After RBG’s death, Moore v Harper might kill American Democracy forever
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  After RBG’s death, Moore v Harper might kill American Democracy forever
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Question: ?
#1
Yes, it has a decent chance to survive
 
#2
No, it’s doomed forever because of SCOTUS
 
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Total Voters: 74

Author Topic: After RBG’s death, Moore v Harper might kill American Democracy forever  (Read 8296 times)
I’m not Stu
ERM64man
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« Reply #25 on: February 09, 2022, 01:11:00 AM »

I really hope US democracy survives this SCOTUS.
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World politics is up Schmitt creek
Nathan
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« Reply #26 on: February 09, 2022, 03:00:48 AM »
« Edited: February 09, 2022, 11:00:24 PM by Butlerian Jihad »

MarkD treating it as self-evidently ridiculous to think the US had a democratic deficit before the OMOV rulings is definitely not a stance on this with which I agree, but neither is ERM64MAN's dooming. I call out both sides. Do tankies and Bernie Bros think US democracy has a decent chance to survive the current SCOTUS?
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I’m not Stu
ERM64man
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« Reply #27 on: February 09, 2022, 04:51:48 PM »

Aren't the only options pack SCOTUS or lose US democracy forever and never get it back?
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Continential
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« Reply #28 on: February 10, 2022, 06:52:45 PM »

I really hope US democracy survives this SCOTUS.
lol
If American democracy dies, it won't die because of the Supreme Court.
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I’m not Stu
ERM64man
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« Reply #29 on: February 10, 2022, 09:19:37 PM »

I really hope US democracy survives this SCOTUS.
lol
If American democracy dies, it won't die because of the Supreme Court.
What? If it dies, it will almost certainly be because of SCOTUS. Destroying the VRA even more than it has so far and possibly overturning Reynolds v. Sims/Wesberry v. Sanders and letting state legislatures and officials overturn elections.
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politicallefty
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« Reply #30 on: February 12, 2022, 08:45:04 AM »

I haven't been amongst the doomers when it comes to the new composition of the Court, but I do feel like things have taken a rather ominous turn in the past few months. I'll know we're in big trouble if they go after Arizona State Legislature v. Arizona Independent Redistricting Commission. I think that would be their first salvo before going after the Warren Court precedents. This is why I feel the anti-gerrymandering provisions of the FTVA are so important. If the commissions go down, we're in big trouble. If they went further and wiped out any state-level regulations (not to mention possibly Section 2 of the VRA), Democrats are locked out of the House no matter what the popular vote is.
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I’m not Stu
ERM64man
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« Reply #31 on: February 22, 2022, 08:08:57 PM »
« Edited: February 22, 2022, 08:23:43 PM by ERM64man »

Is there a good chance Democrats won’t be locked out of power forever due to SCOTUS rulings?


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I’m not Stu
ERM64man
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« Reply #32 on: February 24, 2022, 11:22:51 AM »

If SCOTUS goes completely crazy, will anyone eventually do something about it?
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Person Man
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« Reply #33 on: February 25, 2022, 12:27:05 PM »

If SCOTUS goes completely crazy, will anyone eventually do something about it?

If Democrats eventually do get to ride a backlash into power (or are able to survive until the Republican Party drops the ball some other way), they can always either 1) devolve certain things to the Circuit Courts or 2) ignore their rulings.
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NewYorkExpress
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« Reply #34 on: February 25, 2022, 01:09:38 PM »

At this point, we'll lucky if the Supreme Court doesn't overturn Marbury v. Madison by 2040.
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Associate Justice PiT
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« Reply #35 on: February 25, 2022, 01:12:04 PM »

If SCOTUS goes completely crazy, will anyone eventually do something about it?

If Democrats eventually do get to ride a backlash into power (or are able to survive until the Republican Party drops the ball some other way), they can always either 1) devolve certain things to the Circuit Courts or 2) ignore their rulings.

