Do you support a Universal Paid Sick Leave Program ?
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  Do you support a Universal Paid Sick Leave Program ?
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Question: Do you support a Universal Paid Sick Leave Program ?
#1
Yes
 
#2
No
 
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Total Voters: 68

Author Topic: Do you support a Universal Paid Sick Leave Program ?  (Read 1037 times)
President Johnson
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« Reply #25 on: December 02, 2022, 02:45:18 PM »

Obviously yes.

It's quite the norm here and no political party in Germany questions it, from left to right. None. You get up to six weeks paid sick leave here. In the few cases six weeks are exceeded, health insurance pays 70% of your previous net income.

The US unfortunately is lagging behind the rest of the world here, for literally no valid reason.

South Korea is the only other industrialized country without paid sick leave.


But it should be noted; that although it's not " mandated ", more and more companies are offering it.

Yeah, I think latter is a general and global trend, that an increasing number of companies no longer can "take employees for granted". A main reason is simple jobs disappearing and more individual work that requires either a higher education or sophisticated training, so employers are forced attract a workforce through various benefits.
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GP270watch
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« Reply #26 on: December 02, 2022, 02:52:43 PM »

 Unionized labor falling off in America is also directly correlated to why Americans have lagged the world in work benefits. When unions get benefits for their members they tend to be applied broadly to everybody because it's just easier. So many of the benefits that American workers have historically enjoyed are because of unions and progressive politcal movements not because companies felt generous or the so called free market mandated better benefits.

Eight Reasons to Thank Unions
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Joe Republic
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« Reply #27 on: December 02, 2022, 02:56:14 PM »

Unionized labor falling off in America is also directly correlated to why Americans have lagged the world in work benefits. When unions get benefits for their members they tend to be applied broadly to everybody because it's just easier. So many of the benefits that American workers have historically enjoyed are because of unions and progressive politcal movements not because companies felt generous or the so called free market mandated better benefits.

Some big companies (including ones I've worked for) also offered fairly generous benefits because they were terrified their employees might start whispering the 'u' word amongst themselves if they didn't.  But that arrangement only works if the threat of unionization exists to begin with.
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jojoju1998
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« Reply #28 on: December 02, 2022, 02:57:34 PM »

Unionized labor falling off in America is also directly correlated to why Americans have lagged the world in work benefits. When unions get benefits for their members they tend to be applied broadly to everybody because it's just easier. So many of the benefits that American workers have historically enjoyed are because of unions and progressive politcal movements not because companies felt generous or the so called free market mandated better benefits.

Some big companies (including ones I've worked for) also offered fairly generous benefits because they were terrified their employees might start whispering the 'u' word amongst themselves if they didn't.  But that arrangement only works if the threat of unionization exists to begin with.

Ironically, many of the public sector jobs at least in California, don't have any paid maternity leave. And their sick leave provisions are frankly not that great.
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GP270watch
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« Reply #29 on: December 02, 2022, 02:59:20 PM »
« Edited: December 02, 2022, 03:04:35 PM by GP270watch »

Unionized labor falling off in America is also directly correlated to why Americans have lagged the world in work benefits. When unions get benefits for their members they tend to be applied broadly to everybody because it's just easier. So many of the benefits that American workers have historically enjoyed are because of unions and progressive politcal movements not because companies felt generous or the so called free market mandated better benefits.

Some big companies (including ones I've worked for) also offered fairly generous benefits because they were terrified their employees might start whispering the 'u' word amongst themselves if they didn't.  But that arrangement only works if the threat of unionization exists to begin with.

 Also the reason they end up extending union negotiated benefits to most employees. You can't convince an employee that unions suck when their members have numerous worker protections like paid days off, a safer workplace and you have squat.
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jojoju1998
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« Reply #30 on: December 02, 2022, 03:00:53 PM »

Unionized labor falling off in America is also directly correlated to why Americans have lagged the world in work benefits. When unions get benefits for their members they tend to be applied broadly to everybody because it's just easier. So many of the benefits that American workers have historically enjoyed are because of unions and progressive politcal movements not because companies felt generous or the so called free market mandated better benefits.

Some big companies (including ones I've worked for) also offered fairly generous benefits because they were terrified their employees might start whispering the 'u' word amongst themselves if they didn't.  But that arrangement only works if the threat of unionization exists to begin with.

 Also the reason they end up extending union negotiated benefits to most employees. You can't convince an employee that unions sucks when their members have numerous worker protections like paid days off, a safer workplace and you have squat.

My Dad had a coworker who wanted to take the rest of her vacation days, so that she could recharge and transition to her next job.

The owner fired her immediately.
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GP270watch
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« Reply #31 on: December 02, 2022, 03:03:01 PM »

Unionized labor falling off in America is also directly correlated to why Americans have lagged the world in work benefits. When unions get benefits for their members they tend to be applied broadly to everybody because it's just easier. So many of the benefits that American workers have historically enjoyed are because of unions and progressive politcal movements not because companies felt generous or the so called free market mandated better benefits.

Some big companies (including ones I've worked for) also offered fairly generous benefits because they were terrified their employees might start whispering the 'u' word amongst themselves if they didn't.  But that arrangement only works if the threat of unionization exists to begin with.

