Which of these leaders do you consider a "fascist"?

[buritobr]

There is a long political and academic debate concerning the definition of "fascism". The narrowest definition includes only Benito Mussolini, who really used this name. His party was the National Fascist Party. The broadest definition includes all the names of this list and many other.

I included only national leaders, that's why Oswald Mosley, Jean Marie Le Pen, Marine Le Pen, André Ventura, Santiago Abascal, Alice Weidel are not in this list.

[TheReckoning]

Hitler only.

I would say a key part of fascism is desire to go to war with other countries to conquer their territory. If a leader isn’t doing that, they can’t be considered fascist.

[Red Velvet]

Characteristics for fascism IMO:

- Far-Right Politics
- Nationalist Rhetoric
- Cult of Militarism
- Anti-Democratic tendencies
- Belief in Social Hierarchies (Group A is superior to Group B, etc)

[Progressive Pessimist]

What about Franco? He outright used a variation of the Fasces as his party's insignia.

[TheReckoning]

Characteristics for fascism IMO:

- Far-Right Politics
- Nationalist Rhetoric
- Cult of Militarism
- Anti-Democratic tendencies
- Belief in Social Hierarchies (Group A is superior to Group B, etc)

Was Ramses II a fascist then? Lmao

[Diabolical Materialism]

Hitler only.

I would say a key part of fascism is desire to go to war with other countries to conquer their territory. If a leader isn’t doing that, they can’t be considered fascist.

Mussolini is right there on the list too

[buritobr]

What about Franco? He outright used a variation of the Fasces as his party's insignia.

There is an interpretation which says that Franco and Salazar were not fascists, that they were just traditionalists. Although fascism was a reactionary movement, it was a mass movement. Franco and Salazar didn't have mass mobilization. They were endorsed by the aristocracies and the Catholic Church.
This interpretation has a very narrow view on fascism.

[lfromnj]

Putin is interesting because

In his speeches on the war, Mr. Putin has paid frequent lip service to Russia as a multiethnic state — a legacy of the Russian and Soviet empires. In March 2022, after describing the heroism of a soldier from Dagestan, Mr. Putin enumerated some of Russia’s ethnic groups by saying: “I am a Lak, I am a Dagestani, I am a Chechen, an Ingush, a Russian, a Tatar, a Jew, a Mordvin, an Ossetian.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/27/world/europe/russia-moscow-attack-migrants.html

He's arguably one of the most liberal European leaders when it comes to immigration as well. It does help that overall that Central Asian migrants are closer to what LATAM migrants are to America(infact usually even better because they speak Russian) compared to Middle Eastern migrants Europe gets.

Mussoulini was definetely a fascist and wasn't that far out on ethnic issues either.

[KaiserDave]

Under the most pedantic definition, only Ferenc Szálasi and Hitler. But I prefer using a slightly less pedantic definition, which would also include Franco, Dolfuß, Petain, Antonescu, and maybe Videla and one or two others.

[CheapDollarEra?]

Alberto Fujimori was a typical latino corrupt caudillo. Not a fascist.

[PSOL]

All except the monarchs (the 1st Pahlavi definitely was, borderline case with the son), the current Assad, milei, PiSSer, Fujimori (borderline), and Poroshenko. Being authoritarian, conservative, or even a dictator isn’t what makes one a fascist. Having “popular/mass support” is not a prerequisite to fascism or even necessary for them to take power.

Putin, Orban, and the Islamists mentioned definitely are fascists as is Bukele, Trump, and the latter’s dog.

[TheReckoning]

What about Franco? He outright used a variation of the Fasces as his party's insignia.

There is an interpretation which says that Franco and Salazar were not fascists, that they were just traditionalists. Although fascism was a reactionary movement, it was a mass movement. Franco and Salazar didn't have mass mobilization. They were endorsed by the aristocracies and the Catholic Church.
This interpretation has a very narrow view on fascism.

Fascism is a revolutionary movement, as it was defined by Mussolini/Gentile.

[PSOL]

Fascism isn’t revolutionary, it’s the reaction to revolution.

[TheReckoning]

Fascism isn’t revolutionary, it’s the reaction to revolution.