     Democrats will inevitably return to power. Thing is that simply ignoring rulings once they get there sets a very poor precedent that will come back to bite everyone.
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President Punxsutawney Phil
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« Reply #36 on: February 25, 2022, 01:12:58 PM »

At this point, we'll lucky if the Supreme Court doesn't overturn Marbury v. Madison by 2040.
Why would SCOTUS overturn Marbury vs Madison?
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NewYorkExpress
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« Reply #37 on: February 25, 2022, 01:57:50 PM »

At this point, we'll lucky if the Supreme Court doesn't overturn Marbury v. Madison by 2040.
Why would SCOTUS overturn Marbury vs Madison?

Because they're overturning literally everything else?
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President Punxsutawney Phil
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« Reply #38 on: February 25, 2022, 01:59:00 PM »

At this point, we'll lucky if the Supreme Court doesn't overturn Marbury v. Madison by 2040.
Why would SCOTUS overturn Marbury vs Madison?
Because they're overturning literally everything else?
Even if they were overturning everything else, why would they overturn the decision that is the very legal basis for a big chunk of their supreme authority in the first place?
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I’m not Stu
ERM64man
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« Reply #39 on: February 25, 2022, 07:39:07 PM »
« Edited: February 25, 2022, 08:13:42 PM by ERM64man »

If SCOTUS goes completely crazy, will anyone eventually do something about it?

If Democrats eventually do get to ride a backlash into power (or are able to survive until the Republican Party drops the ball some other way), they can always either 1) devolve certain things to the Circuit Courts or 2) ignore their rulings.

     Democrats will inevitably return to power. Thing is that simply ignoring rulings once they get there sets a very poor precedent that will come back to bite everyone.
I don’t believe Democrats will ever return to power because SCOTUS will lock them out forever. Gonzaga losing at home to Nebraska in men’s college is more likely than US democracy surviving this SCOTUS. An SCOTUS that actually makes John Roberts look like a great voting rights advocate. This SCOTUS could even overturn a presidential election.


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I’m not Stu
ERM64man
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« Reply #40 on: February 25, 2022, 08:14:06 PM »

If SCOTUS goes completely crazy, will anyone eventually do something about it?

If Democrats eventually do get to ride a backlash into power (or are able to survive until the Republican Party drops the ball some other way), they can always either 1) devolve certain things to the Circuit Courts or 2) ignore their rulings.

     Democrats will inevitably return to power. Thing is that simply ignoring rulings once they get there sets a very poor precedent that will come back to bite everyone.
I don’t believe Democrats will ever return to power because SCOTUS will lock them out forever. Gonzaga losing at home to Nebraska in men’s college is more likely than US democracy surviving this SCOTUS. This is a SCOTUS that actually makes John Roberts look like a great voting rights advocate. This SCOTUS could even overturn a presidential election.



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Donerail
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« Reply #41 on: February 25, 2022, 09:53:25 PM »

If SCOTUS goes completely crazy, will anyone eventually do something about it?

If Democrats eventually do get to ride a backlash into power (or are able to survive until the Republican Party drops the ball some other way), they can always either 1) devolve certain things to the Circuit Courts or 2) ignore their rulings.

Democrats will inevitably return to power. Thing is that simply ignoring rulings once they get there sets a very poor precedent that will come back to bite everyone.
and we wouldn't want a supreme court that ignores its own precedent, right?
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brucejoel99
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« Reply #42 on: February 25, 2022, 11:33:02 PM »

At this point, we'll be lucky if the Supreme Court doesn't overturn Marbury v. Madison by 2040.

Why would SCOTUS overturn Marbury vs Madison?

Because they're overturning literally everything else?

Why are you of the notion that SCOTUS would ever willingly wanna overturn their own power to willingly overturn things?
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NewYorkExpress
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« Reply #43 on: February 25, 2022, 11:46:22 PM »

At this point, we'll be lucky if the Supreme Court doesn't overturn Marbury v. Madison by 2040.

Why would SCOTUS overturn Marbury vs Madison?

Because they're overturning literally everything else?

Why are you of the notion that SCOTUS would ever willingly wanna overturn their own power to willingly overturn things?

Because the conservative justices really don't care what precedent they are setting?
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Associate Justice PiT
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« Reply #44 on: February 26, 2022, 12:56:54 AM »

If SCOTUS goes completely crazy, will anyone eventually do something about it?

