🇳🇱 Politics and Elections in the Netherlands: General Election (Nov 22)
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  🇳🇱 Politics and Elections in the Netherlands: General Election (Nov 22)
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Author Topic: 🇳🇱 Politics and Elections in the Netherlands: General Election (Nov 22)  (Read 69831 times)
CumbrianLefty
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« Reply #1125 on: May 15, 2024, 11:30:23 AM »

I am still a bit surprised tbh that Wilders accepted not becoming the new PM as easily as he did.

At the very least, maybe it shows he can be more pragmatic than some have presumed on occasion.
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Storr
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« Reply #1126 on: May 15, 2024, 01:08:39 PM »

Would Plasterk be the first atheist Dutch PM?

"...he is an outspoken atheist. In 1997 he coined the term ietsisme ("somethingism") to refer to the religious belief that the Christian God does not exist, but that there is some greater force that created the universe and governs it. This position is roughly equivalent to 18th century Deism. He first strongly criticized the belief on intellectual grounds, calling it a "poor and irritating phenomenon", but later claimed that it was a mix of atheism and nostalgia, and much more sympathetic "than the idea of a cruel God that wants this misery"."
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jeron
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« Reply #1127 on: May 15, 2024, 01:35:16 PM »

I am still a bit surprised tbh that Wilders accepted not becoming the new PM as easily as he did.

At the very least, maybe it shows he can be more pragmatic than some have presumed on occasion.

He had to, otherwise there would've been no government
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jeron
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« Reply #1128 on: May 15, 2024, 01:42:12 PM »

Would Plasterk be the first atheist Dutch PM?

"...he is an outspoken atheist. In 1997 he coined the term ietsisme ("somethingism") to refer to the religious belief that the Christian God does not exist, but that there is some greater force that created the universe and governs it. This position is roughly equivalent to 18th century Deism. He first strongly criticized the belief on intellectual grounds, calling it a "poor and irritating phenomenon", but later claimed that it was a mix of atheism and nostalgia, and much more sympathetic "than the idea of a cruel God that wants this misery"."

There have been four prime ministers who were irreligious at the time they became PM. De Meester (1905-1908) was atheÔst. Drees and Den Uyl were brought up protestant but left the church and were agnostic apparently. I am not sure about Wim Kok. He was never religious but i don't know if he was actually an atheist
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Flyersfan232
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« Reply #1129 on: May 16, 2024, 06:00:58 AM »

Would Plasterk be the first atheist Dutch PM?

"...he is an outspoken atheist. In 1997 he coined the term ietsisme ("somethingism") to refer to the religious belief that the Christian God does not exist, but that there is some greater force that created the universe and governs it. This position is roughly equivalent to 18th century Deism. He first strongly criticized the belief on intellectual grounds, calling it a "poor and irritating phenomenon", but later claimed that it was a mix of atheism and nostalgia, and much more sympathetic "than the idea of a cruel God that wants this misery"."

There have been four prime ministers who were irreligious at the time they became PM. De Meester (1905-1908) was atheÔst. Drees and Den Uyl were brought up protestant but left the church and were agnostic apparently. I am not sure about Wim Kok. He was never religious but i don't know if he was actually an atheist
Wilders is a atheist himself i believe
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CumbrianLefty
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« Reply #1130 on: May 16, 2024, 10:22:11 AM »

I am still a bit surprised tbh that Wilders accepted not becoming the new PM as easily as he did.

At the very least, maybe it shows he can be more pragmatic than some have presumed on occasion.

He had to, otherwise there would've been no government

Well perhaps, but that doesn't really disprove my point does it Smiley
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Logical
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« Reply #1131 on: May 17, 2024, 09:51:28 AM »

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Logical
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« Reply #1132 on: May 20, 2024, 06:39:46 AM »

Plasterk has withdrawn his PM candidacy.
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LAKISYLVANIA
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« Reply #1133 on: May 21, 2024, 12:25:30 AM »

Plasterk has withdrawn his PM candidacy.

