Seattle may ban caste discrimination

[DaleCooper]

This is a complete joke and should not pass at all . There is no discrimination based on caste in the US and saying so is beyond absurd and borderline Hinduphobia.
 
There is no reason to add caste to protected classes here .

We should be phobic towards Hindus who oppose bans on caste discrimination.

[OSR stands with Israel]

The 39-year-old immigrant from India, who asked to remain anonymous because of possible repercussions at work, said he felt troubled as soon as he heard the question “Do you eat meat?” from his Indian manager.

“That question just triggered me immediately,” the tech worker said. “I know the pattern.”

By admitting to eating meat, the tech worker had exposed himself as a member of an oppressed caste, or a Dalit, in the social hierarchy that is pervasive in South Asian countries. A person’s diet can be an indication of where someone stands in the caste system because those higher in the hierarchy, such as Brahmins, are often vegetarian.

Soon after, the tech worker said his manager started micromanaging him, stopped sending important projects his way, and denied him sufficient leave – even for his brother’s wedding.

“I know how to do my job. I’m very good at it. It’s always subtle,” the tech worker said about the discrimination he has faced at more than one job because of his caste.

Some members of South Asian communities say the problem of caste oppression in the U.S. has grown as more and more tech workers from India and other countries have come to the country for opportunities. Many say those from lower castes, especially Dalits, are forced to hide who they are. Although caste-based discrimination is illegal in India and other South Asian countries, the caste system remains prevalent.

This part is bs cause being the main vegetarian vs non vegetarian divide among Indians is not due to caste but rather an regional divide .
 




https://in.pinterest.com/pin/684617580835469108/

[OSR stands with Israel]

This is a complete joke and should not pass at all . There is no discrimination based on caste in the US and saying so is beyond absurd and borderline Hinduphobia.
 
There is no reason to add caste to protected classes here .

We should be phobic towards Hindus who oppose bans on caste discrimination.

I support these laws for India

[MasterJedi]

This is a complete joke and should not pass at all . There is no discrimination based on caste in the US and saying so is beyond absurd and borderline Hinduphobia.
 
There is no reason to add caste to protected classes here .

We should be phobic towards Hindus who oppose bans on caste discrimination.

I support these laws for India

We don’t need to tolerate it here because it does happen. This does help explain a lot about your views though.

[OSR stands with Israel]

This is a complete joke and should not pass at all . There is no discrimination based on caste in the US and saying so is beyond absurd and borderline Hinduphobia.
 
There is no reason to add caste to protected classes here .

We should be phobic towards Hindus who oppose bans on caste discrimination.

I support these laws for India

We don’t need to tolerate it here because it does happen. This does help explain a lot about your views though.

Is there a systematic problem cause that’s what these laws usually are meant to deal with .

I usually oppose government regulations on business anyway unless their are systematic problems so I am consistent on this

[Ferguson97]

This is a complete joke and should not pass at all . There is no discrimination based on caste in the US and saying so is beyond absurd and borderline Hinduphobia.
 
There is no reason to add caste to protected classes here .

We should be phobic towards Hindus who oppose bans on caste discrimination.

I support these laws for India

We don’t need to tolerate it here because it does happen. This does help explain a lot about your views though.

Is there a systematic problem cause that’s what these laws usually are meant to deal with .

There are several articles in this thread demonstrating that yes, it is a systemic issue.

There is literally no reason not to make it a protected class.

[OSR stands with Israel]

This is a complete joke and should not pass at all . There is no discrimination based on caste in the US and saying so is beyond absurd and borderline Hinduphobia.
 
There is no reason to add caste to protected classes here .

We should be phobic towards Hindus who oppose bans on caste discrimination.

I support these laws for India

We don’t need to tolerate it here because it does happen. This does help explain a lot about your views though.

Is there a systematic problem cause that’s what these laws usually are meant to deal with .

There are several articles in this thread demonstrating that yes, it is a systemic issue.

There is literally no reason not to make it a protected class.

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

[有爭議嘅領土 of The Figgis Agency]

The 39-year-old immigrant from India, who asked to remain anonymous because of possible repercussions at work, said he felt troubled as soon as he heard the question “Do you eat meat?” from his Indian manager.

