DOJ SUES TX OVER REDISTRICTING

[Xing]

How about we unanimously denounce all gerrymandering, and hold both parties to the same standard. Deal?

[lfromnj]

I mean this is basically the same thing as HW Bush suing dem states in the 90s to "limit gerrymandering" although it resulted in the ugliest districts the nation had ever seen. The differences are that the GOP states are at least willing to some degree to try for the lawsuits because it won't affect their coalition unlike Southern Democrats who needed the Black Democrats. In the end a lot of those Bush VRA districts were just not upheld by SCOTUS with the last 2 being NC12 and VA03. However by the time certain ones like in GA were thrown out the effect was done, the surrounding districts were all Republican  and Democrats no longer had an incumbency advantage

[Ron DeSantis enthusiast]

F**k Garland, I remember when media tried to portray him as a moderate but he is a partisan hack.

McConnell was right.

[David Hume]

Given the timeframe, it's too late for this to have any impact on the 2022 elections. The primary filing period ends next Monday and our primaries are in March.

Best case scenario would be some court-redrawn maps for 2024.

They are suing under VRA instead of Constitution, which means it will go through the normal process instead of three judge panel.

Since 5th circuit is the most conservative, D may lose there. Even they prevail, R will seek en banc and will win for sure. Then it's unlikely that SC will even agree to grant cert, unless they are ready to get the VRA in total.

There is no way to have a redraw before 2022, or even 2024. Ironically, if they force a redraw before 2026, it may be beneficial to R.

[David Hume]

I really want to witness cope on here when NC passes an 11-3, KY and TN get rid of the Yarmuth/Cooper sinks respectively, and when FL passes a 19-9 or a 20-8. It shall be utterly glorious.

I don't see 20-8 happening any time soon. Fair Districts Amendment makes it too costly for Rs to go for something that lopsided. And they know that.
If they pass a map in violation of that, then they end up with a court map. John Mica and Illeana-Ros Lehtinen ended up leaving Congress because of that redraw.
GOP Congressman don't want the risk of a court map that could disrupt their seats and leave them in danger in a primary or a general.

If I understand correctly, once the map struck down, the court will order the state legislature to redraw. They ended up a court map only because they did not finish before deadline.

Moreover, among the 4 judges that struck down the FL map last time, only one of them are still there. The 3 Dems retired and got replaced by Scott and DeSantis justices.

[Person Man]

Garland and the DOJ can and will get righteously screwed in court.

And if you support this bogus lawsuit but are fine with Illinois or Dem gerrymandering, f**k you and any opinions you may hold.

I’m not.

[pbrower2a]

Garland and the DOJ can get righteously screwed in court.

The maps suck and need to be redrawn. You cannot justify that Dallas configuration in any way. You just can't.

The maps need to be redrawn to be 27-11 in favor of Republicans. Make the RGV even redder and shore up Republican incumbents more.

Also you can justify the Dallas configuration, and my justification for it is that I don’t hear such sanctimonious whining about Illinois or other Democratic states.

It would be very difficult for Democrats to gerrymander Illinois except by establishing conical districts from Chicago deep into central and western Illinois. Outside Chicagoland, Illinois is heavily R. R stands for rural -- and Republican.

Texas went about 52-46 for Trump, or about 53-47 if you ignore the wasted votes. Splitting that among the population one could reasonably expect a map that has a House delegation split roughly 20-18 R.



The Presidential map looks much like a landslide for Trump... but know well that the impressive Atlas Blue territory that looks impressive is mostly thinly-populated. Sure, he did well in some small cities (Abilene, Amarillo, Galveston,  Lubbock, Midland, San Angelo, Odessa, Waco, and Wichita Falls... all of which Austin, Dallas, El Paso, Fort Worth, Houston, and San Antonio dwarf. So does the metropolitan area of rather small cities at the mouth of the Rio Grande.  Trump barely won counties that include Corpus Christi and Beaumont. Worse -- he barely broke even in the two large suburban counties (Denton and Collin) to the north of the Dallas-Fort Worth "Metroplex" that Republicans used to find easy to win.

Texas is becoming increasingly like a microcosm of America. It used to be much poorer, more rural, and less educated than the rest of the USA. That is over. Texas can attract well-educated people who despise the anti-intellectualism of Trump-like demagogues who deprecate formal learning. Figure that for many well-educated professionals, their intellectual identity is the core of how they see themselves.

Texas has two large minority groups: blacks and Mexican-Americans. Both vote heavily D, and even as they leave poverty behind, they don't go R. Let me tell you something about Mexican-Americans: they respect formal education about as much as Asian-Americans do, recognizing that formal education is one of the few reliable means out of poverty. The other is enterprise, typically small business. Blacks do not tend much to the Right as their economic conditions improve. Middle-class blacks care far more for poor blacks than do middle-class white care for poor whites.        

