'll spend 1% of the purchase price on repairs/maintenance every year.  That's probably exaggerated here, but still, an aging house will need a new roof, a new furnace, electrical work, painting/siding, etc.  You don't see too many million dollar homes in disrepair.  Let's budget a fourth of the recommended amount for this, $2,500/year.

Oh, and utilities.  Maybe $75/month on electricity; $50/month on cable; $40/month on phone; $2,000/year on gas (heat/hot water); another $400/year on sewer/water.  Hopefully, trash pickup is part of the property taxes for this poor family.  That's $4,380 per year total.

Already, we've eaten up $31,610 (79% of income) in taxes and home expenses alone.  We're not even talking commuting expenses (how many Bergen County residents can walk to work?), food, clothing, doctor's visits/prescription drugs (an increasingly large chunk of change for a family that's old enough to have stayed in one house for 30 years)...

...I'd say that a "lower middle class" family owning a $1,000,000 house is very very VERY rare indeed, even in New Jersey.

Your case is the strongest, as you are the first to bring taxes into the equation! Who would have thought! In a side note, not that is really puts much of a damper on your case but, you probably won't be able to get this information by yourself, 2 homes for sale in Saddle River one for 1.25 mill and the other for 1.29 mill have property taxes of $7,490 and $6,515 respectively. Odd to note that the second home is on the market for more money, yet its property taxes are lower. This is because its assessed building value is lower than the others. A home worth 2.8 has property taxes of $16,410.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

The sad thing is the hypothetical $1,000,000 home we're talking about would likely be a tear down: whomever buys it is paying for the land.

A thirty or forty year old home isn't worth $6,000 a month.  I don't care how nice Saddle River is.

[DownWithTheLeft]

The sad thing is the hypothetical $1,000,000 home we're talking about would likely be a tear down: whomever buys it is paying for the land.

A thirty or forty year old home isn't worth $6,000 a month.  I don't care how nice Saddle River is.

Speaking of low taxes, Saddle River's are among the lowest.  When you have no schools and a small police and fire force, that's not hard to do.

[Verily]

The sad thing is the hypothetical $1,000,000 home we're talking about would likely be a tear down: whomever buys it is paying for the land.

A thirty or forty year old home isn't worth $6,000 a month.  I don't care how nice Saddle River is.

Speaking of low taxes, Saddle River's are among the lowest.  When you have no schools and a small police and fire force, that's not hard to do.

Well, yeah, when everyone can afford to send their kids to private schools, you don't need property taxes. Saddle River is also the in the top 50 wealthiest towns of significant size in the United States.

[DownWithTheLeft]

The sad thing is the hypothetical $1,000,000 home we're talking about would likely be a tear down: whomever buys it is paying for the land.

A thirty or forty year old home isn't worth $6,000 a month.  I don't care how nice Saddle River is.

Speaking of low taxes, Saddle River's are among the lowest.  When you have no schools and a small police and fire force, that's not hard to do.

Well, yeah, when everyone can afford to send their kids to private schools, you don't need property taxes. Saddle River is also the 27th-wealthiest town in the United States.

True, also what is the difference in wealth between Saddle River and Upper Saddle River?  I drive through both on my way to my grandparent's house in Airmont, NY and I think the difference is huge.

[Verily]

The sad thing is the hypothetical $1,000,000 home we're talking about would likely be a tear down: whomever buys it is paying for the land.

A thirty or forty year old home isn't worth $6,000 a month.  I don't care how nice Saddle River is.

Speaking of low taxes, Saddle River's are among the lowest.  When you have no schools and a small police and fire force, that's not hard to do.

Well, yeah, when everyone can afford to send their kids to private schools, you don't need property taxes. Saddle River is also the 27th-wealthiest town in the United States.

True, also what is the difference in wealth between Saddle River and Upper Saddle River?  I drive through both on my way to my grandparent's house in Airmont, NY and I think the difference is huge.

Upper Saddle River is also wealthy, but not nearly so much so as Saddle River. Which is unfortunate, because I have never encountered a town name that sounded more posh than Upper Saddle River.

Per capita income, Saddle River: $85,934
Per capita income, Upper Saddle River: $57,239

Poverty is at 0.7% of the population in Upper Saddle River and at 3.6% in Saddle River, so the wealth is more evenly distributed in USR than in SR.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

The sad thing is the hypothetical $1,000,000 home we're talking about would likely be a tear down: whomever buys it is paying for the land.