He has withdrawn because of accusations of forgery. He denies the accusations but withdraws his candidature because it makes it impossible / obstructive to do his job.
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CumbrianLefty
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« Reply #1134 on: May 21, 2024, 10:35:43 AM »
« Edited: May 21, 2024, 10:40:53 AM by CumbrianLefty »

He has other baggage too, thinking this could ever work was always highly optimistic. Was it mainly about trolling the PvdA at the end of the day?
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Flyersfan232
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« Reply #1135 on: May 23, 2024, 01:57:34 PM »

So when should the new pm option be announced?
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freek
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« Reply #1136 on: May 28, 2024, 09:32:24 AM »

So when should the new pm option be announced?
Today, apparently.

New designated PM is Dick Schoof. Currently the top civil servant in the ministry of Justice & Security, previously head of the AIVD (secret service), IND (immigration agency), and the national anti-terrorism coordinator.

Not a member of a political party at the moment, used to be a PvdA member in the past.
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Flyersfan232
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« Reply #1137 on: May 28, 2024, 04:09:27 PM »

So when should the new pm option be announced?
Today, apparently.

New designated PM is Dick Schoof. Currently the top civil servant in the ministry of Justice & Security, previously head of the AIVD (secret service), IND (immigration agency), and the national anti-terrorism coordinator.

Not a member of a political party at the moment, used to be a PvdA member in the past.
cool when should he be taking power?
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freek
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« Reply #1138 on: May 28, 2024, 07:39:55 PM »

So when should the new pm option be announced?
Today, apparently.

New designated PM is Dick Schoof. Currently the top civil servant in the ministry of Justice & Security, previously head of the AIVD (secret service), IND (immigration agency), and the national anti-terrorism coordinator.

Not a member of a political party at the moment, used to be a PvdA member in the past.
cool when should he be taking power?

Goal is June 26th.
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Zinneke
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« Reply #1139 on: May 29, 2024, 01:53:47 AM »

Not the worst choice, but kind of sad a country known for its respect for civil liberties will appoint a former spook who used the classic "nothing to fear, nothing to hide" arguments in the past if you ask me. Maybe D66 can actually go back to being a relevant voice on such matters if this government becomes one of the most authoritarian in terms of state reach in Dutch history. One can hope.
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Flyersfan232
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« Reply #1140 on: May 29, 2024, 11:41:09 AM »

Not the worst choice, but kind of sad a country known for its respect for civil liberties will appoint a former spook who used the classic "nothing to fear, nothing to hide" arguments in the past if you ask me. Maybe D66 can actually go back to being a relevant voice on such matters if this government becomes one of the most authoritarian in terms of state reach in Dutch history. One can hope.
wilders should be pm
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DavidB.
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« Reply #1141 on: June 11, 2024, 06:01:00 AM »

Wilders: it's finalized, there is an 'agreement about everything'.


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Flyersfan232
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« Reply #1142 on: June 12, 2024, 09:30:39 AM »

When will the government be sworn in?
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DavidB.
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« Reply #1143 on: June 12, 2024, 01:28:35 PM »
« Edited: June 12, 2024, 04:39:40 PM by DavidB. »

We almost have all the names now:

- Prime Minister: Dick Schoof. Former SG at the Ministry of Justice & Security, former head of Immigration Agency, former chief of two out of three Dutch intelligence agencies. Has a reputation of getting things done ó and is willing to go far to do so. Has an excellent working relationship with current PM Rutte, who he mentioned as a source of inspiration. 'Extraparliamentary', nominated by all four parties. Former PvdA member.

- First Deputy PM and Asylum and Migration Minister: Gidi Markuszower (PVV). Lawyer and long-term confidant to Geert Wilders. MP since 2017, spokesman on asylum and immigration. Tough as nails on immigration. Will take the PVV DNA to the TrÍves (ministerial) Hall ó at a new ministry.

- Second Deputy PM and Minister for Climate and Green Growth: Sophie Hermans (VVD). MP, parliamentary group leader of the VVD (2021-23) and former assistant to Mark Rutte. Shaky public image but lauded behind the scenes for being a competent deal maker. Will get a new ministry, presumably responsible for the second part of the current Economic Affairs & Climate Ministry and for the entire Nature and Nitrogen Ministry, last term's nightmare portfolio which cost fellow VVD loyalist Christianne van der Wal much of her popularity. Hermans, like Van der Wal, represents the more progressive/green side of the VVD, which will probably be the greenest party in this government.