Texas has a vast rural area, but it is hemorrhaging voters due to the consolidation of small farms into giant estates (corporate farms). These areas will be hyper-reactionary until the farm workers become US citizens. Remember: dairies and slaughterhouses are practically industrial sweatshops that at some point will be easy to organize by labor unions.  

[lfromnj]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/doj-sues-texas-over-redistricting-saying-the-new-maps-discriminate/ar-AARx15S?ocid=BingNewsSearch

LOL,

"And in El Paso and West Texas, the State eliminated a Latino opportunity district entirely -- reducing the number of districts in which Latinos make up a citizen voting-age population majority from six to five -- by overpopulating and packing majority-Latino districts and under-populating nearby majority-Anglo districts."

El Paso growing at 5% compared to TX 15% is a VRA violation now.

[pbrower2a]

Remember: the Republican Party practically believes that political life should represent corporate wealth and bureaucratic power within for-profit corporations at the expense of everyone else.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

I really want to witness cope on here when NC passes an 11-3, KY and TN get rid of the Yarmuth/Cooper sinks respectively, and when FL passes a 19-9 or a 20-8. It shall be utterly glorious.

I don't see 20-8 happening any time soon. Fair Districts Amendment makes it too costly for Rs to go for something that lopsided. And they know that.
If they pass a map in violation of that, then they end up with a court map. John Mica and Illeana-Ros Lehtinen ended up leaving Congress because of that redraw.
GOP Congressman don't want the risk of a court map that could disrupt their seats and leave them in danger in a primary or a general.

If I understand correctly, once the map struck down, the court will order the state legislature to redraw. They ended up a court map only because they did not finish before deadline.

Moreover, among the 4 judges that struck down the FL map last time, only one of them are still there. The 3 Dems retired and got replaced by Scott and DeSantis justices.

True, that's a fair point - they only ended up with a court map because they didn't redistrict in time.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/doj-sues-texas-over-redistricting-saying-the-new-maps-discriminate/ar-AARx15S?ocid=BingNewsSearch

LOL,

"And in El Paso and West Texas, the State eliminated a Latino opportunity district entirely -- reducing the number of districts in which Latinos make up a citizen voting-age population majority from six to five -- by overpopulating and packing majority-Latino districts and under-populating nearby majority-Anglo districts."

El Paso growing at 5% compared to TX 15% is a VRA violation now.

If all you said is true, this is an extremely clownish lawsuit.

[Schiff for Senate]

Garland and the DOJ can and will get righteously screwed in court.

And if you support this bogus lawsuit but are fine with Illinois or Dem gerrymandering, f**k you and any opinions you may hold.

I oppose all gerrymandering. But you're blind, obvlious, a liar or all three if you can't see how the GOP is worse with gerrymandering than Democrats. Democrats literally proposed a bill that would end gerrymandering, and it was shot down by the GOP, because gerrymandering is pretty much the party's number one way of winning the majority in the House. The GOP did mych more gerrymandering in 2010 than Democrats did. Even when Democrats did have control over redistricting, they much more commonly than the GOP either drew fair maps or outright gave them to independent commissions. The GOP instituted such blatant gerrymanders that nonpartisan (or in some cases even right-leaning) courts shot them down (see FL, VA, PA, etcetra). After what happened in your own state you shouldn't be one to talk...the NCGOP first gerrymandered the state brutally, then when they were ordered by courts to redraw, they dragged their feet and came up with another gerrymander. The courts tried again, and begrudgingly, the legislature drew up some half-fair maps for the 2020 elections: which they prompty replaced with gerrymanders just one election cycle later. The legislature abused its power and repealed the governor's power to approve (or reject) their gerrymandered maps so they had absolute control. Now that they've gerrymandered the state legislative seats and stripped the governor of his power they will have a stranglehold on the legislature and redistricting. I hope you're happy, because if all this isn't anti-democracy, I don't know what isn't. As for TX, it gained 2 districts almost exclusively because of Hispanic growth...yet the number of Hispanic seats remained the same. While the IL gerrymander was also bad and indefensible, it at least increased minority representation while losing a seat. NC and southern states routinely pass racial gerrymanders. The point is, during the 2010 cycle, Democrats gerrymandered exactly one state (MD) while the GOP gerrymandered about a dozen. When Democrats tried to end gerrymandering altogether, the GOP refused. Now, finally, Democrats are fighting back and are hitting fire with fire after the GOP refused to douse the fire with water. To put it another way, Democrats have been punched a lot of times by the GOP in redistricting and only threw one punch back. They tried to stop the violence, but the GOP refused. Finally, the Democrats have lost patience and are throwing punches back. Hard. I oppose gerrymandering, but if it's got to happen (which the GOP seems to insist on), I'd rather both parties do it than the GOP having a monopoly on it. You aren't worth talking to if you genuinely believe that the GOP has been victimized in redistricting, or that Democrats are not by now 100% justified in the maps they've produced for IL and MD and will produce for NY. They've tried negotiation and ceasfire for very long; the GOP's declined, and now Democrats have opened fire. You can't shake hands with the closed fist of the GOP, so now Democrats are going to fight the GOP.