“That question just triggered me immediately,” the tech worker said. “I know the pattern.”

By admitting to eating meat, the tech worker had exposed himself as a member of an oppressed caste, or a Dalit, in the social hierarchy that is pervasive in South Asian countries. A person’s diet can be an indication of where someone stands in the caste system because those higher in the hierarchy, such as Brahmins, are often vegetarian.

Soon after, the tech worker said his manager started micromanaging him, stopped sending important projects his way, and denied him sufficient leave – even for his brother’s wedding.

“I know how to do my job. I’m very good at it. It’s always subtle,” the tech worker said about the discrimination he has faced at more than one job because of his caste.

Some members of South Asian communities say the problem of caste oppression in the U.S. has grown as more and more tech workers from India and other countries have come to the country for opportunities. Many say those from lower castes, especially Dalits, are forced to hide who they are. Although caste-based discrimination is illegal in India and other South Asian countries, the caste system remains prevalent.

This part is bs cause being the main vegetarian vs non vegetarian divide among Indians is not due to caste but rather an regional divide .
 


https://in.pinterest.com/pin/684617580835469108/

The subject of the OP article doesn't technically need to be a dalit to experience caste discrimination. Even in the least veg parts of India, lacto-vegetarianism is a social divide between brahmins and non-brahmins.

I agree that subcontinentals in the US generally dgaf about caste (it also exists in Pakistan and Bangladesh!) and that the issue is overblown online. (FWIW a lot of 2nd gen Indians I went to high school with who're partnered aren't even dating/married to other South Asians). But the absence of widespread caste discrimination among adult immigrants doesn't mean caste shouldn't be made a protected class in the few scenarios where it may be relevant.

From the link in my other post:

Since more than half of Indian Americans arrived after the turn of the millennium, they have brought many aspects of their culture to the US, some of which likely do include unpleasant attitudes around caste and jati that were nurtured on the subcontinent. But the social context of the US is entirely different to India; the reality is that the Indian communal dynamics do not and cannot apply.

Does this mean that Dalit Americans experience no discrimination or prejudice? Of course not. But there is a huge difference between India and the US in the pervasiveness of caste-based discrimination. America undoubtedly has many social ills relating to class and ethnicity, but this isn’t because India is importing its own problems to the US. The vast majority of Indians come to the US for a simple reason: to get rich, not to maintain caste hierarchy.

[Alben Barkley]

Well, my bad. I thought there might be some "liberals" claiming this is discriminating against minority cultures based on some people's attitudes toward Islam over the years, but clearly I was wrong. Instead liberal/left-leaning posters are uniformly for this while OSR has outed himself as a believer in the caste system, using an embarrassing amount of mental gymnastics to pretend that's not why he opposes this. Yikes! This ain't it, Chief! Be better!

[OSR stands with Israel]

Well, my bad. I thought there might be some "liberals" claiming this is discriminating against minority cultures based on some people's attitudes toward Islam over the years, but clearly I was wrong. Instead liberal/left-leaning posters are uniformly for this while OSR has outed himself as a believer in the caste system, using an embarrassing amount of mental gymnastics to pretend that's not why he opposes this. Yikes! This ain't it, Chief! Be better!

This is completely ridiculous and 100% untrue , given I support these types of laws in India . I am just opposed to government regulations unless it’s critically needed .

How do these define caste discrimination cause the vegetarian example they used was horrific there and is this gonna be a back door way to add another group to  affirmative action .

[Ferguson97]

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

Do you think that is should be legal for an Indian-American immigrant, who comes from the Kshatriyas caste, to explicitly fire or decline to hire another Indian-American immigrant because they come from the Sudra caste?

[OSR stands with Israel]

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

Do you think that is should be legal for an Indian-American immigrant, who comes from the Kshatriyas caste, to explicitly fire or decline to hire another Indian-American immigrant because they come from the Sudra caste?

Of course not

[Ferguson97]

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

Do you think that is should be legal for an Indian-American immigrant, who comes from the Kshatriyas caste, to explicitly fire or decline to hire another Indian-American immigrant because they come from the Sudra caste?