- Third Deputy PM and Minister of Social Affairs: Eddy van Hijum (NSC). Closest confidant to Pieter Omtzigt, together with MP Nicolien van Vroonhoven. Long-serving CDA party soldier (11 years MP, 9 years provincial 'minister' in Overijssel) before his switch to Omtzigt's new party. Portfolio important to NSC.

- Fourth Deputy PM and Minister of Public Housing: Mona Keijzer (BBB). Former PM candidate for BBB; CDA MP and Deputy Minister (Economic Affairs) before - was fired from that last job by Rutte personally over her public criticism of the COVID restrictions. Vote magnet, but always neglected (i.e. never becoming Minister) at the CDA for not being part of the 'old boys network'. Then switched to BBB. Had probably hoped for the top job at Economic Affairs this time, but Public Housing will perhaps be an even more formidable and important task.

- Minister of Finance: Eelco Heinen (VVD). The VVD's financial specialist. MP, economist, former advisor at the Ministry of Finance and former VVD head of policy on financial affairs.

- Minister of Public Health: Fleur Agema (PVV). MP since 2006 and long-standing healthcare spokeswoman, often in sync with the SP and critical of too much free market influence in the healthcare system. Confidant to Wilders: #2 for the PVV in six subsequent general elections.

- Minister of Education and Science: Eppo Bruins. Scientist, PhD in physics. Head of the Advisory Council for Science, Technology and Innovation. 'Extraparliamentary' and nominated by NSC, but former ChristenUnie MP (2015-21) who was still on their EP list last week and helped write their manifesto. The ChristenUnie won't cancel his membership, but are not amused.

- Minister of Agriculture: Femke Wiersma (BBB). #2 on the 'OG' BBB list in 2021 when they first entered parliament, behind Van der Plas. Now provincial 'minister' of agriculture in Frisia.

- Minister of Economic Affairs: Dirk Beljaarts. 'Extraparliamentary', nominated by the PVV. Former head of the organization representing hotels, restaurants and bars. Critical voice during COVID lockdowns. Honorary consul for Hungary in the Netherlands.

- Minister of Defense: Ruben Brekelmans (VVD). Harvard graduate. MP since 2021 and immediately became one of the most visible VVD politicians. One of Ukraine's biggest friends in the Netherlands: Putinists will have a meltdown over this nomination. Apart from foreign affairs spokesman also covering the topic of asylum and immigration, on which he has been more on the right-wing side of the party (as opposed to Eric van der Burg). First MP to suggest opening the door to the PVV.

- Minister of Foreign Affairs: Caspar Veldkamp (NSC). Newly elected MP. Before that: Dutch top diplomat, ambassador in Greece and Israel.

- Minister of Justice and Security: David van Weel. 'Extraparliamentary', nominated by the VVD. Former member of the Dutch Royal Navy, former special advisor to PM Mark Rutte, current assistant to NATO SG Jens Stoltenberg.

- Minister for Foreign Trade and Development Cooperation: PVV. No name yet.

- Minister of Interior Affairs: NSC. No name yet.

- Minister of Infrastructure and Water Management: PVV. No name yet.

In addition, there will be 13 Deputy Ministers: for Justice & Security (PVV), Legal Protection (NSC), Kingdom Affairs and Digitalization (PVV), Recovery of Groningen [solving earthquake scandal] (BBB), Education (VVD), Tax and Customs Affairs (NSC), Benefits [solving the childcare benefit scandal] (NSC), Defense (BBB), Public Transportation and the Environment (PVV), Fisheries (BBB), Participation and Integration (VVD), Long-term Care (PVV), and Youth and Sports (VVD).

When will the government be sworn in?
By the end of the month.

For the first time, there will be parliamentary hearings for all candidate ministers (except for the candidate PM). However, this is expected to be largely symbolical as the Netherlands has negative parliamentarism: there is no investiture vote.

SP, CDA and SGP have already stated they will boycott the hearings: the SP think it is a 'circus' and CDA and SGP oppose this innovation for constitutional reasons, saying the government should always be assumed to have the confidence of the parliament until proven otherwise.
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Flyersfan232
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« Reply #1144 on: June 13, 2024, 03:12:37 AM »

We almost have all the names now:

- Prime Minister: Dick Schoof. Former SG at the Ministry of Justice & Security, former head of Immigration Agency, former chief of two out of three Dutch intelligence agencies. Has a reputation of getting things done ó and is willing to go far to do so. Has an excellent working relationship with current PM Rutte, who he mentioned as a source of inspiration. 'Extraparliamentary', nominated by all four parties. Former PvdA member.