[lfromnj]

Garland and the DOJ can and will get righteously screwed in court.

And if you support this bogus lawsuit but are fine with Illinois or Dem gerrymandering, f**k you and any opinions you may hold.

. Even when Democrats did have control over redistricting, they much more commonly than the GOP either drew fair maps or outright gave them to independent commissions.

Other than Virginia where exactly did Democrats draw a fair map or gave it to an independent commission of their own free will when they had control over redistricting?

[Schiff for Senate]

How about we unanimously denounce all gerrymandering, and hold both parties to the same standard. Deal?

It's a deal Democrats have made multiple times, and something the GOP has rejected every time.

[Schiff for Senate]

Garland and the DOJ can and will get righteously screwed in court.

And if you support this bogus lawsuit but are fine with Illinois or Dem gerrymandering, f**k you and any opinions you may hold.

. Even when Democrats did have control over redistricting, they much more commonly than the GOP either drew fair maps or outright gave them to independent commissions.

Other than Virginia where exactly did Democrats draw a fair map or gave it to an independent commission of their own free will when they had control over redistricting?

In fairness they rarely voluntarily do independent commissions, but even when they draw the maps themselves, they are eiher completely gerrymandered or only slightly favour them. The only exception to that rule in 2010 was Maryland (and in all honesty, while that gerrymander was bad, they could've gone 8-0 if they wanted to).

[lfromnj]

Garland and the DOJ can and will get righteously screwed in court.

And if you support this bogus lawsuit but are fine with Illinois or Dem gerrymandering, f**k you and any opinions you may hold.

. Even when Democrats did have control over redistricting, they much more commonly than the GOP either drew fair maps or outright gave them to independent commissions.

Other than Virginia where exactly did Democrats draw a fair map or gave it to an independent commission of their own free will when they had control over redistricting?

In fairness they rarely voluntarily do independent commissions, but even when they draw the maps themselves, they are eiher completely gerrymandered or only slightly favour them. The only exception to that rule in 2010 was Maryland (and in all honesty, while that gerrymander was bad, they could've gone 8-0 if they wanted to).

Well lets see which Dem states drew maps in 2010 or 2020.

2010

IL/MD: I mean they went pretty damn far in their attempts

AR:  Ok these guys did mess up but at the same time they were a dying party and black/white issues existed.

WV: Ok perhaps they could have done something to shore up Rahall but WV Democrats once again are different. They already had a SCOTUS case which pushed the deviation anyway.

MA: 9-0.  The Worchester seat is definitely way more Dem than it needs to be but its mostly incumbent concerns.
2020

IL/MD once again ugly gerrymanders

OR: Clean gerrymander at 5-1

NY: likely a clean to ugly gerrymander depending on incumbent demands.

NV: A triple split of a core metro area. Not as egregious as going to Reno but there were likely a lot of internal issues there.

NM: going for a 2 D 1 Tossup but they don't have room for much else.

VA: The senate gave up control but most of the house didn't. 9 people did.

[Schiff for Senate]

I really want to witness cope on here when NC passes an 11-3, KY and TN get rid of the Yarmuth/Cooper sinks respectively, and when FL passes a 19-9 or a 20-8. It shall be utterly glorious.

And you have the nerve to say Democrats are the ones doing the gerrymandering.
Democrats aren't whining about the maps that have passed thus far; the only people struggling to cope are you with the 14-3 map in IL (and if that makes you upset, just wait for NY and MD!).
Moreover, NC passed its map a while ago. We know you're too busy to try and keep up with national news, but at least try to keep up with what goes on in your own state. Otherwise you just end up embarrassing yourself like you did right here.
Also, you do know what 'sink' means, right? Yarmuth's seat gave Biden 60%, making it closer than 4 of the 5 Republican seats in KY were (including the 5th, which gave Trump nearly 80%). It's just that Yarmuth is an electoral titan, something I'm sure you'd be unfamiliar with in your state unless you looked at your Democratic governor. As for TN, Cooper's seat also gave Biden just 60%, which is less than what all 7 Republican seats gave Trump. Try not posting words you don't know the meaning of in the future.

[MillennialModerate]

I really want to witness cope on here when NC passes an 11-3, KY and TN get rid of the Yarmuth/Cooper sinks respectively, and when FL passes a 19-9 or a 20-8. It shall be utterly glorious.

Sure. I mean when you can’t win an election by having good policies and ideas people support - just manipulate the system. Ammmiright?!