Of course not

Okay, then you support the law Seattle is passing.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

This part is bs cause being the main vegetarian vs non vegetarian divide among Indians is not due to caste but rather an regional divide .
 




https://in.pinterest.com/pin/684617580835469108/

This would be a much stronger argument if the various castes were distributed evenly across India, but, as I'm sure you know as well as I do, they are not. Caste isn't the only factor on that map (c.f. Punjab), but it's a pretty obvious one.

[OSR stands with Israel]

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

Do you think that is should be legal for an Indian-American immigrant, who comes from the Kshatriyas caste, to explicitly fire or decline to hire another Indian-American immigrant because they come from the Sudra caste?

Of course not

Okay, then you support the law Seattle is passing.

If this only applies to stuff like that yes .

On the other hand making comments like the vegetarian one should not be considered discrimination and most importantly there must be no affirmative action based on this .

[7,052,770]

Well, my bad. I thought there might be some "liberals" claiming this is discriminating against minority cultures based on some people's attitudes toward Islam over the years, but clearly I was wrong.

Serious question, not meant as an attack or dismissive - do you not have any liberal friends? I know you live in a red state, but so do I, and most people interact on any given day are liberal/Democrats.

I ask because you seem to often completely miss the mark on how actual, real-life liberals think and act. Obviously none of us were going to oppose this law (or think you have to "suck trans dick to prove you're not a Nazi," etc.). It just seems like you buy into every stupid fake strateman stereotype conservatives make up about us without realizing you're doing it.

I can't speak for fake Twitter troll accounts, but I can speak for what actual Democratic politicians and people I interact with in real life actually say, think, and do, and your perception consistently doesn't match my reality.

[Badger]

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

Do you think that is should be legal for an Indian-American immigrant, who comes from the Kshatriyas caste, to explicitly fire or decline to hire another Indian-American immigrant because they come from the Sudra caste?

Of course not

Okay, then you support the law Seattle is passing.

If this only applies to stuff like that yes .

On the other hand making comments like the vegetarian one should not be considered discrimination and most importantly there must be no affirmative action based on this .

In one ear.....

Truly amazing how insertion of a few buzzwords completely devastates any productive reasoning.

[Dr. MB]

inb4 some "liberals" claim this is racist and discriminates against other cultures.

Or Gen. MacArthur when he finds out this was sponsored by Kshama Sawant

[Penn_Quaker_Girl]

This is a complete joke and should not pass at all . There is no discrimination based on caste in the US and saying so is beyond absurd and borderline Hinduphobia.
 
There is no reason to add caste to protected classes here .

We should be phobic towards Hindus who oppose bans on caste discrimination.

I support these laws for India

We don’t need to tolerate it here because it does happen. This does help explain a lot about your views though.

Is there a systematic problem cause that’s what these laws usually are meant to deal with .

There are several articles in this thread demonstrating that yes, it is a systemic issue.

There is literally no reason not to make it a protected class.

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

While I have my own feelings about the caste system (full disclosure: my family is Brahmana), I agree with OSR here that questioning one's vegetarianism isn't what I would consider "caste-based discrimination".  Also it is a pretty common question between Indians, at least in my experiences. 

[Badger]

This is a complete joke and should not pass at all . There is no discrimination based on caste in the US and saying so is beyond absurd and borderline Hinduphobia.
 
There is no reason to add caste to protected classes here .

We should be phobic towards Hindus who oppose bans on caste discrimination.

I support these laws for India

We don’t need to tolerate it here because it does happen. This does help explain a lot about your views though.

Is there a systematic problem cause that’s what these laws usually are meant to deal with .

There are several articles in this thread demonstrating that yes, it is a systemic issue.

There is literally no reason not to make it a protected class.

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

While I have my own feelings about the caste system (full disclosure: my family is Brahmana), I agree with OSR here that questioning one's vegetarianism isn't what I would consider "caste-based discrimination".  Also it is a pretty common question between Indians, at least in my experiences. 

But to also be fair to osr, it's pretty clear he opposes such measures on overall General conservatism considering it bestowing " special rights" and Akin to "affirmative action " (somehow).