- First Deputy PM and Asylum and Migration Minister: Gidi Markuszower (PVV). Lawyer and long-term confidant to Geert Wilders. MP since 2017, spokesman on asylum and immigration. Tough as nails on immigration. Will take the PVV DNA to the TrÍves (ministerial) Hall ó at a new ministry.

- Second Deputy PM and Minister for Climate and Green Growth: Sophie Hermans (VVD). MP, parliamentary group leader of the VVD (2021-23) and former assistant to Mark Rutte. Shaky public image but lauded behind the scenes for being a competent deal maker. Will get a new ministry, presumably responsible for the second part of the current Economic Affairs & Climate Ministry and for the entire Nature and Nitrogen Ministry, last term's nightmare portfolio which cost fellow VVD loyalist Christianne van der Wal much of her popularity. Hermans, like Van der Wal, represents the more progressive/green side of the VVD, which will probably be the greenest party in this government.

- Third Deputy PM and Minister of Social Affairs: Eddy van Hijum (NSC). Closest confidant to Pieter Omtzigt, together with MP Nicolien van Vroonhoven. Long-serving CDA party soldier (11 years MP, 9 years provincial 'minister' in Overijssel) before his switch to Omtzigt's new party. Portfolio important to NSC.

- Fourth Deputy PM and Minister of Public Housing: Mona Keijzer (BBB). Former PM candidate for BBB; CDA MP and Deputy Minister (Economic Affairs) before - was fired from that last job by Rutte personally over her public criticism of the COVID restrictions. Vote magnet, but always neglected (i.e. never becoming Minister) at the CDA for not being part of the 'old boys network'. Then switched to BBB. Had probably hoped for the top job at Economic Affairs this time, but Public Housing will perhaps be an even more formidable and important task.

- Minister of Finance: Eelco Heinen (VVD). The VVD's financial specialist. MP, economist, former advisor at the Ministry of Finance and former VVD head of policy on financial affairs.

- Minister of Public Health: Fleur Agema (PVV). MP since 2006 and long-standing healthcare spokeswoman, often in sync with the SP and critical of too much free market influence in the healthcare system. Confidant to Wilders: #2 for the PVV in six subsequent general elections.

- Minister of Education and Science: Eppo Bruins. Scientist, PhD in physics. Head of the Advisory Council for Science, Technology and Innovation. 'Extraparliamentary' and nominated by NSC, but former ChristenUnie MP (2015-21) who was still on their EP list last week and helped write their manifesto. The ChristenUnie won't cancel his membership, but are not amused.

- Minister of Agriculture: Femke Wiersma (BBB). #2 on the 'OG' BBB list in 2021 when they first entered parliament, behind Van der Plas. Now provincial 'minister' of agriculture in Frisia.

- Minister of Economic Affairs: Dirk Beljaarts. 'Extraparliamentary', nominated by the PVV. Former head of the organization representing hotels, restaurants and bars. Critical voice during COVID lockdowns. Honorary consul for Hungary in the Netherlands.

- Minister of Defense: Ruben Brekelmans (VVD). Harvard graduate. MP since 2021 and immediately became one of the most visible VVD politicians. One of Ukraine's biggest friends in the Netherlands: Putinists will have a meltdown over this nomination. Apart from foreign affairs spokesman also covering the topic of asylum and immigration, on which he has been more on the right-wing side of the party (as opposed to Eric van der Burg). First MP to suggest opening the door to the PVV.

- Minister of Foreign Affairs: Caspar Veldkamp (NSC). Newly elected MP. Before that: Dutch top diplomat, ambassador in Greece and Israel.

- Minister of Justice and Security: David van Weel. 'Extraparliamentary', nominated by the VVD. Former member of the Dutch Royal Navy, former special advisor to PM Mark Rutte, current assistant to NATO SG Jens Stoltenberg.

- Minister for Foreign Trade and Development Cooperation: PVV. No name yet.

- Minister of Interior Affairs: NSC. No name yet.

- Minister of Infrastructure and Water Management: PVV. No name yet.