If Democrats eventually do get to ride a backlash into power (or are able to survive until the Republican Party drops the ball some other way), they can always either 1) devolve certain things to the Circuit Courts or 2) ignore their rulings.

Democrats will inevitably return to power. Thing is that simply ignoring rulings once they get there sets a very poor precedent that will come back to bite everyone.
and we wouldn't want a supreme court that ignores its own precedent, right?

     That is what Brown v. Board of Education did and none of us would complain about that. The judiciary and executive branches have different roles to fulfill and are not governed by the same rules.
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Torie
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« Reply #45 on: February 26, 2022, 10:08:51 AM »

I find that question sufficiently tendentious that I don't think it worthy of a response. The biggest threat to American democracy is Americans demonizing disagreement, and cancelling each other, and self segregating over world views. Demonizing disagreement far too often is hubris on steroids.
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I’m not Stu
ERM64man
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« Reply #46 on: February 28, 2022, 09:38:43 AM »

If SCOTUS is too hostile to the power of Congress, I don’t see how democracy survives this. Eat Arby’s.

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Person Man
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« Reply #47 on: February 28, 2022, 03:25:02 PM »

If SCOTUS goes completely crazy, will anyone eventually do something about it?

If Democrats eventually do get to ride a backlash into power (or are able to survive until the Republican Party drops the ball some other way), they can always either 1) devolve certain things to the Circuit Courts or 2) ignore their rulings.

Democrats will inevitably return to power. Thing is that simply ignoring rulings once they get there sets a very poor precedent that will come back to bite everyone.
and we wouldn't want a supreme court that ignores its own precedent, right?

     That is what Brown v. Board of Education did and none of us would complain about that. The judiciary and executive branches have different roles to fulfill and are not governed by the same rules.

So there you have it. That's the one thing you do when then the court is illegitimate. You treat it like its illegitimate.
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I’m not Stu
ERM64man
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« Reply #48 on: February 28, 2022, 04:11:21 PM »

If SCOTUS goes completely crazy, will anyone eventually do something about it?

If Democrats eventually do get to ride a backlash into power (or are able to survive until the Republican Party drops the ball some other way), they can always either 1) devolve certain things to the Circuit Courts or 2) ignore their rulings.

Democrats will inevitably return to power. Thing is that simply ignoring rulings once they get there sets a very poor precedent that will come back to bite everyone.
and we wouldn't want a supreme court that ignores its own precedent, right?

     That is what Brown v. Board of Education did and none of us would complain about that. The judiciary and executive branches have different roles to fulfill and are not governed by the same rules.

So there you have it. That's the one thing you do when then the court is illegitimate. You treat it like its illegitimate.
Even if it gets treated as illegitimate, it still has all the power if it makes every crappy voting rights decision possible and democracy still dies and never comes back due to Supreme Court rulings. Eat Arby’s.

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Associate Justice PiT
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« Reply #49 on: February 28, 2022, 04:14:52 PM »

If SCOTUS goes completely crazy, will anyone eventually do something about it?

If Democrats eventually do get to ride a backlash into power (or are able to survive until the Republican Party drops the ball some other way), they can always either 1) devolve certain things to the Circuit Courts or 2) ignore their rulings.

Democrats will inevitably return to power. Thing is that simply ignoring rulings once they get there sets a very poor precedent that will come back to bite everyone.
and we wouldn't want a supreme court that ignores its own precedent, right?

     That is what Brown v. Board of Education did and none of us would complain about that. The judiciary and executive branches have different roles to fulfill and are not governed by the same rules.

So there you have it. That's the one thing you do when then the court is illegitimate. You treat it like its illegitimate.

     The judiciary operates in a slow and deliberative capacity, reacting to the situation on the ground. This creates a very different dynamic from the executive and legislative branches, which are more dynamic. If our leaders simply decide to ignore the courts when they want to, the judiciary will effectively stop existing as a check on the power of the other two branches, and with it any notion that the Constitution represents a meaningful check on the abuses of government.
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