A big problem with the "anyone raised Catholic is culturally Catholic" claim that came to me today

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Another random thought that came into my head, but again I think this is a good counterexample to this Atlas mindset that for some reason I can't seem to find anywhere else on the Internet, including Twitter.

But anyway:

Let's say someone is baptized and raised Catholic, then they fall out and stop practicing. Then as an adult they get involved with a different church and become a hipster Christian and become deep into that church. Simple scenario, happens to a lot of people. So what are they now? Well even on Atlas most people seem to agree that person is then a hipster Christian (or *insert denomination here* if they converted to a denominational church, the point is the same), it's legitimate conversion. OK.

Now let's say that for whatever reasons that person falls out of the church and habit and just kind of ceases going. Maybe they become a Christmas and Easter type for it if even that. Again this happens a lot too, I saw it with way too many people leading to my old church's decline. They're not really an actively practicing Christian anymore and aren't really more than they were in the period between leaving Catholicism and joining *new church*. So what are they now?

Because to use the oakvale logic that they effectively revert to Catholic is REALLY weird. For one how many of those people would even associate Christianity primarily with Catholicism? Why would something from your middle school years over 20 years ago be more prominent or important to you than something as an adult, especially if this person even got married and/or baptized/dedicated their kids at this church. It's obvious what they're going to culturally associate more with, even if they're not an actively practicing member anymore.

And (here's a pretty hot take for here but for whatever not on the greater Internet): that association with the later church probably holds stronger regardless of whatever that person's surname is, or rather the ethnicity commonly associated with it.

Kind of a random thought, but it did come to me today that I actually do know a few people like this, and I just can not possibly imagine a former Catholic turned hipster Christian who fell out of practice of even being a hipster Christian identifying as Catholic from that point on even in a purely nominal or cultural sense, nor is there really any logical reason to expect them to.

[NYDem]

Why do you write these critiques of arguments that almost nobody makes while acting like they're "common Atlas views"? You've also done this with "Atlas thinks not liking rap is racist", "Atlas thinks that Biden is under pressure to pardon Trump" and many others.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Why do you write these critiques of arguments that almost nobody makes while acting like they're "common Atlas views"? You've also done this with "Atlas thinks not liking rap is racist", "Atlas thinks that Biden is under pressure to pardon Trump" and many others.

Because in this case it absolutely has been said here even if primarily by someone who very rarely posts anymore (oakvale.)

[John Dule]

Why do you write these critiques of arguments that almost nobody makes while acting like they're "common Atlas views"? You've also done this with "Atlas thinks not liking rap is racist", "Atlas thinks that Biden is under pressure to pardon Trump" and many others.

He has time on his hands.

[All Along The Watchtower]

Why do you write these critiques of arguments that almost nobody makes while acting like they're "common Atlas views"? You've also done this with "Atlas thinks not liking rap is racist", "Atlas thinks that Biden is under pressure to pardon Trump" and many others.

Because in this case it absolutely has been said here even if primarily by someone who very rarely posts anymore (oakvale.)

Have you considered that he was trolling you?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Why do you write these critiques of arguments that almost nobody makes while acting like they're "common Atlas views"? You've also done this with "Atlas thinks not liking rap is racist", "Atlas thinks that Biden is under pressure to pardon Trump" and many others.

Because in this case it absolutely has been said here even if primarily by someone who very rarely posts anymore (oakvale.)

Have you considered that he was trolling you?

Then why did a good chunk of the forum at least semi-defend him?

[𝕭𝖆𝖕𝖙𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖆 𝕸𝖎𝖓𝖔𝖑𝖆]

Why do you write these critiques of arguments that almost nobody makes while acting like they're "common Atlas views"? You've also done this with "Atlas thinks not liking rap is racist", "Atlas thinks that Biden is under pressure to pardon Trump" and many others.

Because in this case it absolutely has been said here even if primarily by someone who very rarely posts anymore (oakvale.)

Have you considered that he was trolling you?

Then why did a good chunk of the forum at least semi-defend him?

Because you let yourself be trolled and a good chunk of the forum finds it funny.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Why do you write these critiques of arguments that almost nobody makes while acting like they're "common Atlas views"? You've also done this with "Atlas thinks not liking rap is racist", "Atlas thinks that Biden is under pressure to pardon Trump" and many others.

Because in this case it absolutely has been said here even if primarily by someone who very rarely posts anymore (oakvale.)

Have you considered that he was trolling you?

Then why did a good chunk of the forum at least semi-defend him?

Because you let yourself be trolled and a good chunk of the forum finds it funny.

Were you even around when he was a prominent poster?

Regardless even you'd have to admit the above described person is very unlikely to identify as Catholic or feel connected in any type of even very loose and purely cultural sense. After all isn't part of this talking point that such people usually still get married in a Catholic church/have their kids baptized as such? But that doesn't apply to many of the above.

Or stuff like this:

Many of the cultural/cafeteria Catholics don't quit the RCC because they feel some sort of vague connection, whether it be via force of habit/family tradition, or just because they grew up in it and its what they are familiar with. Also, Catholicism isn't exactly favorable to schisms, so it's not like Protestants who just start a new church if they disagree on a major issue.

Believe it or not, most people don't spend much time thinking about their belief systems, religious or political or whatever.

So what about the people in the scenarios? Who are all quite plausible scenarios. I don't get the whole idea some promote that basically every single person raised Catholic ALWAYS ALWAYS feels these cultural connections because for tons of people that'd not true yeah they really don't give a sh!t. 1/3 of people in the US raised Catholic does not identify as such anymore. not "doesn't attend Mass anymore" doesn't IDENTIFY as being Catholic on ANY level. Its not an insignificant number.

Also I don't give the "Catholicism isn't friendly to schisms" point. It may be true but why would someone who doesn't actually believe in Catholicism care?

The thing is this, BRTD: Most people who were raised Catholic will still have fairly strong connections to the Church. My dad is pretty much an atheist, but he still feels very tied to Catholicism- he does the Sign of the Cross when he hears sirens, and follows Church affairs fairly closely.

It should also be noted that converting away from your religion, in most places, is equivalent to completely abandoning your culture.

The sort of people described above are CLEARLY not like Sol's dad.

[Del Tachi]

Why do you write these critiques of arguments that almost nobody makes while acting like they're "common Atlas views"? You've also done this with "Atlas thinks not liking rap is racist", "Atlas thinks that Biden is under pressure to pardon Trump" and many others.

Because BRTD is a troll.  That everyone thinks he’s sincere prolongs the gig. 

[RINO Tom]

As a Christian, having more cultural [Christian group] folks around would frankly be a lot better than now.  Fundies complain about more moderate churches being “social clubs,” but … even if that were true, so what?!  You still get to go to your church of choice, it shouldn’t bother you.  It gets people in a communal setting and promotes social interaction with people in an age where a lot more people (especially younger people) could use it.