[S019]

So I don’t agree that this is “Hinduphobia” or whatever, it’s mostly just virtue signaling, which while harmless, I doubt will achieve much of anything. Just as a personal example, I don’t even know my caste and didn’t know the caste system existed until we learned about in middle school history, so the idea that this is some sort of widespread phenomenon is just untrue. I think calling OSR a bigot for this is just unnecessary and borders on a personal attack, but I’ll trust Mr. X and texasgurl to deal with those. On the note of the vegetarianism thing, yes it is mostly geographic. Anyways, I don’t have strong feelings on this either way because I doubt it will do anything (how can you even prove caste discrimination?). I also have no intention to return to this thread, so please don’t quote my posts.

[LostFellow]

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

While I have my own feelings about the caste system (full disclosure: my family is Brahmana), I agree with OSR here that questioning one's vegetarianism isn't what I would consider "caste-based discrimination".  Also it is a pretty common question between Indians, at least in my experiences.  

I don't understand why y'all are purposefully missing the context here. To quote Khuzifenq's excerpt from the article again (which is just the main article that no one has seem to have read...):

The 39-year-old immigrant from India, who asked to remain anonymous because of possible repercussions at work, said he felt troubled as soon as he heard the question “Do you eat meat?” from his Indian manager.

“That question just triggered me immediately,” the tech worker said. “I know the pattern.”

Soon after, the tech worker said his manager started micromanaging him, stopped sending important projects his way, and denied him sufficient leave – even for his brother’s wedding.

“I know how to do my job. I’m very good at it. It’s always subtle,” the tech worker said about the discrimination he has faced at more than one job because of his caste.

It's not just the just the question of eating meat---if there was nothing after that, then said tech worker would obviously not have complaints regarding discrimination. Yes, in a friendly environment asking about eating meat/other dietary restrictions is common among the Indian diaspora. But this is between a manager than their employee, where the employee's immigration status likely relies on sucking up to bosses.

Provided how ruthless workplaces can be, I don't see any justness in being tepid on anti-discrimination clauses. Obviously said employee could theoretically be making everything up and their boss could have legitimate reasons for all the things that occurred, but that can be applied to any anecdotal evidence. I find it reasonable to believe the testimony here, at least.

[Continential]

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

Do you think that is should be legal for an Indian-American immigrant, who comes from the Kshatriyas caste, to explicitly fire or decline to hire another Indian-American immigrant because they come from the Sudra caste?

As a member of the Shurda caste or something close to it as non Dalit/Brahmin castes are loosely inter together in southern india - they would be idiots to do so given how people like my family in America are professionals and honestly if someone ever fired me over my caste status I’d honestly laugh. You presumably know nothing about Indian castes.

[LostFellow]

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

Do you think that is should be legal for an Indian-American immigrant, who comes from the Kshatriyas caste, to explicitly fire or decline to hire another Indian-American immigrant because they come from the Sudra caste?

As a member of the Shurda caste or something close to it as non Dalit/Brahmin castes are loosely inter together in southern india - they would be idiots to do so given how people like my family in America are professionals and honestly if someone ever fired me over my caste status I’d honestly laugh. You presumably know nothing about Indian castes.

Aren't you like 14-15? Do you even know what it feels like to get fired? Have you had the responsibility of being reliant on Visa status and needing to tell your family that you need to find a job on 2 months or you're all moving back? Nothing to laugh over.

[Continential]

One of the articles literally had someone saying that being asked if they are vegetarian or not is caste based discrimination which is absurd given the map I just showed . It’s an extremely common question Indians ask other Indians so to say it’s caste based discrimination is ridiculous

Do you think that is should be legal for an Indian-American immigrant, who comes from the Kshatriyas caste, to explicitly fire or decline to hire another Indian-American immigrant because they come from the Sudra caste?

As a member of the Shurda caste or something close to it as non Dalit/Brahmin castes are loosely inter together in southern india - they would be idiots to do so given how people like my family in America are professionals and honestly if someone ever fired me over my caste status I’d honestly laugh. You presumably know nothing about Indian castes.

Aren't you like 14-15? Do you even know what it feels like to get fired? Have you had the responsibility of being reliant on Visa status and needing to tell your family that you need to find a job on 2 months or you're all moving back? Nothing to laugh over.

I was born here and I was speaking for myself because Ferguson presumed that there are no people of my caste on this forum, for which he is wrong. For the hypothetical immigrant who you were talking about who got fired - I would feel sorry for them but ultimately they have a similar lifestyle back in India if they are upper middle class Indians.