Trans activist: "Trans women are biological women"

[Helsinkian]

Remember when the officially promoted line was that sex and gender are two different things, with the first pertaining to biology and the latter to identity? Well, not anymore, as now trans activists are themselves trying to blur that distinction by declaring that "trans women are biological women".

https://twitter.com/EliErlick/status/1560330328119672834

Of course, if one were to accept what she is saying here, one could ask: "why do you then feel the need to even use the term 'trans woman' if you have stripped it of all meaning?" The Latin word "trans" means "beyond". If trans women were born women and are biological women and never changed, what is the "beyond" referring to?

[Goldwater]

Of course, if one were to accept what she is saying here, one could ask: "why do you then feel the need to even use the term 'trans woman' if you have stripped it of all meaning?" The Latin word "trans" means "beyond". If trans women were born women and are biological women and never changed, what is the "beyond" referring to?

So you are saying that both trans and cis women should just be referred to as "women"? How incredibly based and progressive of you.

[Helsinkian]

Of course, if one were to accept what she is saying here, one could ask: "why do you then feel the need to even use the term 'trans woman' if you have stripped it of all meaning?" The Latin word "trans" means "beyond". If trans women were born women and are biological women and never changed, what is the "beyond" referring to?

So you are saying that both trans and cis women should just be referred to as "women"? How incredibly based and progressive of you.

So you did not notice the words: "if one were to accept what she is saying"?

[Alben Barkley]

Objectively false but OK.

Also yes, I do remember when the line was that biological sex and gender identity were totally different things. Something I could get behind more easily. But then they went after JK Rowling for basically saying exactly that, and ever since it's been obvious the goal all along has been to erase the distinction entirely.

[Aurelius]

The follow up tweet is even more absurd:

https://mobile.twitter.com/EliErlick/status/1560330329977651201

...if there's no difference other than a doctor checking a box on a birth certificate, all those hormones and surgeries are just for fun, I guess?

This person is completely out of touch with reality. I'm starting to think the best response to these is just to ignore them and carry on, since they'll throw a fit at something or other anyway. Although it's easy for me to say this when I've worked only blue collar jobs over the past three years and haven't had hyper-PC HR bureaucrats breathing down my next. My most recent white-collar job (in software) was full of these exact sorts of arguments and language-policing on the slack chats, and this was a company founded by Mormons and with most of its workforce in Utah. I'm probably gonna be back at a tech job in a few months and it'll be quite the adjustment.

[Alben Barkley]

The follow up tweet is even more absurd:

https://mobile.twitter.com/EliErlick/status/1560330329977651201

...if there's no difference other than a doctor checking a box on a birth certificate, all those hormones and surgeries are just for fun, I guess?

This person is completely out of touch with reality. I'm starting to think the best response to these is just to ignore them and carry on, since they'll throw a fit at something or other anyway. Although it's easy for me to say this when I've worked only blue collar jobs over the past three years and haven't had hyper-PC HR bureaucrats breathing down my next. My most recent white-collar job (in software) was full of these exact sorts of arguments and language-policing on the slack chats, and this was a company founded by Mormons and with most of its workforce in Utah. I'm probably gonna be back at a tech job in a few months and it'll be quite the adjustment.

If there's no other difference, I'd like to see one of them try to give birth...

[Blow by blow, the passion dies]

That's insane

[President of the great nation of 🏳️‍⚧️]

She a little confused, but she got the spirit.

[DaleCooper]

I've suspected for a long time that the left's gender vs. sex distinction was just a temporary public position, with this being the end-goal.

[7,052,770]

Literally just one random person on Twitter who doesn't even have a blue check (!) and suddenly that means that "trans activists" are saying this, or even that this is now the opinion of "the left."

C'mon, man!

[Bleach Blonde Bad Built Butch Bodies for Biden]

generic f#ck Twatter post

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Twitter is garbage and anything said on it should be considered "guilty until proven innocent" as to if it has any quality or value whatsoever. Random idiots on it should not be taken seriously.

The follow up tweet is even more absurd:

https://mobile.twitter.com/EliErlick/status/1560330329977651201
...if there's no difference other than a doctor checking a box on a birth certificate, all those hormones and surgeries are just for fun, I guess?

