Trump and Biden need to stop attacking China

[BG-NY (permanently retired)]

A lot of people in the middle and on the flanks are going to stay home if they keep saber-rattling.

China is not our enemy.

[President Johnson]

China is a rival though, both in terms of the form of government, influence in the Pacific and elsewhere as well as the economy. China is not a friend of the West as whole and needs to be taken on by using the tools available below a military confrontation.

[oldtimer]

As long as China doesn't push back I don't see why they need to stop.

[BG-NY (permanently retired)]

China is a rival though, both in terms of the form of government, influence in the Pacific and elsewhere as well as the economy. China is not a friend of the West as whole and needs to be taken on by using the tools available below a military confrontation.

I don't disagree, but don't you worry both guys are pushing toward confrontation?

[Ferguson97]

China is not our enemy.

Voters overwhelmingly disagree.

[DaleCooper]

Users who have posted about how they're going to leave Atlas forever should be permanently banned.

[ηєω ƒяσηтιєя]

Literally everything you said is false lol.

Now, let's look at some facts:

*China viewed favorably by 15% of Americans; Taiwan by 77%
*Approximately two-thirds of Americans say China’s military, economic powers are critical threats

SOURCE: https://news.gallup.com/poll/471551/record-low-americans-view-china-favorably.aspx

[President Johnson]

China is a rival though, both in terms of the form of government, influence in the Pacific and elsewhere as well as the economy. China is not a friend of the West as whole and needs to be taken on by using the tools available below a military confrontation.

I don't disagree, but don't you worry both guys are pushing toward confrontation?

Trump might, especially since he's very thin-skinned. Biden? No. He's too experienced of a steady leader to push towards a military confrontation. He's also surrounded by a team of professionals who know what they're doing. Biden wants to take on China economically and system-wise as a battle between democracy and autocracy. Biden also is far more capable of convincing other free nations (Europeans in particular) to join in an effort to push back against China's influence more effectively. I mean, it's already happening at this point even though not to the degree I would like to see.

[BG-NY (permanently retired)]

Users who have posted about how they're going to leave Atlas forever should be permanently banned.

I'm good with this, as long as my account is deleted. That would be my overwhelming preference.

[CheapDollarEra?]

Trump may convince some people that he can get a deal with Putin to unite agaisnt China.
Biden need to show his patriotism, and he tries to do that in his semi old-school-cold-war-liberal way.

[Republican Party Stalwart]

Literally everything you said is false lol.

Now, let's look at some facts:

*China viewed favorably by 15% of Americans; Taiwan by 77%
*Approximately two-thirds of Americans say China’s military, economic powers are critical threats

SOURCE: https://news.gallup.com/poll/471551/record-low-americans-view-china-favorably.aspx

I wonder what portion of that 77% actually knows that the official name of the country controlling Taiwan is the "Republic of China," that the area controlled by the ROC includes the islands of Kinmen and Lienchiang on the Mainland Side of the Taiwan Strait, that the correct name of the area controlled by the ROC is the "Free Area of the Republic of China," that the population of the Free Area of the ROC is over 97% ethnically Han Chinese and only 2% Aboriginal, or that the official language of the ROC is Standard Mandarin Chinese, or that the primary spoken languages of the ROC are Mandarin, Hokkien, Hakka, and Fuzhounese.

[ηєω ƒяσηтιєя]

I wonder what portion of that 77% actually knows that the official name of the country controlling Taiwan is the "Republic of China," that the area controlled by the ROC includes the islands of Kinmen and Lienchiang on the Mainland Side of the Taiwan Strait, that the correct name of the area controlled by the ROC is the "Free Area of the Republic of China," that the population of the Free Area of the ROC is over 97% ethnically Han Chinese and only 2% Aboriginal, or that the official language of the ROC is Standard Mandarin Chinese, or that the primary spoken languages of the ROC are Mandarin, Hokkien, Hakka, and Fuzhounese.

OK? All of that is completely irrelevant.

[Zohran "The Sword of Islam" Mamdani]

Literally everything you said is false lol.

Now, let's look at some facts:

*China viewed favorably by 15% of Americans; Taiwan by 77%
*Approximately two-thirds of Americans say China’s military, economic powers are critical threats

SOURCE: https://news.gallup.com/poll/471551/record-low-americans-view-china-favorably.aspx

I wonder what portion of that 77% actually knows that the official name of the country controlling Taiwan is the "Republic of China," that the area controlled by the ROC includes the islands of Kinmen and Lienchiang on the Mainland Side of the Taiwan Strait, that the correct name of the area controlled by the ROC is the "Free Area of the Republic of China," that the population of the Free Area of the ROC is over 97% ethnically Han Chinese and only 2% Aboriginal, or that the official language of the ROC is Standard Mandarin Chinese, or that the primary spoken languages of the ROC are Mandarin, Hokkien, Hakka, and Fuzhounese.

I wonder what portion of the remaining 23% actually knows that the hit song from the 90s "Fade Into You" was written by a band called Mazzy Star, that the band originally consisted primarily of vocalist Hope Sandoval and guitarist David Roback (although the lineup also included guest musicians, contributing to the band's dreamy and atmospheric sound), that despite not achieving commercial success the album She Hangs Brightly is one of the seminal, foundational works of the shoegaze subgenre, that the album cover is a shot of the interior of Hôtel Tassel in Brussels, or that much of the band's commercial failure had to do with Sandoval's stage fright, and not (as might otherwise be surmised) due to a lack of musical innovation.