A thirty or forty year old home isn't worth $6,000 a month.  I don't care how nice Saddle River is.

Speaking of low taxes, Saddle River's are among the lowest.  When you have no schools and a small police and fire force, that's not hard to do.

Eh, my parents live in Alexandria Township, which has no high school and no police station (they rely on State Troopers), and their taxes are well over $10k.

[DownWithTheLeft]

The sad thing is the hypothetical $1,000,000 home we're talking about would likely be a tear down: whomever buys it is paying for the land.

A thirty or forty year old home isn't worth $6,000 a month.  I don't care how nice Saddle River is.

Speaking of low taxes, Saddle River's are among the lowest.  When you have no schools and a small police and fire force, that's not hard to do.

Eh, my parents live in Alexandria Township, which has no high school and no police station (they rely on State Troopers), and their taxes are well over $10k.

That surprises me, however, I assume that is the exception

[Smash255]

Again, I strongly disagree with you.  Most people get very attached to their hometowns.  Especially if they've been living there for 30+ years, which would almost have to be the case to have a million dollar home.

There isn't exactly a huge trend towards downsizing, except among retirees, and downsizing is a tradition there, anyway.

So then you agree that people will have a home that can be worth over a million and yet they can still be lower middle class? Because you just made the case.

No, I really think you're reading a lot more into that than is actually there.

Here's the problem with "lower middle class" families living in a $1,000,000 home: the numbers really don't work out.

First, lower middle class is roughly defined as having a yearly income between $32,500–60,000, with a heavy emphasis on the lower end of the range.  For the purposes of this demonstration, I'll set the income level at $40,000/year.

First, payroll taxes.  Federal/state taxes will be at a minimum thanks to a healthy property tax deduction, but they'll still cost the hypothetical family $2,300/year ($40k income|$15k deduction for property tax|2 withholding allowances).  You can't avoid the flat Social Security/Medicare/NJ Unemployment taxes, and they add up to an additional $3,430/year.

If they're living in a million dollar home, they've had to have been there for at least thirty years, so they probably won't have a mortgage payment at this point.  We'll assume the cost of that is zero.  (Which is good, becuase they wouldn't be able to afford one, as you'll soon see.)

First, property taxes on a place like that would probably be close to $15,000/year.  I'm not going to take into account any NJ Saver Rebates or the like, because they're unreliable to say the least.

Next, you'll need homeowners insurance, and coverage on a $1,000,000 home is pricey.  $4,000/year is not an unreasonable estimate (~0.033% monthly).

Second, maintenance will be a huge factor.  If they've been around the home for 30+ years, it will be in a near constant need for repairs (unless it was recently completely renovated, in which case there'd be a significant recurring loan payment).  In general, the estimate is that you'll spend 1% of the purchase price on repairs/maintenance every year.  That's probably exaggerated here, but still, an aging house will need a new roof, a new furnace, electrical work, painting/siding, etc.  You don't see too many million dollar homes in disrepair.  Let's budget a fourth of the recommended amount for this, $2,500/year.

Oh, and utilities.  Maybe $75/month on electricity; $50/month on cable; $40/month on phone; $2,000/year on gas (heat/hot water); another $400/year on sewer/water.  Hopefully, trash pickup is part of the property taxes for this poor family.  That's $4,380 per year total.

Already, we've eaten up $31,610 (79% of income) in taxes and home expenses alone.  We're not even talking commuting expenses (how many Bergen County residents can walk to work?), food, clothing, doctor's visits/prescription drugs (an increasingly large chunk of change for a family that's old enough to have stayed in one house for 30 years)...

...I'd say that a "lower middle class" family owning a $1,000,000 house is very very VERY rare indeed, even in New Jersey.

Your case is the strongest, as you are the first to bring taxes into the equation! Who would have thought! In a side note, not that is really puts much of a damper on your case but, you probably won't be able to get this information by yourself, 2 homes for sale in Saddle River one for 1.25 mill and the other for 1.29 mill have property taxes of $7,490 and $6,515 respectively. Odd to note that the second home is on the market for more money, yet its property taxes are lower. This is because its assessed building value is lower than the others. A home worth 2.8 has property taxes of $16,410.

