Will Turkey and Hungary Sign Off on Admitting Finland and Sweden Into NATO?

[Coldstream]

Expel Turkey & Hungary and substitute Sweden and Finland. See how well Orban does without Western money propping him up.

Turkey isn't going to be expelled. Orban knows very well that Hungary might be if they are the only roadblock, so he will simply drag his feet unless/until Turkey is no longer obstructing Finland and Sweden.

It's very complicated. There are no provisions in the North Atlantic Treaty for suspension of membership rights or expulsion of a member.

You'd need to claim that a member state is in material breach of the treaty, and that it is severe and persistent enough to effectively repudiate the treaty. The other NATO member states would then be entitled to suspend the operation of the treaty "in whole or in part" or to terminate it either in their relations with the defaulting state or generally, but all of that would require a unanimous decision of the North Atlantic Council (excl. the offending state). I'm not sure e.g. Croatia or Bulgaria would support such radical measures against Hungary even if Turkey agreed to them.

In fact, even the idea is absurd. No NATO member is obliged to support enlargement let alone ratifying the accession of membership candidates. That's entirely their decision – and if they don't want to, they're well within their rights.

Finland and Sweden are applicants, nothing more. They have no God-given right to join within a specific time period.

That being said, delaying the process is not the same as rejecting it; I am still convinced that both will ultimately come on board.
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PS: General remark, but "Expel X from NATO/Expel Y from EU/Sanction Z/Nuke them all" is not how politics are conducted in the real world. This also applies to all these maximalist positions when it comes to Ukraine.

Pretending simple issues like ‘should autocrat thugs like Erdogan & Orban be allowed to obstruct NATO?’ (no) are complex isn’t mature or intelligent, it’s naive at best, and more likely a disingenuous cover for the fact you want NATO to be as impotent as possible when dealing with Russia.

If that’s what you want you should have the guts to say it rather than obfuscating by acting like there is a grey area here.

[No War, but the War on Christmas]

I’m honestly done with both these authoritarian drama queens, it should’ve been a 2 for 2 trade for Sweden and Finland.

What do you know, my take from August is aging pretty well and I stand by it.

Long-term Hungary and/or Turkey can be re-admitted if they decide they want to play by the rules and actually uphold purported NATO values. Actually standing for something is a far-better long-term strategy than simply taking the 'all aboard' approach and allowing Trojan horses like Orban to sabotage NATO from within.

[crals]

Finland and Sweden have received security guarantees while they wait for their applications to go through, right? They can wait it out.

[Frodo]

That leaves Turkey as the lone holdout, assuming the Hungarians keep their word:

Hungary to ratify NATO bids of Sweden, Finland by year end: Minister
Expansion of alliance should be approved in Budapest by mid-December, Orbán’s chief of staff says.

[Antonio the Sixth]

I actually missed Slovakia ratifying it. Apparently that was back in late September? That's a relief, as the political crisis there has gone from bad to worse, and it has an unusual amount of pro-Russia sentiment.

Hopefully Erdogan too will bend the knee soon enough.

[Storr]

That leaves Turkey as the lone holdout, assuming the Hungarians keep their word:

Hungary to ratify NATO bids of Sweden, Finland by year end: Minister
Expansion of alliance should be approved in Budapest by mid-December, Orbán’s chief of staff says.

Interesting way to approach NATO expansion, but no doubt the pressure on from...everyone else (sans Turkey) for Hungary to ratify is heavy:

"Asked by a reporter if NATO would be getting stronger with Finland and Sweden joining, Gulyás replied that he hoped so. He added that it could be debated whether the expansion is in Hungary’s national security interest, but said that this is irrelevant now, according to the reports."

[Frodo]

I actually missed Slovakia ratifying it. Apparently that was back in late September? That's a relief, as the political crisis there has gone from bad to worse, and it has an unusual amount of pro-Russia sentiment.

Yup -I didn't post it at the time since I regarded it as a foregone conclusion:

Slovak parliament approves NATO membership for Finland, Sweden

[HillGoose]

hell yeah, the alliance will continue to expand