In addition, there will be 13 Deputy Ministers: for Justice & Security (PVV), Legal Protection (NSC), Kingdom Affairs and Digitalization (PVV), Recovery of Groningen [solving earthquake scandal] (BBB), Education (VVD), Tax and Customs Affairs (NSC), Benefits [solving the childcare benefit scandal] (NSC), Defense (BBB), Public Transportation and the Environment (PVV), Fisheries (BBB), Participation and Integration (VVD), Long-term Care (PVV), and Youth and Sports (VVD).

When will the government be sworn in?
By the end of the month.

For the first time, there will be parliamentary hearings for all candidate ministers (except for the candidate PM). However, this is expected to be largely symbolical as the Netherlands has negative parliamentarism: there is no investiture vote.

SP, CDA and SGP have already stated they will boycott the hearings: the SP think it is a 'circus' and CDA and SGP oppose this innovation for constitutional reasons, saying the government should always be assumed to have the confidence of the parliament until proven otherwise.
what role would the party leaders have in Parliament?
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LAKISYLVANIA
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« Reply #1145 on: June 13, 2024, 12:12:53 PM »

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DavidB.
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« Reply #1146 on: June 14, 2024, 11:54:53 AM »
« Edited: June 14, 2024, 12:19:08 PM by DavidB. »

Following the intelligence services' research on Gidi Markuszower, Geert Wilders decided to retract his candidacy for the position of Minister of Asylum and Migration. Instead, he decided to nominate MP and former PVV leader in the Senate Marjolein Faber. Then, VVD leader YesilgŲz decided to express 'concerns' about Faber's past comments about immigration as well has her 'attitude' and 'tone', which prompted an emergency meeting with formateur Van Zwol and all four party leaders this afternoon. Faber has now tweeted that she expressed these comments as a member of the opposition, and that future comments of her will be in line with the coalition agreement and the parties' joint declaration on the rule of law.

- Minister for Foreign Trade and Development Cooperation: PVV. No name yet.

- Minister of Interior Affairs: NSC. No name yet.

- Minister of Infrastructure and Water Management: PVV. No name yet.
Reinette Klever (PVV) will be Minister of Foreign Trade and Development Cooperation. She is a former MP and current board member of right-wing public broadcaster Ongehoord Nederland. As an MP, Klever called for the abolishment of development aid.

Judith Uitermark (NSC) will be Minister of Interior Affairs and Kingdom Relations. Until she was elected to Parliament in November 2023, Uitermark served as a judge. From 2015 until 2022, she also served as national coordinator for the use of mediation in criminal court cases. She is one of the absolute experts that NSC has managed to find - at a ministry that is dear to NSC's heart. The Dutch Ministry of Interior Affairs has fewer competences than many of its counterparts in Europe (most security tasks, except for the oversight on the general intelligence services, are with Justice & Security), but Uitermark will have a number of intriguing tasks which all stem from Omtzigt's election manifesto. Some examples: a constitutional revision that would grant judges the right to declare laws unconstitutional, a change in the electoral system to introduce a regional component, and overseeing the re-introduction of the referendum. In the past, many ideas to change our political system were coined in coalition agreements but the vast majority never saw the daylight. It will be interesting to see whether Uitermark succeeds.

Barry Madlener (PVV) will be the Minister of Infrastructure and Water Management. He is one of the 'club of 9' that entered parliament for the PVV in 2006 already. From 2009 until 2012, he served as an MEP - and then returned to the Parliament, where he got re-elected in November. Madlener can gain popularity rather quickly by re-introducing the speed limit of 130 km/h by day, which was abolished in 2020 (now 100 km/h; at night it has remained 130 km/h). Another important task for him will be the maintenance/replacement of the many important bridges and tunnels that were constructed in the decades after WWII and are now in an increasingly bad state.
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Flyersfan232
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« Reply #1147 on: June 14, 2024, 02:35:54 PM »

Is the pvv still a private thingy with only wilders as member?
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Flyersfan232
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« Reply #1148 on: June 18, 2024, 07:29:26 AM »

Wiki shows schoof government will be sworn in on the 3rd of July. Is this true?
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Flyersfan232
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« Reply #1149 on: June 18, 2024, 05:12:39 PM »

Wiki shows schoof government will be sworn in on the 3rd of July. Is this true?
its confirmed for july second https://nltimes.nl/2024/06/17/new-dutch-cabinet-will-take-its-place-first-week-july
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