Its the same thing here on Long Island, even homes assessed at a higher value can have lower property taxes, in part due to the School District.  For example I live near the school district border of Massapequa and Farmingdale.  Two homes in my area just sold, the one in the Farmingdale School district for $520,000 and the one in the Massapequa School district for $555,000.  Both homes were sold above the assessed value, both with a Massapequa Park mailing address, but technically East Massapequa.

The one in the Massapequa school district was assessed at about $30,000 higher, however paid $1,400 less in property taxes (without taking into account the various exceptions and exemptions) than the one in the Farmingdale school district.   However despite being sold for less and assessed for less, the taxes in the Farmingdale district was about $1,450 higher than the one in the Massapequa district. This is due to the fact their are many more higher end homes in Massapequa than in Farmingdale.

[DownWithTheLeft]

Smash, it's real easy, you only like hiim because you have a good governor and don't have to deal with this retard

[Smash255]

Smash, it's real easy, you only like hiim because you have a good governor and don't have to deal with this retard

Sorry little boy, but just because someone has property tax relief which focuses on making those in the middle and working class lives easier as opposed to policies which make it easier for a spoiled rich kid's parents to buy him a nicer car and so that spoiled rich kid can buy what he wants without getting a job does not make the guy a retard.  You lost all credibility to bitch about Corzine when those were some of the reasons you gave for disliking him.

[DownWithTheLeft]

Smash, it's real easy, you only like hiim because you have a good governor and don't have to deal with this retard

Sorry little boy, but just because someone has property tax relief which focuses on making those in the middle and working class lives easier as opposed to policies which make it easier for a spoiled rich kid's parents to buy him a nicer car and so that spoiled rich kid can buy what he wants without getting a job does not make the guy a retard.  You lost all credibility to bitch about Corzine when those were some of the reasons you gave for disliking him.

Those weren't reasons I gave for disliking him, those were reasons I gave for why taxes effected me, you should probably actually read what I say.  However, the point remains it's really easy to sit in NY and say you like this guy.

[Verily]

Smash, it's real easy, you only like hiim because you have a good governor and don't have to deal with this retard

Sorry little boy, but just because someone has property tax relief which focuses on making those in the middle and working class lives easier as opposed to policies which make it easier for a spoiled rich kid's parents to buy him a nicer car and so that spoiled rich kid can buy what he wants without getting a job does not make the guy a retard.  You lost all credibility to bitch about Corzine when those were some of the reasons you gave for disliking him.

Those weren't reasons I gave for disliking him, those were reasons I gave for why taxes effected me, you should probably actually read what I say.  However, the point remains it's really easy to sit in NY and say you like this guy.

The problem is that you haven't actually given any reasons that you don't like him other than "OMG my taxes are going up!!!1111"

[DownWithTheLeft]

Smash, it's real easy, you only like hiim because you have a good governor and don't have to deal with this retard

Sorry little boy, but just because someone has property tax relief which focuses on making those in the middle and working class lives easier as opposed to policies which make it easier for a spoiled rich kid's parents to buy him a nicer car and so that spoiled rich kid can buy what he wants without getting a job does not make the guy a retard.  You lost all credibility to bitch about Corzine when those were some of the reasons you gave for disliking him.

Those weren't reasons I gave for disliking him, those were reasons I gave for why taxes effected me, you should probably actually read what I say.  However, the point remains it's really easy to sit in NY and say you like this guy.

The problem is that you haven't actually given any reasons that you don't like him other than "OMG my taxes are going up!!!1111"

He's raised the sales tax, created a budget standstill, approved of the civil unions and represents all that is wrong about the Democratic machine in NJ.  Codey should be the governor and I think it would only be justice for him to take what is rightfully his.

[Conan]

Smash, it's real easy, you only like hiim because you have a good governor and don't have to deal with this retard

Sorry little boy, but just because someone has property tax relief which focuses on making those in the middle and working class lives easier as opposed to policies which make it easier for a spoiled rich kid's parents to buy him a nicer car and so that spoiled rich kid can buy what he wants without getting a job does not make the guy a retard.  You lost all credibility to bitch about Corzine when those were some of the reasons you gave for disliking him.

