Is it ever ok to call someone a "self-hating jew"?

[Flats the Flounder]

I find that typically, although concepts both of the "self-hating Jew" and the more umbrella term "internalized bigotry" can exist in theory, in practice they are typically used to shut down anyone's perspective on their own identity that doesn't align with the mainstream narratives about those identities.

Overall, I think those kinds of accusations should be minimized except for very extreme cases, like those of Jewish Holocaust deniers.

[Alben Barkley]

"I do hate myself but it has nothing to do with being Jewish!"

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

They definitely exist. I don't see how it's not appropriate to describe Stephen Miller or Tony Greenstein that way, for instance. The problem is, it gets used more liberally than it should.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

I tend to agree with those saying it applies an undue psychotherapeutic gloss to objectionable political or religious ideas that should instead be discussed as objectionable political or religious ideas. There probably should be a term more specific than "antisemite" to communicate the especially insidious and craven nature of these ideas when advanced by people who are themselves Jewish, but "self-hating Jew" isn't the best term to accomplish that.

[Horus]

They definitely exist. I don't see how it's not appropriate to describe Stephen Miller or Tony Greenstein that way, for instance. The problem is, it gets used more liberally than it should.

Dude, you literally called ever single Jewish member of Congress who voted against Tlaib's censure self hating, now you think it's used too liberally? Make your mind up.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

They definitely exist. I don't see how it's not appropriate to describe Stephen Miller or Tony Greenstein that way, for instance. The problem is, it gets used more liberally than it should.

Dude, you literally called ever single Jewish member of Congress who voted against Tlaib's censure self hating, now you think it's used too liberally? Make your mind up.

No I didn't, you literally made that up out of thin air. I celebrated a progressive Jewish congressman, Steve Cohen, voting for the censure by saying "The Jewish people are done with this BS". You immediately started yelling that I was saying that every Jewish Congress member who voted against the censure wasn't a real Jew.

[themaninthejinnahcap]

The truth is always okay. If someone is Jewish and hates themselves for being Jewish, then there is nothing wrong with making the truthful description of them as such, regardless of how unpopular or rude it may be considered.

[Progressive Pessimist]

"I do hate myself but it has nothing to do with being Jewish!"

Once again, Larry David and I share a similarity.

[Crumpets]

Probably not. There is a real phenomenon of internalized anti-Semitism, just like women can experience internalized misogyny, gays can experience internalized homophobia, and so on. But I think it's more productive to discuss in those terms rather than just calling someone a "self-hating Jew" whether or not the person saying it is Jewish. At best, it's a conversation-ender and at worst just a product of that person's own anti-Semitism making them want to degrade Jews in a way they think will be more socially acceptable.

[Mr. Ukucasha]

In most cases, no, unless the person in question is someone like Bobby Fischer.

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

If they are an actual self-hating Jew, then sure, but the vast majority of the times these terms are used that is not actually the case, and the people saying such are not actually Jewish.

[AtorBoltox]

I agree it probably should be used with reticence, but when you get people like Norm Finkelstein saying things like 'David Irving is a very good historian' then I think its a fair characterization

[Antonio the Sixth]

I agree it probably should be used with reticence, but when you get people like Norm Finkelstein saying things like 'David Irving is a very good historian' then I think its a fair characterization

Looking at how Norman Finkelstein conducts himself, I really don't see much evidence of self-hatred. If anything what transpires is a deeply overinflated sense of his own ego.

[dead0man]

yeah, that dude is an asshole first.  His hatred of his own people is a byproduct of that, not the other way around.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

From current conduct, it seems pretty safe to say Katie Halper, Rafael Shimunov, and Amanda Gelender actively qualify. All of them are turning a lot of their venom on the diaspora Jewish community that refuses to turn on Israel.