[Republican Party Stalwart]

I wonder what portion of that 77% actually knows that the official name of the country controlling Taiwan is the "Republic of China," that the area controlled by the ROC includes the islands of Kinmen and Lienchiang on the Mainland Side of the Taiwan Strait, that the correct name of the area controlled by the ROC is the "Free Area of the Republic of China," that the population of the Free Area of the ROC is over 97% ethnically Han Chinese and only 2% Aboriginal, or that the official language of the ROC is Standard Mandarin Chinese, or that the primary spoken languages of the ROC are Mandarin, Hokkien, Hakka, and Fuzhounese.

OK? All of that is completely irrelevant.

It actually is quite relevant to the topic of whether American politicians should have a negative attitude and policy towards the People's Republic of China, as I think most sensible people would agree that it would be foolish to perform actions which potentially provoke nuclear war based on the opinion of a misinformed or disinformed public.

[Zohran "The Sword of Islam" Mamdani]

It actually is quite relevant to the topic of whether American politicians should have a negative attitude and policy towards the People's Republic of China, as I think most sensible people would agree that it would be foolish to perform actions which potentially provoke nuclear war based on the opinion of a misinformed or disinformed public.

The information you listed, although important, is not pertinent. The average American knows that China is a repressive dictatorship (currently sliding even deeper into authoritarianism) that is seeking to undermine American influence abroad and seize territory from its neighbors. This is the information that matters when determining foreign policy towards China, not the language they speak in Taiwan. Hard to understand why you think that's relevant.

[Fmr. Gov. NickG]

Literally everything you said is false lol.

Now, let's look at some facts:

*China viewed favorably by 15% of Americans; Taiwan by 77%
*Approximately two-thirds of Americans say China’s military, economic powers are critical threats

SOURCE: https://news.gallup.com/poll/471551/record-low-americans-view-china-favorably.aspx

I wonder what portion of that 77% actually knows that the official name of the country controlling Taiwan is the "Republic of China," that the area controlled by the ROC includes the islands of Kinmen and Lienchiang on the Mainland Side of the Taiwan Strait, that the correct name of the area controlled by the ROC is the "Free Area of the Republic of China," that the population of the Free Area of the ROC is over 97% ethnically Han Chinese and only 2% Aboriginal, or that the official language of the ROC is Standard Mandarin Chinese, or that the primary spoken languages of the ROC are Mandarin, Hokkien, Hakka, and Fuzhounese.

I wonder what portion of the remaining 23% actually knows that the hit song from the 90s "Fade Into You" was written by a band called Mazzy Star, that the band originally consisted primarily of vocalist Hope Sandoval and guitarist David Roback (although the lineup also included guest musicians, contributing to the band's dreamy and atmospheric sound), that despite not achieving commercial success the album She Hangs Brightly is one of the seminal, foundational works of the shoegaze subgenre, that the album cover is a shot of the interior of Hôtel Tassel in Brussels, or that much of the band's commercial failure had to do with Sandoval's stage fright, and not (as might otherwise be surmised) due to a lack of musical innovation.

FWIW, these are both textbook examples in the polling industry of “double-barrelled questions”.
Should really be avoided unless you are deliberately trying to confuse the audience.  Which I’m guesing you are.

[Stranger in a strange land]

I wonder what portion of that 77% actually knows that the official name of the country controlling Taiwan is the "Republic of China," that the area controlled by the ROC includes the islands of Kinmen and Lienchiang on the Mainland Side of the Taiwan Strait, that the correct name of the area controlled by the ROC is the "Free Area of the Republic of China," that the population of the Free Area of the ROC is over 97% ethnically Han Chinese and only 2% Aboriginal, or that the official language of the ROC is Standard Mandarin Chinese, or that the primary spoken languages of the ROC are Mandarin, Hokkien, Hakka, and Fuzhounese.

OK? All of that is completely irrelevant.

It actually is quite relevant to the topic of whether American politicians should have a negative attitude and policy towards the People's Republic of China, as I think most sensible people would agree that it would be foolish to perform actions which potentially provoke nuclear war based on the opinion of a misinformed or disinformed public.

Because Americans don't dislike China because it's Chinese. If anything, because it's 2024 and not the late 19th century, Chinese culture and Chinese people are viewed positively. Americans dislike it because it's a huge, oppressive dictatorship that engages in unfair trade practices against America and saber-rattling against its neighbors.

[ηєω ƒяσηтιєя]

Because Americans don't dislike China because it's Chinese. If anything, because it's 2024 and not the late 19th century, Chinese culture and Chinese people are viewed positively. Americans dislike it because it's a huge, oppressive dictatorship that engages in unfair trade practices against America and saber-rattling against its neighbors.

Yeah, literally. Most Americans generally had a positive opinion of China until the Tiananmen Square massacre in April 1989 (https://news.gallup.com/poll/1627/china.aspx).

However, favorable opinion of China was still in the 30s–40s until COVID, when it fell off a cliff into the current record low of 15%.

[Frodo]

The Republican Party under Trump has already effectively (after stabbing Ukraine in the back) aligned itself with Vladimir Putin, and his vision for the world. Now you want them to do the same with Xi Jinping.  I suppose it makes sense that a political party flirting with fascism and authoritarianism (with illiberal 'democracy' as a compromise) should seek likeminded allies around the world.  

[Crumpets]

Whether it's over authoritarian rule, communism, or just plain racism, most Americans across the political spectrum will respond positively to antagonism towards the Chinese government. Not much can be done to change that short of a total revolution, either here or there.