Those weren't reasons I gave for disliking him, those were reasons I gave for why taxes effected me, you should probably actually read what I say.  However, the point remains it's really easy to sit in NY and say you like this guy.

The problem is that you haven't actually given any reasons that you don't like him other than "OMG my taxes are going up!!!1111"

He's raised the sales tax, created a budget standstill, approved of the civil unions and represents all that is wrong about the Democratic machine in NJ.  Codey should be the governor and I think it would only be justice for him to take what is rightfully his.

You really like Codey too much. Codey is part of the machine and has been a big part of blocking ethics legislation. Corzine isn't close to the machines and that is apparent when he is clashing with his own democratic legislature. However, if you think the sales tax increase is so terrible, then you're just really cheap.  The budget standstill was at the fault of the legislature too.

Smash, it's real easy, you only like hiim because you have a good governor and don't have to deal with this retard

Sorry little boy, but just because someone has property tax relief which focuses on making those in the middle and working class lives easier as opposed to policies which make it easier for a spoiled rich kid's parents to buy him a nicer car and so that spoiled rich kid can buy what he wants without getting a job does not make the guy a retard.  You lost all credibility to bitch about Corzine when those were some of the reasons you gave for disliking him.

Even though he says he lives in a million dollar home, I don't think he thinks he is or even is rich. Anyway, if one does have a million dollar home, it still can take a lot of work and budget restraints to help your kid to get a car. Anyway, I don't think he is this spoiled little rich kid because he lives in Rutherford or East Rutherford, which according to the book of New Jerseyan Codes, isn't high up on anyones lists of places to live, no offense.

[Smash255]

Smash, it's real easy, you only like hiim because you have a good governor and don't have to deal with this retard

Sorry little boy, but just because someone has property tax relief which focuses on making those in the middle and working class lives easier as opposed to policies which make it easier for a spoiled rich kid's parents to buy him a nicer car and so that spoiled rich kid can buy what he wants without getting a job does not make the guy a retard.  You lost all credibility to bitch about Corzine when those were some of the reasons you gave for disliking him.

Those weren't reasons I gave for disliking him, those were reasons I gave for why taxes effected me, you should probably actually read what I say.  However, the point remains it's really easy to sit in NY and say you like this guy.

The problem is that you haven't actually given any reasons that you don't like him other than "OMG my taxes are going up!!!1111"

He's raised the sales tax, created a budget standstill, approved of the civil unions and represents all that is wrong about the Democratic machine in NJ.  Codey should be the governor and I think it would only be justice for him to take what is rightfully his.

You really like Codey too much. Codey is part of the machine and has been a big part of blocking ethics legislation. Corzine isn't close to the machines and that is apparent when he is clashing with his own democratic legislature. However, if you think the sales tax increase is so terrible, then you're just really cheap.  The budget standstill was at the fault of the legislature too.

Smash, it's real easy, you only like hiim because you have a good governor and don't have to deal with this retard

Sorry little boy, but just because someone has property tax relief which focuses on making those in the middle and working class lives easier as opposed to policies which make it easier for a spoiled rich kid's parents to buy him a nicer car and so that spoiled rich kid can buy what he wants without getting a job does not make the guy a retard.  You lost all credibility to bitch about Corzine when those were some of the reasons you gave for disliking him.

Even though he says he lives in a million dollar home, I don't think he thinks he is or even is rich. Anyway, if one does have a million dollar home, it still can take a lot of work and budget restraints to help your kid to get a car. Anyway, I don't think he is this spoiled little rich kid because he lives in Rutherford or East Rutherford, which according to the book of New Jerseyan Codes, isn't high up on anyones lists of places to live, no offense.

However, with the way he complained about his parents taxes going up leads me to believe that they make a large sum of $$ because if I'm not mistaken the property tax relief Corzine put forth is similar to what we have in NY, in which we have tax breaks based on the income levels, and it takes a rather large income not to qualify for the relief.  The only way his taxes can go up the amount he is suggesting would be a combination of a large jump in local, school taxes combined with an income level that is too high to qualify for the relief. 

So he either comes from a family with a lot of $$ or is flat out lying about the tax increase, possibly a combination of the two, but their is no way the taxes can go up the amount he is suggesting if the income level isn't quite high, not with the relief package Corzine  signed.