This person is completely out of touch with reality. I'm starting to think the best response to these is just to ignore them and carry on, since they'll throw a fit at something or other anyway. Although it's easy for me to say this when I've worked only blue collar jobs over the past three years and haven't had hyper-PC HR bureaucrats breathing down my next. My most recent white-collar job (in software) was full of these exact sorts of arguments and language-policing on the slack chats, and this was a company founded by Mormons and with most of its workforce in Utah. I'm probably gonna be back at a tech job in a few months and it'll be quite the adjustment.

I work a job where Trump is openly mocked at team meetings and I haven't ran into anything like this aside from generic corporate Pride pandering emails in June.

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

I couldn't possibly know why support for gay rights has gone up 10% over the last four years while support for trans rights went down 6%.

Maybe it's because of these clowns.

[John Dule]

Literally just one random person on Twitter who doesn't even have a blue check (!) and suddenly that means that "trans activists" are saying this, or even that this is now the opinion of "the left."

C'mon, man!

Nobody is saying this, and if they are they're kidding, and if they're not they're unverified on Twitter, and if they are they're a fringe minority, and if there's a lot of them they don't represent all activists, and if they do they don't speak for the party, and if they do then everyone is saying this, so why aren't you, bigot?

[No War, but the War on Christmas]

I think the dichotomy here is between those people who deeply identify with their gender as a defining characteristic and those who simply view it as a characteristic and/or personal trait among many others.

I don't agree with the tweet but likewise it just doesn't bother me.

[Xing]

Twitter serves two purposes. It gives stupid people a megaphone, and it offers free strawmen for people as “proof” that everyone they disagree with is stupid and that every unfounded assumption they make is true.

[Anzeigenhauptmeister]

Literally just one random person on Twitter who doesn't even have a blue check (!) and suddenly that means that "trans activists" are saying this, or even that this is now the opinion of "the left."

C'mon, man!

Far-left trans activist and pseudo-physician Dr. Dana Mahr tries to talk Nobel Prize laureate Christiane Nüsslein-Volhard into believing that she has not the foggiest notion of biology; in her 21-part Tweet she, inter alia, claims that the the social gender is identical with the biological sex. Each of her 21 Tweets have received up to over 600 likes.

https://twitter.com/dana_mahr1/status/1561295439391080449

[Middle-aged Europe]

Remember when the officially promoted line was that sex and gender are two different things, with the first pertaining to biology and the latter to identity? Well, not anymore, as now trans activists are themselves trying to blur that distinction by declaring that "trans women are biological women".

Are you talking about trans activists or one random trans activist on Twitter? If it is the latter, what's the relevance?

I mean I'm sure if you're looking for it long enough, you will basically find any opinion on Twitter... which begs the question why we need this thread to point this self-evident fact out.


If this forum degenerates into a place which is primarily about "look, I've found that insane tweet on Twitter!" then it will merely become a soap opera-ish site of gossip-sharing.

[Helsinkian]

Are you talking about trans activists or one random trans activist on Twitter? If it is the latter, what's the relevance?

Another example of the same thing was cited just above your post. The most vocal activists are always the first ones to push for a new orthodoxy; they are the "early adapters". It then takes a while to spread. 20 years ago, a person saying that men can give birth was considered to be fringe. Now, if you say that men cannot give birth, you are liable to be banned from social media, fired from your job and prosecuted for hate speech.

[7,052,770]

Are you talking about trans activists or one random trans activist on Twitter? If it is the latter, what's the relevance?

Another example of the same thing was cited just above your post. The most vocal activists are always the first ones to push for a new orthodoxy; they are the "early adapters". It then takes a while to spread. 20 years ago, a person saying that men can give birth was considered to be fringe. Now, if you say that men cannot give birth, you are liable to be banned from social media, fired from your job and prosecuted for hate speech.

Give me a break. You ruin any point you're trying to make when you add in this "excessive hyperbole."

[Helsinkian]

Are you talking about trans activists or one random trans activist on Twitter? If it is the latter, what's the relevance?

Another example of the same thing was cited just above your post. The most vocal activists are always the first ones to push for a new orthodoxy; they are the "early adapters". It then takes a while to spread. 20 years ago, a person saying that men can give birth was considered to be fringe. Now, if you say that men cannot give birth, you are liable to be banned from social media, fired from your job and prosecuted for hate speech.

Give me a break. You ruin any point you're trying to make when you add in this "excessive hyperbole."

This is from Canada, and the source is CBC:

“Would it cover the accidental misuse of a pronoun? I would say it’s very unlikely,” Cossman says. “Would it cover a situation where an individual repeatedly, consistently refuses to use a person’s chosen pronoun? It might.”