“The fascist state, is, however, a unique and original creation. It is not reactionary but revolutionary.” - Giovanni Gentile, The Doctrine of Facism

[PSOL]

Fascism isn’t revolutionary, it’s the reaction to revolution.

“The fascist state, is, however, a unique and original creation. It is not reactionary but revolutionary.” - Giovanni Gentile, The Doctrine of Facism

They can drape themselves with radical chic all they want, it’s mainly aesthetics that make them differ from the conventional conservatives they rail against.

[Crumpets]

Putin is interesting because

In his speeches on the war, Mr. Putin has paid frequent lip service to Russia as a multiethnic state — a legacy of the Russian and Soviet empires. In March 2022, after describing the heroism of a soldier from Dagestan, Mr. Putin enumerated some of Russia’s ethnic groups by saying: “I am a Lak, I am a Dagestani, I am a Chechen, an Ingush, a Russian, a Tatar, a Jew, a Mordvin, an Ossetian.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/27/world/europe/russia-moscow-attack-migrants.html

He's arguably one of the most liberal European leaders when it comes to immigration as well. It does help that overall that Central Asian migrants are closer to what LATAM migrants are to America(infact usually even better because they speak Russian) compared to Middle Eastern migrants Europe gets.

Mussoulini was definetely a fascist and wasn't that far out on ethnic issues either.

Part of the reason Putin has been open to immigration in the last couple of years is to mobilize recent immigrants and migrants to fight in Ukraine and try to keep as few Muscovites, Petersburgians, and other "core" Russians as far away from the reality of war as possible, while throwing as many non-ethnically Russian Russians at the meat grinder as possible.

Some sources:
RFE/RL: Migrants Reportedly Being Forced To Sign Contracts With Defense Ministry To Obtain Russian Citizenship
Jamestown Foundation: Russia Uses All Means to Recruit Central Asians for War in Ukraine
Eurasianet: Central Asians targeted in Russia’s desperate mobilization drive
RFE/RL: Russian Recruiters Target Central Asian Migrants At Mosques, Dorms To Join War In Ukraine
Moscow Times: 2 Years Into Ukraine War, Russia’s Ethnic Minorities Disproportionately Killed in Battle
CBC: Russian ethnic minorities bearing brunt of Russia's war mobilization in Ukraine

[Mr.Bakari-Sellers]

Trump is definitely facist

[VBM]

Hitler only.

I would say a key part of fascism is desire to go to war with other countries to conquer their territory. If a leader isn’t doing that, they can’t be considered fascist.

Vladimir Putin should also be considered a fascist according to this definition.

[dead0man]

Fascism isn’t revolutionary, it’s the reaction to revolution.

“The fascist state, is, however, a unique and original creation. It is not reactionary but revolutionary.” - Giovanni Gentile, The Doctrine of Facism

They can drape themselves with radical chic all they want, it’s mainly aesthetics that make them differ from the conventional conservatives they rail against.

being from the hard left, you have to be an expert in spotting "radical chic" and "mainly aesthetics" or else you'll drown in it

[buritobr]

Petro Poroshenko is in this list because the official revisionism in Ukraine since 2014 concerning the Ukranian nationalists who fought in the SS in 1941-45 is not Putin's fake news. Putin's propaganda didn't invent this story. It just uses this strory for its own political benefit.

This is an article published in 2016 by a magazine which is not pro Putin
https://foreignpolicy.com/2016/05/02/the-historian-whitewashing-ukraines-past-volodymyr-viatrovych/

[PSOL]

Poroshenko, and Zelenskyy for that matter, are fundamentally opportunists. One is just a standard conservative and the other is 80% Bukele.

[Robert California]

The "tolerant" left.

[PSOL]

Why is Peron and Piłsudski having so few votes?

The "tolerant" left.

We know you are a fascist cath, you do a terrible job at being in the closet.

[Robert California]

Why is Peron and Piłsudski having so few votes?

The "tolerant" left.

We know you are a fascist cath, you do a terrible job at being in the closet.

I don't know that I was hiding anything.

[AncestralDemocrat.]

52% picking Trump and only 29% picking Hirohito.. key indicator to how braindead some on this forum are.