  Silicon Valley fears their engineers unionizing like crazy. Engineers produce so much value and the people who run Google, Apple, Microsoft, Amazon have paid them well but also never paid their true value since their economic output is outsized. Apple and some other companies were even caught colluding to depress wages and not higher each other's employees despite the high pay and benefits they offer.
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TDAS04
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« Reply #32 on: December 02, 2022, 03:04:20 PM »

Yes.
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jojoju1998
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« Reply #33 on: December 02, 2022, 03:05:30 PM »


How should the program be funded then ?
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GP270watch
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« Reply #34 on: December 02, 2022, 04:22:17 PM »


 From record breaking corporate profits as workers have received a smaller and smaller share of their productivity.

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Mercenary
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« Reply #35 on: December 03, 2022, 12:32:52 AM »

Ive never work3e anywhere that did have sick days, I didnt know any employers in the US didnt offer it. Or are we talking like long term sickness? Regarding sick days, I like places that wrap vacation and sick all into PTO as I rarely ever use sick days and they just go to waste. Everywhere should have a bonus week or two of PTO offerred to cover sick days.
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Joe Republic
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« Reply #36 on: December 03, 2022, 12:17:58 PM »

Yes, but some smaller businesses might not be able to afford it.  So put a number on the number of employees a company must have before it is mandatory (I'm not going to).

The problem with that is if small businesses won't offer paid sick time as a benefit, they may struggle to compete with the bigger companies in the hiring market.  Rather than be exempted from a federal law mandating paid leave, the government would step in to cover the tab for businesses under a certain size.
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Torie
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« Reply #37 on: December 03, 2022, 12:55:59 PM »

Do you have to prove that you are sick, or is it by the honor system?

That doesn't make any sense. What does make sense is to have X number of personal days, and you get overtime if offered and willing to give up personal days.
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Frodo
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« Reply #38 on: December 03, 2022, 01:01:35 PM »

Yes, of course.  I want everyone to enjoy the same benefits (paid sick leave included) I have with my own union.  
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TheElectoralBoobyPrize
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« Reply #39 on: December 03, 2022, 03:25:40 PM »

Not saying how much there should be, but yes. Also mandatory paid vacation. I am open to exemptions for small businesses.
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morgieb
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« Reply #40 on: December 03, 2022, 08:10:52 PM »

Of course.

Fortunately I live in a civilised society with paid sick leave/annual leave/etc.
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Grumpier Than Uncle Joe
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« Reply #41 on: December 05, 2022, 11:58:15 AM »

Yes, but some smaller businesses might not be able to afford it.  So put a number on the number of employees a company must have before it is mandatory (I'm not going to).

The problem with that is if small businesses won't offer paid sick time as a benefit, they may struggle to compete with the bigger companies in the hiring market.  Rather than be exempted from a federal law mandating paid leave, the government would step in to cover the tab for businesses under a certain size.

Your first sentence is absolutely correct.  But that's always been the case with small businesses trying to compete for talent.  They don't have the money the big boys due for great pay and benefits.  However the smart small businesses will, if they can afford it, offer it.  For my part time assistant, I pay her when she's sick, and she's making much much more than her past job.  There are other perks she has too.  But it's my choice to do it and she's outstanding so I do what I need to not to lose her.

I'm just not in favor of a government mandate for small businesses (pick an employee count number to define it) or another government program, to be honest.  So I support it but I'm just not sure if it's doable. 
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Grumpier Than Uncle Joe
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« Reply #42 on: December 05, 2022, 12:24:46 PM »

Yes, but some smaller businesses might not be able to afford it.  So put a number on the number of employees a company must have before it is mandatory (I'm not going to).

The problem with that is if small businesses won't offer paid sick time as a benefit, they may struggle to compete with the bigger companies in the hiring market.  Rather than be exempted from a federal law mandating paid leave, the government would step in to cover the tab for businesses under a certain size.

Your first sentence is absolutely correct.  But that's always been the case with small businesses trying to compete for talent.  They don't have the money the big boys due for great pay and benefits.  However the smart small businesses will, if they can afford it, offer it.  For my part time assistant, I pay her when she's sick, and she's making much much more than her past job.  There are other perks she has too.  But it's my choice to do it and she's outstanding so I do what I need to not to lose her.

I'm just not in favor of a government mandate for small businesses (pick an employee count number to define it) or another government program, to be honest.  So I support it but I'm just not sure if it's doable. 

Most countries do it through a social security type system where everyone pays into it via payroll taxes.

Understood.  I don't see that every happening in reality here.  We'll see.
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jojoju1998
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« Reply #43 on: December 05, 2022, 12:33:42 PM »

Yes, but some smaller businesses might not be able to afford it.  So put a number on the number of employees a company must have before it is mandatory (I'm not going to).

The problem with that is if small businesses won't offer paid sick time as a benefit, they may struggle to compete with the bigger companies in the hiring market.  Rather than be exempted from a federal law mandating paid leave, the government would step in to cover the tab for businesses under a certain size.

Your first sentence is absolutely correct.  But that's always been the case with small businesses trying to compete for talent.  They don't have the money the big boys due for great pay and benefits.  However the smart small businesses will, if they can afford it, offer it.  For my part time assistant, I pay her when she's sick, and she's making much much more than her past job.  There are other perks she has too.  But it's my choice to do it and she's outstanding so I do what I need to not to lose her.

I'm just not in favor of a government mandate for small businesses (pick an employee count number to define it) or another government program, to be honest.  So I support it but I'm just not sure if it's doable. 

Most countries do it through a social security type system where everyone pays into it via payroll taxes.

Understood.  I don't see that every happening in reality here.  We'll see.

Gillibrand's paid family/sick leave plan involves payroll taxes.
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JGibson
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« Reply #44 on: December 05, 2022, 03:34:51 PM »

Absolutely.
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