If someone refused to use a preferred pronoun — and it was determined to constitute discrimination or harassment — could that potentially result in jail time?

It is possible, Brown says, through a process that would start with a complaint and progress to a proceeding before a human rights tribunal. If the tribunal rules that harassment or discrimination took place, there would typically be an order for monetary and non-monetary remedies. A non-monetary remedy may include sensitivity training, issuing an apology, or even a publication ban, he says.

If the person refused to comply with the tribunal's order, this would result in a contempt proceeding being sent to the Divisional or Federal Court, Brown says. The court could then potentially send a person to jail “until they purge the contempt,” he says.

“It could happen,” Brown says. “Is it likely to happen? I don’t think so. But, my opinion on whether or not that's likely has a lot to do with the particular case that you're looking at.”

“The path to prison is not straightforward. It’s not easy. But, it’s there. It’s been used before in breach of tribunal orders.”

https://www.cbc.ca/cbcdocspov/features/canadas-gender-identity-rights-bill-c-16-explained

[7,052,770]

Are you talking about trans activists or one random trans activist on Twitter? If it is the latter, what's the relevance?

Another example of the same thing was cited just above your post. The most vocal activists are always the first ones to push for a new orthodoxy; they are the "early adapters". It then takes a while to spread. 20 years ago, a person saying that men can give birth was considered to be fringe. Now, if you say that men cannot give birth, you are liable to be banned from social media, fired from your job and prosecuted for hate speech.

Give me a break. You ruin any point you're trying to make when you add in this "excessive hyperbole."

This is from Canada, and the source is CBC:

“Would it cover the accidental misuse of a pronoun? I would say it’s very unlikely,” Cossman says. “Would it cover a situation where an individual repeatedly, consistently refuses to use a person’s chosen pronoun? It might.”

If someone refused to use a preferred pronoun — and it was determined to constitute discrimination or harassment — could that potentially result in jail time?

It is possible, Brown says, through a process that would start with a complaint and progress to a proceeding before a human rights tribunal. If the tribunal rules that harassment or discrimination took place, there would typically be an order for monetary and non-monetary remedies. A non-monetary remedy may include sensitivity training, issuing an apology, or even a publication ban, he says.

If the person refused to comply with the tribunal's order, this would result in a contempt proceeding being sent to the Divisional or Federal Court, Brown says. The court could then potentially send a person to jail “until they purge the contempt,” he says.

“It could happen,” Brown says. “Is it likely to happen? I don’t think so. But, my opinion on whether or not that's likely has a lot to do with the particular case that you're looking at.”

“The path to prison is not straightforward. It’s not easy. But, it’s there. It’s been used before in breach of tribunal orders.”

https://www.cbc.ca/cbcdocspov/features/canadas-gender-identity-rights-bill-c-16-explained

The scenario you describe goes way, way beyond "saying a man cannot give birth" and even then is full of references to how it won't actually happen.

[Helsinkian]

Refusing to refer to a "birthing person" as a "he" rather than a "she" and not backing down from that position would be the exact scenario described there. And the lawyer interviewed literally says that jailing someone for it "could happen", even if other punishments are more likely. And even short of jail, being subjected to "monetary remedies" or a "publication ban" for using a non-preferred pronoun is pretty incredible too.

[Middle-aged Europe]

Another example of the same thing was cited just above your post.

Actually, as far as I could ascertain, it wasn't.

And even if it had been, it would have been two out of 230 million Twitter users.

The most vocal activists are always the first ones to push for a new orthodoxy; they are the "early adapters". It then takes a while to spread. 20 years ago, a person saying that men can give birth was considered to be fringe. Now, if you say that men cannot give birth, you are liable to be banned from social media, fired from your job and prosecuted for hate speech.

Speculation without evidence. You are describing what you fear could happen. This seems to be more about your own fears than the actual reality.

[parochial boy]

And merely being trans means leaves someone far more vulnerable to physical and sexual violence (cite); homelessness; family rejection and social isolation (cite) or exclusion from the jobs market.

It is incredibly petulant to sit back and whine about how your god given "right" to bully transpeople might, maybe have consequences if you take it too far; whilst people who never did anything wrong actually have to experience real and heartbreaking suffering as a result of your hatred. I mean, grow up, start thinking about the actual human impact instead of indulging in these ridiculous culture wars as if the actual people concerned were just some virtual opponent for you to joust against.